Super Smash Hybrid Spec

[Drathmar]

So, normal rage spec gives you some pretty damn nice smash crits. However I was thinking of a way to make smash hit even harder.

 

So I came up with this: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100ZhGbbddbozZrr0rdbM.1

 

Basic burst rotation would be:

 

Obliterate -> Choke -> Deadly Throw -> Gore -> Smash -> Scream.

 

Choke/Deadly Throw are to keep them in place.

You get 100% Armor penetration on both a double damage, guaranteed crit smash, and a force scream follow up with a high chance to crit.

 

Only problem is that in between choke CD you don't do nearly as much damage, however you should do quite a bit of damage when it is up.

 

General crit rate: .4

General surge: .65

General armor modifier: .8

Armor modifier (rage): .85

Internal damage resist modifier: .9

Gore'd: 1.0

 

Obliterate (1518 * (1 + .4 * .65) * .8) + Choke (967 * 3 * (1 + .4 * .65) * 0.9) + Deadly Throw (1009 + (1 + .4 * .65) *0.8) + Gore (1342 * (1+ .4 * .65) * .8) + Smash (1280 * 2 * (1 + 1 * 0.65)) + Scream (1772 * (1 + 0.4 * 0.65) = 1530.144 + 3289.734 + 1017.072 + 1352.736 + 4224 + 2232.72 = 13646.406 damage.

 

For comparion a full rotation for

 

Carnage: Charge (823 * (1+.4*.65) * .8) + Gore (1342 * (1+.4*.65) * .8) + Massacre (1346 * (1+.4*.95)) + Ataru*2 (297 * 1.3 * (1+.4*.95)) + Scream (1772 * (1+1.0*.95) * 1.1) = 829.584 + 1352.736 + 1857.48 + 1065.636 + 3800.94 = 8906.376 damage

 

 

Rage: Obliterate (1518 * 1.06 * (1+.4*.65) * .85) + Crush (3199 * (1+.4*.95) * .9) + Smash (1280 * 2.0 * (1+1.0*.95) * .85) = 1723.32468 + 3973.158 + 4243.2 = 9939.68268 damage

 

Note: All 3 are assuming you have rage built up already, which you should always have close to a full bar before you go to burst someone down.

 

 

When waiting on force choke CD you still have decent damage with 100% crit screams and smashes + 100% armor pen from gore.

 

When choke is down the rotation would be (once blood frenzy is up you go to burst someone down)

 

Obliterate + Deadly Throw + Gore + Smash + Scream

 

Damage on this is:

 

Obliterate (1518 * (1 + .4 * .65) * .8) + Deadly Throw (1009 + (1 + .4 * .65) *0.8) + Gore (1342 * (1+ .4 * .65) * .8) + Smash (1280 * (1 + 1 * 0.65)) + Scream (1772 * (1 + 1 * 0.65) = 1530.144 + 1017.072 + 1352.736 + 2112 + 2923.8 = 8935.752 damage.

 

So still not bad and worth it to be able to do 14k burst every 50 seconds or so.

 

Credit to EasymodeX for the basic formula as well as the more realistic damage numbers he posted in another thread.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Drathmar

[Kricys]

Smash is a force attack. You're missing 30% crit damage to it, you'll only be able to use it once a minute, you'll miss 20% passive arp.

That spec is pretty much terrible on all accounts. Stop it with the hybrid builds lol.

What you gonna hit people with once force choke is on cd? And what if you get cc'd or interrupted during it? Woops no big smash for another minute.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Kricys

[Draexnael]

But you become pretty restricted - very much like the old POM Pyro mages in early wow - huge burst but after that you have very little.

 

Have you tested it?

[Drathmar]

Smash is a force attack. You're missing 30% crit damage to it, you'll only be able to use it once a minute, you'll miss 20% passive arp.

That spec is pretty much terrible on all accounts. Stop it with the hybrid builds lol.

What you gonna hit people with once force choke is on cd? And what if you get cc'd or interrupted during it? Woops no big smash for another minute.

 

When waiting on force choke CD you still have decent damage with 100% crit screams and smashes + 100% armor pen from gore.

 

When choke is down the rotation would be (once blood frenzy is up you go to burst someone down)

 

Obliterate + Deadly Throw + Gore + Smash + Scream

 

Damage on this is:

 

Obliterate (1518 * (1 + .4 * .65) * .8) + Deadly Throw (1009 + (1 + .4 * .65) *0.8) + Gore (1342 * (1+ .4 * .65) * .8) + Smash (1280 * (1 + 1 * 0.65)) + Scream (1772 * (1 + 1 * 0.65) = 1530.144 + 1017.072 + 1352.736 + 2112 + 2923.8 = 8935.752 damage.

