Biggest reason why cross-server PvP is not a good idea

[sanctimonia]

Do you group with these players when in flashpoints? I'm guessing you don't.

Isn't it nice to know who the AFK'ers are so that you can avoid these people in the future?

 

Also are you saying I couldnt avoid them in xserver WZs?

[ZeusThunder]

i have no idea where you are getting your definition of casual. No where does it say that a casual player prefers playing over winning. even the casuals of WoW enjoy at the end of the day saying "i killed Deathwing", but that doesn't mean they don't want the loot.

 

In fact, last I checked, winning = fun. not winning is not fun. being farmed by a full guild group in the highest level pvp gear while you are playing against randoms is even less fun. cross-server pvp means a more even spread, more balance, a larger pool to choose from. you'll lose some, and you'll win some.

 

in all honesty, this has less to do with queue times (which are somewhat short on most realms thanks to Huttball) and more to do with playstyle. is making groups and communities focused on PvP fun and exciting? Of course it is. Should I be unable to queue at 3am by myself when I want to get a few PvP games but there aren't enough players on the realm to actually create a match?

 

- So what you're saying is a casual player is someone who wants the same rewards as the hardcore player but with less effort? This isn't my definition of a casual player at all.

- Cross server PvP does NOT equal balance. Horde wins the majority of PvP matches in WoW. It is not balanced at all.

- I find it very odd there is a server out there where everyone stops playing PvP at 3am. That isn't the case on my server at least.

[Mystprime]

Here's a concept: stop sucking

 

Here's another concept: stop promoting something that can have severe negative consequences on the entire game because you can't either 1. hack it as a PvPer or 2. suck it up and accept that sometimes you will lose

 

Here is a concept: I am not my entire team.

 

Either side, there are negatives so uh, maybe think about that Sir Derp.

[Valishin]

So far all the cons for cross server queues hav eto do with talking to people from your server. I'm still waiting for some actually reason that having faster queues times with a larger pool of players from multiple servers has anything to do with making a player play better. The only thing that will ever influence someone's ability to play the objectives with their team mates is a stat tracking database. Everything else is just noise.

 

 

You are assuming that everyone is playing for the same reason you are. I think the resistance to the request for damage calculators illustrates that this is simply not the case. What is happening here is the same thing that is happening in this discussion you have two distinctly different views of what the game should be coming into conflict. On one side you have the MMOs are about community crowd on the other side you have the MMOs are about competition crowd. Personally I see both sides, but frankly the majority of the 12 year olds and ***holes gravitate toward the second group so that turns me off from supporting anything they want.

 

In a nut shell you are seeing resistance because there is a significant portion of the population who wants this to be a community focused game with a casual feel not second job like raiding in EQ1 or a pee pee contest that WoW has become. Imagine playing in PvP without ever looking up your stats or those of anyone else. Imagine not having a board that maintained and displayed player stats and accomplishments. Where your bragging rights come as party of community participation in game. Caring about your reputation from how you played not how well you played. I would dare say, what they are looking for is something akin to DAOC pre-expansions or Vanilla WoW just with more class balance between the sides since both of those had balance problems. Also, on top of that they don't want to bring back the elitist cliques from EQ1 and the neccessity of the "perfect group."

 

 

Now my position on this specific issue is that I would ok with CS, so long they exclude the RP servers or even better only CS to same type servers. So PVP to PVP, PVE to PVE, and RP to RP.

[AngryBuddhist]

Such as?

 

Merging servers or opening transfers has historically never worked for realm balance (in WoW at least, i have yet to see the mythical community beast in SWTOR give any indications that they aren't a clone of the rest of the MMO community)

 

The fact remains, casual players are a large market. WoW caters to that market and Bioware has stated that they want to follow WoW's model. Casual players prefer instant gratification at the cost of community building.

 

Propose a solution that gives casual players an opportunity to enjoy any content of the game while lessening queues, making finding groups easier and avoiding the trap of "this hardcore PvP guild is currently farming warzones"

 

So basically since you can't play at 3 am solo queueing you think the rest of us that don't want people not on our server in our WZ should just suck it up?

 

Eff you! You have the problem. you suck it up.

[jblazen]

The anonymity argument is garbage. I'd prefer cross server WZ's cuz it would mean quicker queues, especially since we have same faction WZ's. They should be instantaneous.

 

I don't play this game for the social aspect. That's what I have real friends for.

[Trolleone]

- So what you're saying is a casual player is someone who wants the same rewards as the hardcore player but with less effort? This isn't my definition of a casual player at all.

- Cross server PvP does NOT equal balance. Horde wins the majority of PvP matches in WoW. It is not balanced at all.

- I find it very odd there is a server out there where everyone stops playing PvP at 3am. That isn't the case on my server at least.

