Post 1.1 Ilum PVP Issues Discussion

[Miltonium]

Rework the bases so they're tougher to capture.

 

Allow the usable guns to be on all the time... none of this you need yer base up and running silliness.

 

Add a couple more AI turrets in each base.

 

Lower the valor rewards.

[Nyliana]

Send moar whambulance!!!!!!!!!!! We need a response!!!!

 

Dev response/action please

[KhameirSarinn]

Right now its poking me in the eye

 

Thats what she said

[DontTouchMyHoHos]

Did this quickly, sorry for the mass grammatical errors.

 

I will type up a long post on the current issues at hand that need to be resolved. I can only speak from a low population server's perspective Assassins of Sion

 

1. You created a system that forces people to pvp when the ratio of numbers of imps to repub are vastly in favor of imps. PvP is based on equal numbers fighting each other. Hence the name player vs player. If you have faction vs faction. The same rules apply. There is roughly an equal number on both sides. You do not have this. Thus this concept fails.

 

2. It has now been roughly 3 hours and I am a lvl 50 Seer with no pvp match. At one point in time my server did not even have enough 50s to create a match. I bet the imps were playing hutball a lot ganing valor and getting commendations. If your going to allows this to happen, allow the factions to mix during hutball play if you can not get a faction vs faction wz going. The biggest solution to this is cross server queing. This also goes for flashpoints and heroics. Create a system that allows people to cross server que for these things.

 

3. Forcing people to fight in one area on low population servers now creates a problem with ilum itself. Everything else but that middle has now become worthless. All I want is those crates. If the imps come and out number me. I leave and return later. I had recently a 6v1 roll me so I left for them to do there thing since I didn't feel like gathering the 50s and a lot of them were busy. We only had 10 btw.

 

4. If we do get a big enough group and roll the imps out of mid we now have 5-10 people waiting to gather 3 boxes the spawn every 5 minutes or so. I now have to dedicate my entire time to standing there wasting 90% of my day farming a daily that takes all day preventing me from doing anything else if I want a pvp bag since I can not que for a WZ.

 

5. Admit you guys messed up would look very esteemed in the eyes of the people deciding the future of this game. You may have created it, but you have no say in weather this game succeeds or not. We do and we are pissed. Apologizing will go along way instead of feeding the community this market scheme bs like a fake stuck up politician that tries to avoid that they messed up when the whole world knows they messed up, by manipulating words to make it seem like it is something it is not.

 

6. PVP for 50s on low population servers. Change the bracket from 50s only to 40-50 only. Let 40s get expertise gear to. Or allow cross server que for all servers.

 

7. The population for illum could be a cross server potential solution and as others stated make it cap'd, turn them into big arenas with 150v150 cross server.

 

8. Allow people to to have free transfer of their toons from empire to republic to balance things out? Put a level cap so not everyone can transfer and over balance it. Show the caps and how many there are so guilds can do entire transfers. Make sure all gear and items are changed and if they want to change to light side. Change gear accordingly. Allow low pop servers to change to medium pop servers free for awhile. As always show the amount on each side and put a cap so as not to over populate one side.

 

9. Allowing imps to spawn camp the only place you can spawn preventing you from going any were. Solution? Lock out a spawn area were the republic can group up. League of Legends has this neat turret that does A LOT of damage to the enemy for entering the spawn area. If a player is weak in there, they can get a kill, but will die in the process.

 

10. Ilum is a little to big, no?

 

11. You did not put effort into making ilum at all and it shows. The mech units do nothing. They sit there and shoot at each other doing nothing. Very very boring. The base has no purpose and the two turrets seem like the most odd out of place thing to have to begin with. Allow us to use those huge cannons? That would stop the imps from spawn camping. Make it less pvp and more battlegrounds. Mix everything together, vehicles, rockets, machine gun turrets, flying vehicles. Small space ships. If your going to make a huge arena, give me EVERYTHING to fight with. Give me a battlefield and the toys to destroy it.

 

12. Announcing a players presence does nothing if your out numbered. If someone announced I am in the middle trying to get a daily and the imps see this. I am a small group in an unbalanced population server. I will not get rolled by the imps looking to do dailies and gain valor. Remove this please.

 

13. This is a personal issue. Healers gain nothing. We get nothing for healing and gain no objective towards our dailies for healing. We have to compete for boxes and when the battle comes we have to ignore the kills to heal so we gain nothing from that. Solution. Allow the objectives to be shared for OPS group and parties. I don't mind that it might take long, but on high population servers when you have 40 people 100 people trying to farm the boxes, you have to wait for 3,000 boxes in one day to spawn for 100 people and that is if you can hold the center or even leave your base to get there. If your don't farm straight boxes you have to fight with 100 people for the kill blow. Allow assists to count as kills, healing counts for assists and allow the objectives for the crates to be shared. The best solution, think of something else. There was no thought of this. I didn't pay 70$ for the deluxe edition and 15$ a month to go to a forum to tell you how to create a game. I paid expecting you to know how. I don't have the time to create some grand scheme design on how you should do your job. You have thousands of people posting here everyday giving you tips here and there. Listen for once. There is trolls and there is truth, figure out who is right and who isn't. Not hard.

