Pyro Survivability

[makiemoffa]

Long time lurker here,

 

Many thanks to chansawsamurai, taugrim, and many others who's name escape me at the moment.

 

Feels substantially lower than the 21/2/18 to the point of being "squishy".

 

I have played my powertech as a variation of this build since level 20ish.

 

I am looking for some advice on how to change my playstyle so I am not being killed in 5 seconds from being focused down. It is a big adjustment from the ST/PT hybrid.

 

Any tips?

[Dekai]

Well, since I'm currently having to play Pyro for DPS instead of my build, this is what I found.

 

Get a healer/guard friend!

 

Ok seriously lol. Basically you can live a long time, but the kicker is to use LoS when possible, interrupts, Carbonize, Electro Dart on others then just your main nuke target to save your ***.

 

You do a lot of burst, and with lucky crits can take someone from 90% health to 0. Sadly you won't have the armor and minor shielding from 21/2/18. Fair trade off though imho. Parakeet build(I hate you Chain/Tung) = 3k Rail Shots and 2.5 Rocket Punches with 50% DR in champ gear from armor. Pyro = 5k Rail Shots with 5k'ish+ TD's for yummy burst but only 24% DR from armor.

[makiemoffa]

Well, since I'm currently having to play Pyro for DPS instead of my build, this is what I found.

 

Get a healer/guard friend!

 

Ok seriously lol. Basically you can live a long time, but the kicker is to use LoS when possible, interrupts, Carbonize, Electro Dart on others then just your main nuke target to save your ***.

 

You do a lot of burst, and with lucky crits can take someone from 90% health to 0. Sadly you won't have the armor and minor shielding from 21/2/18. Fair trade off though imho. Parakeet build(I hate you Chain/Tung) = 3k Rail Shots and 2.5 Rocket Punches with 50% DR in champ gear from armor. Pyro = 5k Rail Shots with 5k'ish+ TD's for yummy burst but only 24% DR from armor.

 

Dekai, thank you for the reply! You are another invaluable member of the pyrotech forums that deserves a gold star.

 

I have also had to spec pyro for DPS in PvE, however I would still like to PvP and the switch is quite dramatic.

 

I was in a rush in my original post, I should clarify that I am using a build as a semi-fresh 50 (after rerolling my 36 Jugg):

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#301bMZMsZfhbbdGhrs.1

 

My main focus here is to be able to make healers lives a living hell in PvP, while also remaining strong in PvE content. Did EV 8 man with little difficulty.

 

Would the endurance in PT help? I think this would be minimal. Also the lowered CD on electro dart might be useful for the long fights that tend to occur when you corner a healer, however at what cost?

 

 

I guess I am also wondering if it is viable to remain as 21/2/18 (with CGC) without a significant loss in DPS in PvE content?

 

As for your suggestion of having healer friends, I have two friends that are low level at the moment who are specd for healing, however the amount of 50's and premade groups of full champion geared players is making it difficult for them to effectively heal me/the team, unfortunately.

 

Are there any classes a PT should avoid? Obviously running into a group of 3+ enemies cannot happen anymore, either.

Edited January 11, 2012 by makiemoffa

[Dekai]

Yep, that Pyro build is fine imho. Most don't take TD for PvE DPS, but I'm on a PvP server, I need the burst to live. I'd still take Sweltering Heat even for PvE, though some bosses can trigger GAJ.

 

The endurance boost is hardly noticeable, so don't fret about not having it. As for 21/2/18 in PvE. It can tank all HM's no problem, but it's DPS, as I'm sure you've noticed, is far below Pyro. It's a control build. Meant to root, pull, guard, stun, interrupt and basically be a living hell for an opposing team. High survival with clutch burst to assist along with your team.

 

As for what classes to avoid? As Pyro, you can pretty much 1v1 every class with our tools. Stealth Scan, Grapple, Electro and Carbonize combined with Quell to interrupt and CC. Just takes practice.

 

As 21/2/18? Smart Sages/Sorcs will be your bane. Geared Ops/Scoundrel healers are a PITA too. Basically anyone that can run and heal will be a problem, anyone else you gently nomnom them to death depending on your gear vs theirs.

 

These are all just my opinion based on my encounters though, I have no numbers to back any of it up.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Dekai

[badalchemist]

As a Pyrotech, you're better off playing a less in-your-face role and hanging back to carefully choose your targets to burst down. You'll quickly find most PvPers are opportunistic, so if you manage to burst an enemy down to half health in a few seconds, your teammates will jump in to quickly finish him off so that you can move on to the next target. It's basically just a completely different playstyle than just Jet Charging right into the middle of things constantly.

[AnAcuteAngle]

Try putting points into Degauss, Activation Energy, and Combust.

[Trungalung]

Yep, that Pyro build is fine imho. Most don't take TD for PvE DPS, but I'm on a PvP server, I need the burst to live. I'd still take Sweltering Heat even for PvE, though some bosses can trigger GAJ.