 

-wow, it's like being teleported directly to the WoW forums... a casual player wants to play the content. they want to have fun. the end goal of the game is "have fun" sitting in a queue = not fun. getting farmed by guild groups = not fun. being able to queue solo and participate in the game = fun. not quite sure how that's hard to comprehend.

 

- Horde wins 51% of BGs at last count. Obviously not balanced at all. strangely on the one map that most of the community agrees is unbalanced, the alliance win 56% of the time. You'd also expect SWTOR to have balanced PvP on paper as both sides are mirror copies of each other.

 

-you don't play on a light pop server. at 3am midweek i'm often sitting 15-20 min in a queue before I'm matched up in a Huttball with the same people I just played with. Granted, a lot of people are still pushing to 50, so less players are participating in PvP than would be if the majority of people are at cap

 

 

So far the ONLY argument against cross-realm warzones boils down to... i can't foster a PvP community on my realm? I'm trying hard to find any other complaints other than "we don't want to play with randoms" nevermind that for people who play alone or with 2-3 others that this is already a reality.

[Mystprime]

You are assuming that everyone is playing for the same reason you are. I think the resistance to the request for damage calculators illustrates that this is simply not the case. What is happening here is the same thing that is happening in this discussion you have two distinctly different views of what the game should be coming into conflict. On one side you have the MMOs are about community crowd on the other side you have the MMOs are about competition crowd. Personally I see both sides, but frankly the majority of the 12 year olds and ***holes gravitate toward the second group so that turns me off from supporting anything they want.

 

In a nut shell you are seeing resistance because there is a significant portion of the population who wants this to be a community focused game with a casual feel not second job like raiding in EQ1 or a pee pee contest that WoW has become. Imagine playing in PvP without ever looking up your stats or those of anyone else. Imagine not having a board that maintained and displayed player stats and accomplishments. Where your bragging rights come as party of community participation in game. Caring about your reputation from how you played not how well you played. I would dare say, what they are looking for is something akin to DAOC pre-expansions or Vanilla WoW just with more class balance between the sides since both of those had balance problems. Also, on top of that they don't want to bring back the elitist cliques from EQ1 and the neccessity of the "perfect group."

 

 

Now my position on this specific issue is that I would ok with CS, so long they exclude the RP servers or even better only CS to same type servers. So PVP to PVP, PVE to PVE, and RP to RP.

 

I think CS to same server types would be phenomenal. It would prevent certain issues people have mentioned earlier.

[Trolleone]

Actually... YOU have the problem since Bioware is changing the game to fit my playstyle. Since THAT is the profitable move for them to make.

 

again, we're brought back to the decision bioware has to make:

 

Against Cross-server Warzones: we can't foster and grow a PvP community (which can be solved by fixing Ilum and rated Warzones)

 

For Cross-server Warzones: a larger pool of players, lower queue times, balanced matches.

 

I'm wondering which decision will appeal to a larger group of players? Do you need the graph again?

Edited January 11, 2012 by Trineda
removed quote

[AngryBuddhist]

Actually... YOU have the problem since Bioware is changing the game to fit my playstyle. Since THAT is the profitable move for them to make.

 

again, we're brought back to the decision bioware has to make:

 

Against Cross-server Warzones: we can't foster and grow a PvP community (which can be solved by fixing Ilum and rated Warzones)

 

For Cross-server Warzones: a larger pool of players, lower queue times, balanced matches.

 

I'm wondering which decision will appeal to a larger group of players? Do you need the graph again?

 

I don't think that will happen. The guy who mentioned it is already backpedaling.

 

But again your crowd is crying for the change so the impetus is on you to show it won't ruin the game for my crowd.

[Mystprime]

I am positive there are people you play with from your server who want CS Edited January 11, 2012 by Trineda
remove quote

[AngryBuddhist]

I am positive there are people you play with from your server who want CS

 

It's a PvP server with mostly early sub players. Even mentioning it in chat on my server gets you harangued endlessly.

 

it is definately DO NOT WANT!

[anedorivan]

I am strongly against cross server and I will quit the game if it is ever added to the game as it completely kills any sense of accountability and community.

[Nowhere]

Please give us cross-server warzones.

 

We also need a LFG tool AND top that off with dual-specs please.

 

#christmaswishlist2013

[I_am_Waffen]

I didn't say that. I said I don't want a dick like you able to be in my WZ's. If you are not on my server then I don't have to deal with you and your 'change the game to suit my wants' BS.

 

and really eff you also.

 

 

You're argument is very flawed. You don't want "jerks" like this mate you're debating in your Warzones, yet every Warzone game has "that guy" who insults everyone's mothers, harasses other players, and questions their sexuality for not playing the game the way they want them to. The real problem sounds like MMO/Multiplayer games aren't up your alley and you could find solace in single player games. This is a problem in every MMO. Thick skin OP or just leave it alone.

 

Edited January 11, 2012 by I_am_Waffen

[jblazen]

I don't think that will happen. The guy who mentioned it is already backpedaling.