 

14. For pvp balance char wise for ilum. Having arenas is actual a very good idea in order to learn how balanced characters are. Sole reason behind this is the very competitive players that know how to play their toon and do it very well can offer you the best feedback on how to change the toon. This allows you diret feedback from people who know what they are doing. You thus can now never again listen to trolls who have no idea how to create teamwork and do not know how to play their own toon. You can no go to the #1 ranked team on both factions and say hey. What do you guys believe is needed to make it more balanced and you will get constructive positive feedback skipping ALL the bs in the world. When people play competitively they want it to be fair. For the most part. Unless a team exploited to the top. Exploit in our world that you can not see is a feature that is over powered and used to gain every advantage. It is not a bug or a glitch. This is the gamers world. You can exploit a bug or a glitch, but the term exploit now a days does not refer to an actual bug or glitch unless it specifically states that, that is what is happening.

 

15. Ilum - LVL 50 only. Atl Farming? Problem solved

 

16. Valor gained from this issue. It isn't a potential issue BW it is an issue you guys created. Solution? Rollback.

 

17. Creating pvp based on skill not gear works. Prevents needlessly farming.

 

Anything else I missed or did not accurately portray in this post, please someone sensibly correct me.

 

P.S. First step is admitting you wronged us.

 

Step 2. Fire the guy who made the choice to go with this abomination. I don't get second chances at my job for doing something this bad. Keeping him there allows the problem to continue because there is zero lack of understanding.

 

I played competitively for the xbox 360 on call of duty 4 and held the #1 spot I believe season 2 on GB Big Time Gaming. Other teams Perpetual Ownage top 10 before MLG came out.

 

Biggest issue in pvp is and always will be numbers. You have two teams of equal skill and when you lack in numbers, no amount of skill can change that. We played 4v4, 3v4 you lose every time when you play top 10 teams. Only on super rare occasions do you ever win. Super rare. You can't beat numbers with equal skill. Second is teamwork. If you have the numbers communication for teamwork is the hardest thing to conduct and we only have 4 people to do it with. You have a huge issue to overcome when you start hitting 100 people that are not even part of the same community and the only way to communicate is through chat. Try doing that mid combat while fighting. No go.

 

Good Ideas-

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=194773 -hoilandms

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=194441 - StingerSplah

(Will save a lot of canceled subs)

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=194901 - MrIrrelevant

 

Originally Posted by Almghty_gir

possible solutions:

 

remove expertise as of right now. bring all servers down for one hour, remove it from the game until you can find a better use for it.

whilst the servers are down, rollback all valor on all servers gained after 2am (when the servers went down for maintenance).

remove valor from everything except player kills.

add a scaling valor bonus for underdog factions, it should be additive, and cap at 400% bonus for being outnumbered by 4:1 or greater, and start at 25% bonus for being outnumbered by 1.25:1, this should apply to ilum only.

on pvp servers, remove the ability to roll characters on both factions. if a player has characters on both factions already they must delete one faction before being allowed to log into the game.

add a +100% valor bonus (additive) to the underdog faction on any server.

 

 

this should give underdog players a sufficient incentive (valor wise) to stay in the fight and keep playing, with a total of 900% valor bonus if they are:

 

out numbered on their server

out numbered by 4:1 or greater in ilum

control all of the ilum objectives

 

 

hopefully this won't get lost in the firestorm that is this thread...

 

Some more good ideas.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uT90...=youtu.be&hd=1 (A server that didn't seem unbalanced in population!) - lordsatoh

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=195133 -jordanph

 

1. Valor should be gained from PvP anywhere, on any planet, provided the toon being killed is within a few levels of the killer. Please give us a reason to engage enemies in the open world, not just on Ilum.

 

2. Gear should not be the primary reward for Valor levels or PvP gains. The rewards should be more like Realm abilities (read the DAoC handbook) and the levels should be gained very slowly, over a long period of time, not farmable within weeks.

 

3. Med centers and zone-in areas should never be accessible by enemy players.

 

4. Mechanics must be put in place to combat server imbalance issues, whether it be bolstering stats, adding companion armies to aid the underpopulated factions, bigger valor gains for underpopulated factions, or putting queues in that keep the sides somewhat balanced on Ilum. Give the underpopulated faction additional abilities when they are down in numbers, like massive AoE CC and additional run speed. There are many ways to fix.

 

Why do MMO companies fail so hard on open world pvp (Blizzard included), when there are games in the past that did it so well? -Vervayne

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=194040 -Clyric (Result of 50s bracket)

[JadedWarbeast]

This is the most disgusting over site I've seen in a very long time. For a game with over 1 MILLION HOURS OF TESTING it feels less polished than RIFT was. I'd like to say I'm waiting to see the fix but honestly I unsubbed back when i realized there were hundreds of complaints about Darth Jadus being bugged at the end of Chapter 1 for IA IOps and it made it into release. Seeing this I can't justify paying these people while they learn how to make a an online game. This game had a lot to live up to from it's predecessor and fell very well short. BioWare is new to the computer mmo community and hopefully it learns from this. as for EA this is just an embarrassing black eye for them.