 

So still not bad and worth it to be able to do 14k burst every 50 seconds or so.

 

So you have about the same burst as a pure carnage spec when your main burst is down.

 

What you don't realize is you get 100% armor pen on both the double damage crit smash and the crit scream together once a minute.

 

And you get 100% armor pen on a normal crit smash + crit scream when you don't have choke up.

 

That makes up for 30% crit damage and 20% armor pen.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Drathmar

[Drathmar]

But you become pretty restricted - very much like the old POM Pyro mages in early wow - huge burst but after that you have very little.

 

Have you tested it?

 

The thing is you only have 1k burst less than a normal rage spec when your huge burst is down. Theorycrafting wise. Still need to test.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Drathmar

[Bhudduh]

Only one thing to do here.. Record it, prove its worth.

[Kricys]

Your screams are going to be extremely weak tho. You don't have the 30% crit damage boost. Relying on gore is a bad idea, it's why I hate the spec. You only have 4.5 seconds to use the buff and with the cc going around too many times you'll miss out. Edited January 5, 2012 by Kricys

[Drathmar]

Your screams are going to be extremely weak tho. You don't have the 30% crit damage boost. Relying on gore is a bad idea, it's why I hate the spec. You only have 4.5 seconds to use the buff and with the cc going around too many times you'll miss out.

 

General crit rate: .4 (or 40% chance to crit)

General surge: .65 (or 65% crit damage)

General armor modifier: .8 (or 20% reduction from armor, or you take 80% damage)

 

 

 

Scream Base Damage: 1772

Scream average damage with gore up (no 30% crit mod) : Scream (1772 * (1 + 0.4 * 0.65) = 2232.72

Scream average damage with gore up (w/30% crit mod): Scream (1772 * (1 + 0.4 * 0.95)= 2445.36

 

So you lose out, on average: 2445.36 - 2232.72 = 212.64 damage per scream.

 

So yes it adds up over time but it really isn't that much.

 

Also, not wanting to rely on gore is a personal play style thing, not really anything wrong with the spec. You probably don't run as carnage for that exact reason, but a lot of people do run carnage.

 

 

Obliterate (1518 * (1 + .4 * .65) * .8) + Choke (967 * 3 * (1 + .4 * .65) * 0.9) + Deadly Throw (1009 + (1 + .4 * .65) *0.8) + Gore (1342 * (1+ .4 * .65) * .8) + Smash (1280 * 2 * (1 + 1 * 0.65)) + Scream (1772 * (1 + 0.4 * 0.65) = 1530.144 + 3289.734 + 1017.072 + 1352.736 + 4224 + 2232.72 = 13646.406 damage.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Drathmar

[Tricky]

Nice, a theorycraft thread!

 

I'm interested in seeing how testing goes, since I'm only 35 I can't try it yet. The only thing I see is you like to open with Obliterate, which costs action points. I know this could be swapped with Force Charge but those numbers would be different.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Tricky

[XarenKilam]

This is interesting. Record a video or some screen shots please?

[Drathmar]

Nice, a theorycraft thread!

 

I'm interested in seeing how testing goes, since I'm only 35 I can't try it yet. The only thing I see is you like to open with Obliterate, which costs action points. I know this could be swapped with Force Charge but those numbers would be different.

 

One tip for marauders is you dont burst immediately, you use your assault/ba to build rage on another target, then switch to your burst target and spend a full rage bar bursting them, for max damage.

 

Don't try and burst from 0 rage.

 

Also I will test when I hit 50, 46 right now.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Drathmar

[Korevas]

For this kind of build the best tip I can think of is be a juggernaut instead. If that is not for you, you should maybe go for full rage tree to get force crush, which will set up your crit smash better then choke because a 3 sec channel is still very very vulnerable to interruption of any kind (think knockback) and won't leave you with a 1 min downtime on your favorite trick.

For a full rage tree build though, juggernaut is even "more better", because they get much better features built in then marauders do.

[EasymodeX]

The inherent problem in the OP is that you are comparing a 7-GCD rotation (Oblit - Choke(2) - DT - Gore - Smash - Scream) with a 3-GCD rotation (Crush - Oblit - Smash).

 

For the no-choke sequence, you're still talking 5 GCDs compared to 3.

[doombomb]

Pure Rage specs can dish out huge crits far more often than your awful hybrid build.