Gunryu Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 AS mentioned previously, this is not WOW. This is a system many other MMO's use and they consider these full classes. You are wrong. Wrong, EQ and Rift and many others even call them subclasses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEberon Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 So you want people to be miserable leveling the same class with the same story just because they found at level 30 the AC they picked sucked? I am going on a hunch and going to say you don't own a business, because in business the name of the game is keep customers happy not miserable. Nobody wants you to be miserable. Luckily they allow you to have more than one character so you dont have to be trapped playing something you dont like. This business is a game and games have to have rules to be fun. The rules by themselves often dont seem fun in games but they are none the less necissary to the enjoyment of the game as a whole. This rule may seem arbitrary to you and may seem to be getting in the way of your fun, but rules like this help many others to have fun. Bioware has so far chosen to keep this decision important and this preserve the fun of many of their gamers. They may decide at some point that your fun is more important than theirs. I promise you that if they choose to sand their ground or make this change many of their customers will be miserable over it either way. Personaly I hope they keep it the same. Lots of games cave on stuff like this. I like the idea that my choices have meaning. I wish there were more such choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photometrik Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Actually they are NOT entirely new classes all they did was take 1 class and gave them their own talent trees for each spec, if they were entirely new classes they would have their own selection from the character creation screen and have their own story. That is like saying a Marksman Hunter in WoW is it's own class, it is not. No, that's not completely true. For instance, a Jedi Sage doesn't play like a Jedi Shadow. You have some of the same abilities, but that's about it. Your comparison using Marksmen Hunters is also not entirely true. Take, for instance, WoW Warriors versus TOR Vanguards. Protection Warriors are equivalent to Shield Specialist Vanguards. Arms Warriors would have an equivalent in Assault Specialist Vanguards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunzo Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 It takes like one hour to get to lvl 10 and choose a new advanced class, roll a new character and star enjoying it, learning it. Advanced classes are SWTOR's way of naming classes like we know them in other games, and you don't ask for class change in those games don't you? Well some people are allways asking for such things because they want the game to be everything they dream/ask for, and that's not possible. The game has 8 different classes, deal with it, you want a new class in any other game, you roll that new class...it's the same here but with a different and more subtle name. Oh cool, except I'm not level 10. I'm level 45, and I don't play 15 hours a day and can simply re-roll my entire toon. The game has 4 classes each with 2 sub classes. Sub classes have no effect on your story or anything except your usefulness/play style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alarkin Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Advanced classes are SUBCLASSES of ONE CLASS. AND STOP SAYING DRUID TO WARRIOR IT MAKES NO SENSE LOLLLL They are not sub classes. They are two classes that share similar abilities. You cannot (well you could, but shouldn't) level past 10 as an inquisitor. You choose between Sorcerer and Assassin, which are two completely separate classes with completely separate play styles that happen to share inquisitor abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunzo Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 No, that's not completely true. For instance, a Jedi Sage doesn't play like a Jedi Shadow. You have some of the same abilities, but that's about it. Your comparison using Marksmen Hunters is also not entirely true. Take, for instance, WoW Warriors versus TOR Vanguards. Protection Warriors are equivalent to Shield Specialist Vanguards. Arms Warriors would have an equivalent in Assault Specialist Vanguards. Wrong. You seem to justify "play style" as a completely different story, experience, whatever. This is the same as saying playing as Jedi Guardian DPS is completely different then Jedi Guardian Tank. So by your rationale, nobody should ever be allowed to respec "play style" because... why? Do we not have the choice in life to be whatever we want and change our lifestyles? Theres no justification for having that restriction in sub classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 No, that's not completely true. For instance, a Jedi Sage doesn't play like a Jedi Shadow. You have some of the same abilities, but that's about it. Your comparison using Marksmen Hunters is also not entirely true. Take, for instance, WoW Warriors versus TOR Vanguards. Protection Warriors are equivalent to Shield Specialist Vanguards. Arms Warriors would have an equivalent in Assault Specialist Vanguards. If they were different classes in this game they would have a different story because as Bioware stated "Each class has it's own individual story" so NO they are not different classes they are different SPECS of the same class with Subclasses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salzwasser Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alarkin Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Wrong. You seem to justify "play style" as a completely different story, experience, whatever. This is the same as saying playing as Jedi Guardian DPS is completely different then Jedi Guardian Tank. So by your rationale, nobody should ever be allowed to respec "play style" because... why? Do we not have the choice in life to be whatever we want and change our lifestyles? Theres no justification for having that restriction in sub classes. Ok i've found your problem. You seem to think that they are sub-classes. Once you stop thinking that, you'll understand why there won't be AC changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunzo Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 They are not sub classes. They are two classes that share similar abilities. You cannot (well you could, but shouldn't) level past 10 as an inquisitor. You choose between Sorcerer and Assassin, which are two completely separate classes with completely separate play styles that happen to share inquisitor abilities. No, they are subclasses of one class. What you just described is the definition of a subclass. You learn defined abilities of that subclass, while still learning shared abilities of the overall class. They are not "completely separate classes", if they were, they would have separate class storylines. GET OUT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanzaiChigau Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) No they have 4 classes and the rest are subclasses. But yet this game has 8 classes as you know them from other games, since they play totally different: Guardian, sentinel, sage, shadow, gunslinger, scoundrel, vanguard and commando, and then the other 8 which are from the other faction and (almost) totally mirrored. It doesn't matter how you call them, they are classes (like