 

The endurance boost is hardly noticeable, so don't fret about not having it. As for 21/2/18 in PvE. It can tank all HM's no problem, but it's DPS, as I'm sure you've noticed, is far below Pyro. It's a control build. Meant to root, pull, guard, stun, interrupt and basically be a living hell for an opposing team. High survival with clutch burst to assist along with your team.

 

As for what classes to avoid? As Pyro, you can pretty much 1v1 every class with our tools. Stealth Scan, Grapple, Electro and Carbonize combined with Quell to interrupt and CC. Just takes practice.

 

As 21/2/18? Smart Sages/Sorcs will be your bane. Geared Ops/Scoundrel healers are a PITA too. Basically anyone that can run and heal will be a problem, anyone else you gently nomnom them to death depending on your gear vs theirs.

 

These are all just my opinion based on my encounters though, I have no numbers to back any of it up.

 

I agree with those two classes especially the ones that specializes into dot. Against them, they just dot me up and run around LoSing and healing themselves.

[chainsawsamurai]

I agree with those two classes especially the ones that specializes into dot. Against them, they just dot me up and run around LoSing and healing themselves.

 

I don't have any more problems with those classes than I did as Adv Proto though. The lack of TD burst makes them a bit more of a pain compared to full Pyro.

 

I've found I can use my superior range (between Rocket Punches anyway) to stay far enough away to be ready for a Grapple/Jet Charge interrupt after my Quell.

 

Most Sorcs/Sages aren't very good I've noticed. They have far too versatile of a toolset and way too much damage at range to even have to develop the necessary PvP skills to achieve lolgodmode. Most aren't a problem for me as a Parakeet if I'm on the ball and keeping track of resolve.

 

Speaking of lolgodmode, I think you'd be hard pressed to kill a GOOD Sorc/Sage even with a full Pyro build unless you caught them completely in the open and got the jump. Their toolset is absurd in the hands of someone who knows what they're doing. Our 2s snare isn't enough to keep them from being one trick away from getting behind something and topping off. GOOD sorcs/sages are insane.

 

Decided to make this 2 posts. I'll talk about Operatives/Smugglers next post.

[chainsawsamurai]

As far as Ops/Smugs go, this one is a bit more near and dear to my heart. My GF is an Operative (not very good at PvP she'll admit) who is trying to dodge a nerf and I'm a Powertech who wants my mitigation to work, so that is really the inspiration behind all of my testing.

 

As it stands our mitigation doesn't work against their opening Salvo at all and with sub par defensive cooldowns and 50% Armor penetration on Acid Blade I don't think I would be out of place stating that we are one of their most opportune targets. Your only real buffer is half of your armor and your Hit Points. A full ST built, tank gear wearing Powertech lacks the damage to do anything once they've survived the opener. A full DPS Pyrotech can put a dent in him, but likely wont have enough HP left to turn the fight around if they even survive the opening burst.

 

The only thing really saving your *** from Op/Smug right now is aggressive use of Stealth Scan and the fact that most of them don't know how helpless we are to them. They see heavy armor and shields and assume we're a last-ditch target.

 

We aren't. My GF's Op is in Daily modded quest gear, not a lick of expertise, and without any purple items worth mentioning. I outgear the crap out of her. With luck she can take my expertise wearing, purple geared, Ion Cylinder packing Powertech to 35% in her opener. Her worst opener from our testing took me to 60%, that was with no crits. This is also without consumable use, if she were Biochem with Adrenals it would be significantly worse. Granted my bag luck is horrible, I don't have the most expertise in the world, but you can draw your own conclusions from there as she has zero expertise.

 

When that opening burst is over, a Powertech only really has Energy Shield and Kolto Overload to try and turn things around, Oil Slick has no significant effect. The Operative will use Shield Probe to suck up a bit of your damage. Evasion doesn't do much against our attacks, but can avoid a Rail Shot or remove DoTs. If the fight goes poorly, they can restealth and reopen because Hidden Strike doesn't have a cooldown, doing this would likely end the fight as efficiently as possible if they wanted to chain it with their opener.

 

This is from a stealth class which uses a mechanic similar to heat. Being a stealth class, there is really no repercussion to blowing all of their Energy and then just going back into stealth. They can also use their consumables while in stealth, making Biochem and Relic enhanced openers extremely deadly.

 

My point is, if an Operative wants you dead and gets the jump there is very little you're going to do about it as a Powertech. They counter us extremely hard right now unless you catch them jumping someone else, in which case their Defensive cooldowns don't do much against our attacks. Defensive cooldowns, heals, and Sorc bubbles are the best way to turn the fight around and we are lacking on all three counts compared to other classes. Your best bet is heals and support from other players. PT vs Op is likely the most uphill battle that we have.

 

Edit: Even if our defensive stats did work against Operatives, you would only have Shielding to rely on during the opening salvo. You can't dodge while stunned, but Shields work.

 

I've also edited this like 100 times. I've been on these forums too much with the whole Mitigation thing and apparently my fingers and brain are tired of typing.

Edited January 12, 2012 by chainsawsamurai