WoW vs TOR questing? I don't see much of a difference.

[Ruinerx]

Sure, questing in this game is supposedly "more engaging" than WoW; I can definitely say that for sure. People like to flame and rag on WoW for having so many "Go kill X, go loot Y" quests, but I honestly don't see a difference between these games. In fact, I think quests in this game tend to have about double the kill requirements; even though they aren't listed as an objective.

 

Let's say you have a mission to go kill some leader who is hiding in a cave that is all the way across the map. So after the long, linear, ride there of trying to dodge the clusterfudge of poorly placed enemy spawn points along the road and trying to take non-existent shortcuts when you can; you finally reach the "gate" of the camp that is guarding the cave, that is guarding the boss. Now you have to kill like 10+ packs of mobs to enter the cave. Followed by clearing 10+ packs of mobs to enter the instance. You'll never guess it, followed by clearing the instance and a boss; only for a 2 minute "game-breaking" cut-scene that supposedly sets this game above the competition.

 

Now comes the fun part! You run all the way back through the instance that that you just cleared out. No quick ways out, no ledges to jump off, no tunnel passage way to the start, etc etc. Guess what, that cave you just cleared 10 minutes ago is completely re-spawned. So now you clear that all out AGAIN and go outside. Then re-clear a path to the road AGAIN. Then ride all the way across the map AGAIN.

 

Oh and then to polish it all of with a glass of pain in the ***, you get some follow up or optional mission to go back over there and do it all again because you were trying to mission pool and knock out a bunch in the same area at once. Shame on me for trying to follow a natural questflow right?

 

I'm sorry, I think I'd take the old "Kill 10 of these mobs and the boss" WoW quests over the "Kill one guy!(in invisible ink: and kill 100 of these guys to getting to him and back out) TOR missions. At least you know what you are getting into with a WoW quest. Even missions in Eve Online don't frustrate me to this extent.

 

I would rather there be mostly silver and gold mobs than to have to deal with packs of 4-5 over and over and over and over again.

 

Before anyone attacks my credibility, I have played many MMO's, including WoW for 7 years and Eve Online for around 4; both on and off.

[RealLyrix]

Try skyrim.. Might be something for you!

[Dropadeuce]

OP, MMORPG's may not be the thing for you. I recommend Super Mario Brothers 1 and 3 and Sonic The Hedgehog. Edited January 4, 2012 by Dropadeuce

[Orvish]

It's the same sort of quests no matter what MMO you played. And provided you are using it judiciously, you can easily quick travel out of the back of the caves to the base to turn things in.

[Mandrax]

Sure, questing in this game is supposedly "more engaging" than WoW; I can definitely say that for sure. People like to flame and rag on WoW for having so many "Go kill X, go loot Y" quests, but I honestly don't see a difference between these games. In fact, I think quests in this game tend to have about double the kill requirements; even though they aren't listed as an objective.

 

MMOs will always have a selection of those types of quests. Try designing a game that requires thousands of quests and see how far you would get without these types of quests. What BioWare has tried to do (and didn't do a bad job of IMO) is tried to disguise those quests by delivering them in a different and more engaging way.

 

Let's say you have a mission to go kill some leader who is hiding in a cave that is all the way across the map. So after the long, linear, ride there of trying to dodge the clusterfudge of poorly placed enemy spawn points along the road and trying to take non-existent shortcuts when you can; you finally reach the "gate" of the camp that is guarding the cave, that is guarding the boss. Now you have to kill like 10+ packs of mobs to enter the cave. Followed by clearing 10+ packs of mobs to enter the instance. You'll never guess it, followed by clearing the instance and a boss; only for a 2 minute "game-breaking" cut-scene that supposedly sets this game above the competition.

 

A staple part of MMO gameplay is combat, so isn't it obvious that games developers would put plenty of mobs for you to kill?

 

Now comes the fun part! You run all the way back through the instance that that you just cleared out. No quick ways out, no ledges to jump off, no tunnel passage way to the start, etc etc. Guess what, that cave you just cleared 10 minutes ago is completely re-spawned. So now you clear that all out AGAIN and go outside. Then re-clear a path to the road AGAIN. Then ride all the way across the map AGAIN.

 

Have you not discovered the wonders of 'quick travel' yet?