warrior, rogue, etc, from WoW). You won't be allowed to play several classes with the same character, at least while the developers keep their sanity, since it would be ridiculously stupid and would lead to people getting bored of everything too fast, among other things. Edited January 13, 2012 by BanzaiChigau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunzo Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 Ok i've found your problem. You seem to think that they are sub-classes. Once you stop thinking that, you'll understand why there won't be AC changes. You fail to understand what a sub-class is, that's okay. When you realize this, you'll understand how to educate yourself in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHeadCapper Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 You fail to understand what a sub-class is, that's okay. When you realize this, you'll understand how to educate yourself in the future. Never played anything but wow huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wotch Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 In one word, no. You are directed to pick between two options and then given three options within your choice to fiddle with. Have two characters from each choice, makes the game fun and interesting as you level two and see how they come to differ. Play the game, don't nitpick it. Why should I have to go through the same overall story twice? Don't give me some BS about going Lightside or Darkside on different characters, it is still the same story with some slightly different responses from characters. I think every player should have 2 tokens to use for the AC respec and be granted one for every class redesign done in the future, but no player can hold more than 3 tokens. Each token has a 2 week CD (debatable on the CD time). I have abandoned my Vanguard at level 29 due to the fact that he is the most boring class I have played so far in any MMO due to absurdly slow feeling combat and the fact that it is 100% a melee class and not a ranged tank as was promised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 But yet this game has 8 classes as you know them from other games, since they play totally different: Guardian, sentinel, sage, shadow, gunslinger, scoundrel, vanguard and commando, and then the other 8 which are from the other faction. It doesn't matter how you call them, they are classes (like warrior, rogue, etc, from WoW). You won't be allowed to play several classes with the same character, at least while the developers keep their sanity, since it would be ridiculously stupid and would lead to people getting vored of everything too fast, among other things. Watch the video on the page before, Bioware even said "Where you specialize your class" So no, they are not different classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photometrik Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 If they were different classes in this game they would have a different story because as Bioware stated "Each class has it's own individual story" so NO they are not different classes they are different SPECS of the same class with Subclasses. I think the problem here is that you are both arguing semantics between "class" and "subclass" without looking at how each "subclass" functions like a "class" in every other major MMO out there today. Each "subclass" has the same variety of specialization in skill trees as WoW does in talent trees. Since you decided to mention WoW as an example (with the whole Marksman Hunter thing), then by WoW's standards and example each Advanced Class IS their own class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdell Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Okay, if they're so different then give them separate story lines. OH wait, the story doesn't care what their AC is? Get out! can you prove that? from a programming standpoint, i assume you are locked into your AC solely because the class questing is different depending on your choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I think the problem here is that you are both arguing semantics between "class" and "subclass" without looking at how each "subclass" functions like a "class" in every other major MMO out there today. Each "subclass" has the same variety of specialization in skill trees as WoW does in talent trees. Since you decided to mention WoW as an example (with the whole Marksman Hunter thing), then by WoW's standards and example each Advanced Class IS their own class. See my post above about the video on the previous page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaGicBush Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) No and Bioware has stated this will never happen, and it never has happened in any other MMO in existence(besides skill-based MMO's, go play one of those like DF or UO) so why change it now? Why even post something as ridiculous as this lmao? Edited January 13, 2012 by MaGicBush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkeBohm Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Bioware, Please allow Advanced Class Respec. There's no reason for this, give players the choice! If you're worried it will hurt your story or something - don't. You don't seem to care you send Jedi to go slaughter hundreds of Sand People, so why care about something that is needlessly restricting players? Thanks! Thank you so much for this post. I 100% agree that you should be able to switch. I don't care if it is supposedly going to change the story a bit. Bioware really doesn't care about choices mattering in this game. So why should we be stuck in an advanced class without being able to try another. It just completely stupid not to be able to switch ACs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunzo Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 Never played anything but wow huh? Actually, I have. And wow doesn't have subclasses, they have 3 trees of 1 class. And separate classes all together. This game as 4 classes with 2 subclasses of each class. Hence, one storyline per class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salzwasser Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 No and Bioware has stated this will never happen Sorry to repeat myself: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alarkin Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 No, they are subclasses of one class. What you just described is the definition of a subclass. You learn defined abilities of that subclass, while still learning shared abilities of the overall class. They are not "completely separate classes", if they were, they would have separate class storylines. GET OUT! Name me one other game where playing a different class provides a 100% unique experience. Go ahead...I'll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtmach Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I agree with no. You should have to commit to SOMETHING in this game. I was impressed with AC being so final. Leveling back to 10 is not a big deal at all if you regret it. I made my choices after watching a few videos and asking around along with reading the text the game provided. I'd understand if you chose your AC at like 30. But at level 10 it's not a big deal so it should remain as is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kourage Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 for 10 million credits and 1 time only.... maybe in a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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