Dual Wield Mastery

[Extinction]

I'm currently ani spec and I don't have any 2nd tier carnage talents. I'm 2-3-2 carnage w/ the rest in rage and it doesn't seem to be lacking anywhere. What is it you feel is mandatory and why?

 

I was also wondering what at second tier carnage is mandatory for anni? Granted I do have enraged charge from tier 2 carnage but I don't feel it's mandatory.

[Axcys]

I doubt that the 6% crit bonus from malice suffers from any sort of DR, being that it is a % bonus.

 

Ill explain this with base numbers for simplicity. lets say you just have base surge (50%) 100 damage and 0 crit. 100 damage a swing on average. you gain 1% crit. Your average damage on a swing will be 100.5 which is a .5% increase in damage. Now lets say you have 99% crit. your average damage on a swing will be 149.5. Add 1% crit and your average damage goes to 150. That, my friend, is a damage increase of .3%. Its mathematical DR. Crit gain is not on a liner scale.

 

So one more time, trust me, You would not gain a whole lot from that 6% crit if you already have 45% crit on your dots (which you should have that or more at 50)

 

Do your math. stop guessing.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Axcys

[Axcys]

Also as your surge increases, it increases the % damage increase but makes them decline more rapidly making more crit even less useful. Edited January 14, 2012 by Axcys

[Sayc]

But a 1% crit gain at 0% crit and 99% crit is still a .5 damage increase on average, so you gain the same benefit. we can play funny math/word games like that if you want, but its really pointless.

 

I thought you meant DR from stacking the crit stat(like on gear) beyond 30%. Which % bonuses aren't affected by.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Sayc

[Axcys]

But a 1% crit gain at 0% crit and 99% crit is still a .5 damage increase on average, so you gain the same benefit. we can play funny math/word games like that if you want, but its really pointless.

 

I thought you meant DR from stacking the crit stat(like on gear) beyond 30%. Which % bonuses aren't affected by.

 

 

because 1 dollar is just as useful to someone who has 0 as it is to someone who has 1000. Thats fine though if you want to ignore facts and take a poor damage increase in favor of dieing to aoe and being less useful then other classes in any practical setting. Not my problem.

[Sayc]

This is what I said about playing word games. You're also ignoring the "fact" that a .5 increase is equal to a .5 increase.

 

Thanks for putting words in my mouth, too.

 

Chill out on the hostility, read my post again, and maybe lose the arrogance, please.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Sayc

[Pappus]

because 1 dollar is just as useful to someone who has 0 as it is to someone who has 1000. Thats fine though if you want to ignore facts and take a poor damage increase in favor of dieing to aoe and being less useful then other classes in any practical setting. Not my problem.

 

Instead of taking the extremes you should pick realistic values @ around 75% surge.

 

like 35% crit 38%,then 41% let's see:

126,25->128,5->130,75

 

At this rate there is still no DR, even that miniscule mathematical one you mentioned, on crit.

[Elear]

Ill explain this with base numbers for simplicity. lets say you just have base surge (50%) 100 damage and 0 crit. 100 damage a swing on average. you gain 1% crit. Your average damage on a swing will be 100.5 which is a .5% increase in damage. Now lets say you have 99% crit. your average damage on a swing will be 149.5. Add 1% crit and your average damage goes to 150. That, my friend, is a damage increase of .3%. Its mathematical DR. Crit gain is not on a liner scale.

 

Way you described it everything has mathematical DR, since no gain is linear. You've got 10 bonus damage? Take 10 more, you'll fouble your damage. You've got 1000? Then it's only 1% increase, better get worse gear so upgrades give you more.

 

 

Yes, your logic is flawed.

[Axcys]

I'm talking about % damage increase not the raw number.

 

increase/average before increase = % damage increase

 

The raw number means absolutely nothing when you are talking about the benefit of that stat over another. For example DW mastery (what the thread was originally about) The % damage increase from that talent vastly out weights a less than 3% increase in damage. Thats the main point here.

[Axcys]

Way you described it everything has mathematical DR, since no gain is linear. You've got 10 bonus damage? Take 10 more, you'll fouble your damage. You've got 1000? Then it's only 1% increase, better get worse gear so upgrades give you more.

 

 

Yes, your logic is flawed.

 

Thats not the point. The point is you should take your damage increase somewhere else where you have to spend less stat budget for a higher gain. And yes everything has mathematical DR meaning that once you reach a point of saturation you need to move on to another stat that will be easier to squeeze damage out of. In this case its 36% offhand damage vs 6% bleed crit.

[Sayc]

The % damage increase from that talent vastly out weights a less than 3% increase in damage. Thats the main point here.

 

Actually, I believe you were arguing that defensive roll or narrowed hatred are better than malice(this thread got derailed from the OP pretty quickly).

 

 

I find the rest of the posts in here rather amusing.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Sayc

[Axcys]

Your right, i forgot to mention that. In any case, ill make it a blanket statement then. I believe ,as an anni spec, you will benefit a much larger amount by going up the carnage tree then going up the rage tree.