 

Oh and then to polish it all of with a glass of pain in the ***, you get some follow up or optional mission to go back over there and do it all again because you were trying to mission pool and knock out a bunch in the same area at once. Shame on me for trying to follow a natural questflow right?

 

Bioware have done a decent job of NOT sending you back and forth to the same areas over and over. The way they constructed bonus quests and the ability to use a holocron to pick up the next stage of the quest helps a lot. You will also find a bunch of NPCs in a similar area all giving quests for a particular questing place. Maybe you aren't gathering all the quests before going adventuring?

 

I'm sorry, I think I'd take the old "Kill 10 of these mobs and the boss" WoW quests over the "Kill one guy!(in invisible ink: and kill 100 of these guys to getting to him and back out) TOR missions. At least you know what you are getting into with a WoW quest. Even missions in Eve Online don't frustrate me to this extent.

 

Those quests have been in RPGs for years, long before WoW ever existed. I refer you to my previous statement 'try designing a game that requires thousands of quests and see how far you would get without these types of quests'.

 

I would rather there be mostly silver and gold mobs than to have to deal with packs of 4-5 over and over and over and over again.

 

Before anyone attacks my credibility, I have played many MMO's, including WoW for 7 years and Eve Online for around 4; both on and off.

 

Your problem is MMO burnout IMO.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Mandrax

[Puremallace]

Try skyrim.. Might be something for you!

 

Basically this. OP you want single player games where consequences are permanent. Your entire post just described Skyrim lol

Edited January 4, 2012 by Puremallace

[spicycookie]

SWTOR is better at masking the grind.

 

Go capture your ex-wife

stage 1 bonus : while trying to capture her kill x amount of her lovers

stage 2 bonus: destroy some of her furniture

stage 3 bonus: kill her boss who is also her lover

 

Completed.

 

In the other game (Can't write the name... Bioware likes to give me warnings for typing this game's name out, im not sure why Bioware gave me 77 warnings and a few of them is for naming this game ... very odd.. one of these board moderators hate me.)

 

Quest 1: Capture Wife

Quest 2: Kill x amount of her lovers while you are there

Quest 3: Destroy some furniture while you are there

Quest 4: Kill this boss who is her lover for some loot.

 

 

In this manner, it is very similar, but they mask it pretty good.

[Ruinerx]

I should have mentioned that I love MMOs and am usually a hardcore player. I tend to be in around the top 1% of players in PVE and PVP content. Grinding does not bother me too much. However, excessive grinding and poor questflows usually mean that the game developer did not think things through all the way.

 

Basically what I was getting at with my post is that the pacing is terrible in this game. I don't care how long it takes to get to the level cap as long as I am having fun doing so; and this feels more like a chore.

 

Of course this could be intentional on BW's part. Makes perfect sense in terms of money. The longer they can stretch content out, the longer it will take players to complete and the more money they make in the mean time. So rather than completing all of the quests in an optimized zone in 10 hours (pulling numbers out of the rear), it will take you 20 instead.

 

EDIT: oh and also, about the "making 100000s of quests" crap, estimates peg them at spending around 200 million on this game. I would expect better than this.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Ruinerx

[pocketthesaurus]

SWTOR is better at masking the grind.

 

Go capture your ex-wife

stage 1 bonus : while trying to capture her kill x amount of her lovers

stage 2 bonus: destroy some of her furniture

stage 3 bonus: kill her boss who is also her lover

 

Completed.

 

In the other game (Can't write the name... Bioware likes to give me warnings for typing this game's name out, im not sure why Bioware gave me 77 warnings and a few of them is for naming this game ... very odd.. one of these board moderators hate me.)

 

Quest 1: Capture Wife

Quest 2: Kill x amount of her lovers while you are there

Quest 3: Destroy some furniture while you are there

Quest 4: Kill this boss who is her lover for some loot.

 

 

In this manner, it is very similar, but they mask it pretty good.

I've never been warned for typing another game's name. That's a strange policy.

 

Maybe don't type it out? I always write abbreviations for other games.

[radrev]

For me the difference is in the details. SWTOR takes the time to explain who the target is, why is he the target and why he needs to die, talk to me or something else. It's all made relevant and so far interesting.