[Chesterinex]

This thread has only been open for an hour and is well past 100 posts.

 

1. Shutdown servers

2. Rollback accounts to pre1.1 patch

3. Lockout Ilum until a solution is made and patched

4. FIRE whoever was responsible for allowing this to make it to the live servers

[Lhorian]

I learned something today.

 

HeroEngine is not optimized for MMOs, where, you know, more than 15 people are on-screen at a time.

 

Quite aside from "never play the underdog side again".

 

No kidding. Have a Sentinel and Smuggler alt I was working on. Think I'll just make some Imp alts and start playing those.

[ImWaldo]

Reset all valor gathered today, a big sacrifice for the one's that have not done any grinding but it's for the greater good.

 

Then give ALL players a free month playtime, then you will save your face atleast.

Edited January 18, 2012 by ImWaldo

[SamuraiPumpkin]

The devs are completly blind.

 

Anybody with half a brain saw this coming since it was announced.

 

You only made a bad situation far far worse.

 

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

[Akabeth]

We're currently investigating potential issues related to the Ilum open world PVP area post 1.1.

 

Play and slay from both sides (or at least one side) of the fence at Ilum, and most of the issues will be self evident -- if they weren't already obvious from the videos and complaints posted since earlier today.

 

The bigger issue is if anyone with a real say in the dev team actually understands what PvP is all about.

Edited January 18, 2012 by Akabeth

[Twolow]

Watch the zerg live http://www.livestream.com/qualia

[DarthBloodloss]

thats what she said

 

hey-oooooooooooooooooo

[monjiay]

http://www.livestream.com/qualia

 

Guy is streaming Ilum. Probably got buried this is moving so fast.

 

Great stream.

[Beakertanks]

the rollback of the valor points will have no effect on level and pve progress! and why rollback, you could even the valor of all players ? make it even and everyone is happy.

 

Battlemaster for EVERYONE!!!

 

Poop. Just wanted to say it again.

[GutPunch]

Hey Bioware you might have wanted to delay for a couple more days to run this through QC a several more times. Something this big should have been obvious.

[Flaashheart]

Before today it was :

 

This is NGE all over again !

 

Henceforth, in future MMO's, it will be known as :

 

Oh no ! looks like they dropped an Ilum !

[HanoverFist]

Here is a live stream of Illum right now. I'm not a PvP guy but this is just super silly to allow to continue.

[Seattlite]

This thread has achieved terminal velocity.

 

At this rate, it will start bending time and space shortly.

[Dogfatherxx]

I am not sure what the issue is.? From all the videos I have seen, Ilum is a masterstroke. The spawn camping is just doctored video. There is no way that BW would let something like that happen. I am 100 percent positive that if they discovered that they made a mistake, they would do the right thing and revert all Valor to yesterday's levels. I mean, they are smart people after all and I can not imagine them alienating their customers yet again. After all, they put in the 50s bracket and that alone completely fixed WZs didn't it?

[moochtmp]

roll back vallor gained in ilum if you can if you cant then just do a roll back for before the patch and disabule the patch untell you can fix it

[Nyliana]

This thread has achieved terminal velocity.

 

At this rate, it will start bending time and space shortly.

 

Dev response/action please

[SinRMcSinR]

Then give ALL players a free month playtime, then you will save your face atleast.

 

Sounds good, another month that I don't have to pay for might make me reconsider my thought to unsub... especially since I havent logged in for about a week

[TehIdiot]

This is not what I thought Illum was going to be like :I

 

True I was hoping for Halaa. Not wintersgrasp.

[vrgadin]

I don't even know what to say to people compairing this to NGE, other than "You didn't experience NGE".

 

its liike the NGE because its a massive failure, just like most of ur posts

[ChristopherXen]

I think the pvp on ilum, should be set back to the way it was until its rethought.

 

However, there's nothing to ban for really, when you log in to your pvp server, it clearly states, "THIS IS A PVP SERVER DONT COMPLAIN", that simple really.

 

Warzones and classes do need to be reworked as well. Not only on the Imp side.

 

Scoundrels/melee operatives need to be nerfed.

 

Consulars were spared the same nerf sorcs wer back in beta. They need a nerf.

 

I mean we can go on. Alot of Reps like to call this an exploit. But lets look at the warzone expoits inwhich reps glitch out and set the bomb on voidstar before the match even starts. Or glitching past the door and setting the bomb on the other side.

 

To be quiet honest this is karma, and while I disagree with camping the taxi points and spawns for dailies and valor farming, Im not shedding a tear, and to be quite frank, like on other planets, imps over running a base is a valid tactic that overcomes game mechanics legitimately in a pvp environment.

 

What can be done to keep this system?

 

Increase the amount of turrets on both sides and position them near the taxi points and med centers.

 

Create multiple required objectives. That allow neither side to get the upper hand with such totality.

 

There does need to be less huttball. There should be more warzones, but that takes time. In the mean time you can have voidstar and civil war with Imperial on Imperial, just make one side loyal to the emperor and another side loyal to Malgus or something.