 

But again your crowd is crying for the change so the impetus is on you to show it won't ruin the game for my crowd.

 

It's going to happen. It's about pandering to the masses and making business decisions for the majority of players. It's only logical. Money rules all.

 

If you want a local "community", that's what Ilum is for.

 

All you care bear RP basement dwellers need to ****.

[Trolleone]

I don't think that will happen. The guy who mentioned it is already backpedaling.

 

But again your crowd is crying for the change so the impetus is on you to show it won't ruin the game for my crowd.

 

I can't find any backpedaling, but maybe I just don't have the supreme insight you do.

 

fact of the matter is, back to the original reply: casuals are a huge market. there's data to back this up for WoW. cross-realm pvp, dungeons and now raids have been the main staying power for a 7 year old MMO.

 

i get that you don't like casual players. that's understandable. however, if bioware wants to keep a casual playerbase, they can't keep realms seperate.

[AngryBuddhist]

You're argument is very flawed. You don't want "jerks" like this mate you're debating in your Warzones, yet every Warzone game has "that guy" who insults everyone's mothers, harasses other players, and questions their sexuality for not playing the game the way they want them to. The real problem sounds like MMO/Multiplayer games aren't up your alley and you could find solace in single player games.

 

You are finally starting to grasp the reason, but still miss the point. When people act that way and are actually trying to play on your server there is payback. Reputation DOES matter on a decent PvP server. Reputation means nothing with cross server bozo's ruining what were really decent WZ's.

 

On my server when you are a dick in the WZ, you here about in chat for hours.

[Sulmithagreyse]

Sorry, but unless you are on low pop server then NOTHING will change for you. There will be still huge imbalance, you will still get as much huttball as you can endure, what will change is the amount of noobs that don't give rats *** about even trying to win because afking out takes less effort and reward is there for the claim.

 

Now at least we can blacklist that kind of people and make their lives miserable when they will try to find pvp guild. With xserver WZs you will be just a meaningless, nameless random that no one gives a crap about.

 

 

in wow the people who afk'd out were the people in the better PVP guilds. they'd get on a fresh alt, afk to get their honor gear then jump in arena and rated bgs

 

the bads aren't screwing the system, the 'goods' are

[Mystprime]

Community is great yes, but to say it takes it away completely is rediculous. What about flashpoints or operations or Illum, or group with people? That is still community. You can still have a name for yourself

[Sulmithagreyse]

You are finally starting to grasp the reason, but still miss the point. When people act that way and are actually trying to play on your server there is payback. Reputation DOES matter on a decent PvP server. Reputation means nothing with cross server bozo's ruining what were really decent WZ's.

 

On my server when you are a dick in the WZ, you here about in chat for hours.

 

no, in a large MMO rep means nothing outside your guild. it's like HS. if your friends like you and nobody else does, you're fine. you get to do things, go places, etc

 

what kills an MMO is allowing people to sit in queues in cities all day while the rest of the game's world is empty.

 

that's an MMO killer and that's why wow has lost over 6000 subs per day since january 2011

[Lina_Inverse]

The biggest reason I can think of that they would want to implement as system that does this is that it is virtually the only way that any kind of rated pvp is going to matter or stay interesting for long.

 

I am not happy about what it would do to the server community, however. Good with the bad. I can't really say I have an opinion on this subject. On one hand I want rated pvp, on the other I want the great pvp community. Honestly the lack of a server forum is already detracting from the latter, but it would just be worse if the warzones went cross-q and we all know that.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Lina_Inverse

[buttugly]

I am strongly against cross server and I will quit the game if it is ever added to the game as it completely kills any sense of accountability and community.

please explain this? isn't all the servers with swtor consdered as a whole? after all changes effect us all? Accountability? like for griefing?

[I_am_Waffen]

You are finally starting to grasp the reason, but still miss the point. When people act that way and are actually trying to play on your server there is payback. Reputation DOES matter on a decent PvP server. Reputation means nothing with cross server bozo's ruining what were really decent WZ's.

 

On my server when you are a dick in the WZ, you here about in chat for hours.

 

It really sounds like you need a new hobby rather than worry what internet people think about you in a video game.

 

You're entire argument is you want to be popular and known in an online MMO. That's really sad mate. You can do other things in a video game to become popular rather than run your rofltrain in warzones all day obliterating groups because they lack the gear you have due to a lack of competition. It really sounds like you're afraid of cross realms because it'll decrease your win ratio. Welcome to Republic!

Edited January 11, 2012 by I_am_Waffen

[Fidopro]

Yeah when both sides get to know eachother pvp is really fun

 

reminds me of the WoW twink brackets, most people thought they played only to faceroll eachother in better gear but in reality the competition between eachother and the trashtalking in the server forums made pvp so much better.

 

speaking of which..where is the swtor server forums???