[Eillack]

TOR is.....fun? Also it gives an actual story to why something is happening and gives a choice to save or kill...not just a WoW=grade "Kill X" with no reason whatsoever.

[Chromiie]

TOR is.....fun? Also it gives an actual story to why something is happening and gives a choice to save or kill...not just a WoW=grade "Kill X" with no reason whatsoever.

 

 

Yet I still gather all the quests I can and know them out one at a time...

[Androvis]

Now comes the fun part! You run all the way back through the instance that that you just cleared out. No quick ways out,

 

Someone doesn't know how to call for a shuttle to bind points. I almost took you seriously until right there.

[Redshirtricky]

It's more satisfying to plant 6 explosives at 6 towers and watching them blow up.

 

As opposed to killing wild boars to get 6 boar ribs to make basted boar ribs.

[GGTeMpLaR]

It's all about context.

[Saber_Six]

Someone doesn't know how to call for a shuttle to bind points. I almost took you seriously until right there.

 

This.

[Neadric]

if people expected anything more than "kill x of y" with voice acting, then i'm not sure what they wanted hehe.

 

For me, that's enough to keep me interested enough to finish out zones fully. Honestly it's going to be hard moving forward in other MMO's for me to read quest text =/

 

Sure it's your standard quests, but i think the VO adds enough to it that it makes it more compelling.

 

 

Will i listen to the VO on a 2nd or 3rd character? No 'll prolly skip through it unless i pick a different dialogue option.

[fingolion]

I don't see the problem... I wouldnt mind having to kill all sentients in the galaxy if that leads me to kill Skavak. Argh, I hate that guy

[Ruggle]

It's more satisfying to plant 6 explosives at 6 towers and watching them blow up.

 

As opposed to killing wild boars to get 6 boar ribs to make basted boar ribs.

 

It's more satisfying to drop bombs on 50 undead from a goblin biplane than to kill 6 cats to make medicine.

[Alkiii]

Sure, questing in this game is supposedly "more engaging" than WoW; I can definitely say that for sure. People like to flame and rag on WoW for having so many "Go kill X, go loot Y" quests, but I honestly don't see a difference between these games. In fact, I think quests in this game tend to have about double the kill requirements; even though they aren't listed as an objective.

 

Let's say you have a mission to go kill some leader who is hiding in a cave that is all the way across the map. So after the long, linear, ride there of trying to dodge the clusterfudge of poorly placed enemy spawn points along the road and trying to take non-existent shortcuts when you can; you finally reach the "gate" of the camp that is guarding the cave, that is guarding the boss. Now you have to kill like 10+ packs of mobs to enter the cave. Followed by clearing 10+ packs of mobs to enter the instance. You'll never guess it, followed by clearing the instance and a boss; only for a 2 minute "game-breaking" cut-scene that supposedly sets this game above the competition.

 

Now comes the fun part! You run all the way back through the instance that that you just cleared out. No quick ways out, no ledges to jump off, no tunnel passage way to the start, etc etc. Guess what, that cave you just cleared 10 minutes ago is completely re-spawned. So now you clear that all out AGAIN and go outside. Then re-clear a path to the road AGAIN. Then ride all the way across the map AGAIN.

 

Oh and then to polish it all of with a glass of pain in the ***, you get some follow up or optional mission to go back over there and do it all again because you were trying to mission pool and knock out a bunch in the same area at once. Shame on me for trying to follow a natural questflow right?

 

I'm sorry, I think I'd take the old "Kill 10 of these mobs and the boss" WoW quests over the "Kill one guy!(in invisible ink: and kill 100 of these guys to getting to him and back out) TOR missions. At least you know what you are getting into with a WoW quest. Even missions in Eve Online don't frustrate me to this extent.

 

I would rather there be mostly silver and gold mobs than to have to deal with packs of 4-5 over and over and over and over again.

 

Before anyone attacks my credibility, I have played many MMO's, including WoW for 7 years and Eve Online for around 4; both on and off.

 

 

WoW's quests, character story lines or general game play never grabbed me by the throat and not let go like this game has. If you think that there isn't much of a difference, then I think you're hitting the spacebar too frequently. To each their own I guess.

 

Only one other game has grabbed a hold of me like this and that was Ultima Online. I have been gaming since the mid 70's, have played every MMO out there at a high level (USA firsts in WoW, world top 25's in WoW, etc. etc.) and as fun as those were, this game has topped it within the first 32 levels on 3 different toons.

 

The immersion is so good that my wife is playing. My wife has despised MMO's since Ultima Online. HATED them. Today, she is addicted worse than I am. I love it.

 

I wish you well and I hope you find what you're looking for. Good luck! Hope to see your return in the near future.

[Bigaus]

I should have mentioned that I love MMOs and am usually a hardcore player. I tend to be in around the top 1% of players in PVE and PVP content. Grinding does not bother me too much. However, excessive grinding and poor questflows usually mean that the game developer did not think things through all the way.

 

Basically what I was getting at with my post is that the pacing is terrible in this game. I don't care how long it takes to get to the level cap as long as I am having fun doing so; and this feels more like a chore.

 

Of course this could be intentional on BW's part. Makes perfect sense in terms of money. The longer they can stretch content out, the longer it will take players to complete and the more money they make in the mean time. So rather than completing all of the quests in an optimized zone in 10 hours (pulling numbers out of the rear), it will take you 20 instead.

 

EDIT: oh and also, about the "making 100000s of quests" crap, estimates peg them at spending around 200 million on this game. I would expect better than this.

 

odd.. I'm actually leveling faster than I would like..

[Ruinerx]

For me the difference is in the details. SWTOR takes the time to explain who the target is, why is he the target and why he needs to die, talk to me or something else. It's all made relevant and so far interesting.

 

What detail? Other than conversational detail, the world is unnaturally stale and lifeless. There is next to no ambiance in this game. Any of the cool cut scenes are quickly forgotten thanks to spending forever and a day getting to and from the objectives.

 

As for the quick travel comment, it can only be used every 30 minutes and half the time, the turn in area is nowhere near the closest travel point. Let's not forget that the hub always turns out to not have a flight point for some reason as well...

[displaynameinuse]

Im not against fetch and kill quests, but the way they are designed in this game are just poor.

 

The gameworld is poorly laid out, and the mob placement is abysmal. Combat in PvE bores me to tears.

 

Thats not so in other games.

 

Walking into a big glowing door makes me shudder, knowing that I will have to traverse long boring corridors with packs of mobs set up every 20 yards.

 

How is killing the same pack of mobs 15 times to get to a quest object considered good game design? Its linear garbage and a complete time waster.

 

In WoW, or any other MMO for that matter, you are not so confined.

[Ruinerx]

WoW's quests, character story lines or general game play never grabbed me by the throat and not let go like this game has. If you think that there isn't much of a difference, then I think you're hitting the spacebar too frequently. To each their own I guess.

 

Only one other game has grabbed a hold of me like this and that was Ultima Online. I have been gaming since the mid 70's, have played every MMO out there at a high level (USA firsts in WoW, world top 25's in WoW, etc. etc.) and as fun as those were, this game has topped it within the first 32 levels on 3 different toons.

 

The immersion is so good that my wife is playing. My wife has despised MMO's since Ultima Online. HATED them. Today, she is addicted worse than I am. I love it.

 

I wish you well and I hope you find what you're looking for. Good luck! Hope to see your return in the near future.

 

In WoW, for instance, I could spend HOURS roaming around doing absolutely NOTHING but sight seeing and still have fun. Why? Because the game had an awesome atmosphere and ambiance to it. You weren't constricted by the linear "tunnels" everywhere. Sure, it's awesome to go from planet to planet and some of the zones are HUGE, but damn near lifeless and empty. After the leveling charm wears off for people, what incentive is there going to be to level an alt without spacebaring through everything? You don't even get to chose a different planet flow for leveling. In wow, you could chose to level through several different zones per level bracket. That option was there from day ONE!

 

My big problem is that I love hardcore stuff like raiding and getting in top ranks worldwide, but at the same time, I love just running around and killing time when I'm not busy with anything. There isn't much to see in this game after you do the quests. I don't even want to bother exploring because there is nothing to see and i dread having to kill umpteen mobs to get there.

 

This game should have been marketed more as a GW competitor than a WoW competitor. I feel like I fell for the hype machine and am now 60 bucks short of where I was before.

[Valkyriane]

I have to agree poster above me and OP. even I like the game mostly.