[Dps] Maximized dps spec theory

[KalanSteel]

Maximized dps spec, what you guy think about it ?

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801ZrsMrobcoZfGMbzG.1

 

I'm not 50 yet, but I think, that in theory it could be the most damage output spec using plasma cell.

 

Your thoughts ?

 

Important : I'm not saying THIS IS THE SUPA POWERFUL BUILD EVER, OF ALL TIME, it's a pure speculation thread, so relax and keep the discussion constructive.

 

EDIT : changed something in my spec

Edited January 2, 2012 by KalanSteel

[Ralos]

Battering Ram isn't worth it unless your taking Fire Pulse. You're going to have a hard time keeping your ammo up when you're not in HEC and Cell Generator when you're speced to use Ion Pulse.

 

This is a PvE build, right? Why are you considering it? Did you just want Gut and IR?

[KalanSteel]

I thought about DoT with this spec for PvE, but could probly work in PvP too.

 

Yup, the only problem i saw too is the ammo regeneration, but it has the EXACT same ammo regen then Assault basic spec.

 

Yes I think Ion Pulse could be used as a filler.

 

I think we'll need further testing to answer those questions

[Kozor]

I'm also interested in this build but the only thing that's been bugging me about it is that Combat Tactics only affect your next HIB which means that I would have to spam Gut if I'm proccing HIB with Ion Pulse while Stock Strike is on cooldown (as that would be the only way to grant +25% to crit), which sucks because Gut should only be used once every 15 secs per opponent.

[Chasted]

I'm not a fan of Containment Tactics; 10 seconds isn't really enough imo. Move those points into Cell Generator because there is hardly anything wrong with having too much energy.

[KalanSteel]

Cell generator will be useless with the build, the build use Plasma Cell, not High Energy Cell

[aRtFuL]

Actually I forsee this build to be pretty inferior in dps as opposed to maxing out Tactics or Assault specs.

 

In terms of the Tactics spec, you are missing out some of the most advantageous aspect of the spec - Pulse generator is damn powerful combined with Battering Ram, combat tactics and fire pulse. Your direct damage will be so high when you do the rotation Fire Pulse -> stockstrike, gut (HIB when combat tactics is up for either one) -> ion pulse 5 times (use stockstrike when the free one procs, and use HIB when the crit one procs) and than unleash pulse cannon. You will do so much damage from that and be quite ammo efficient because of the crits, damage increase and free stockstrikes.

 

Your tree lacks all the key components that makes tactics work.

 

Similarly, if you analyse Assault spec the same way (won't go into details again), you can see that you are also missing components that make Assault work.

Edited January 3, 2012 by aRtFuL

[Chasted]

Cell generator will be useless with the build, the build use Plasma Cell, not High Energy Cell

 

Crap, always forget that.

[Asolar]

Agree with artfull here, our trees seems pretty set in term off they are most effectives if you got full into it. Its all about the combos and reactives and ammo effectiveness for max dps.

 

Having boths gut and incendiary round is nice burst damage but i just cant see it very effective in a long fight compare to what your missing.

[Dersu]

I do not think that fully speccing into one tree automatically means it is a more effective. A lot of the telents in a given tree have zero influence on DPS e.g. putting 3 points into Soldier's Endurance in the Assault tree is a waste. You would be much better off putting those points into Focused Impact (Tactics), Intimidation (Shield), Brutal Impact (Shield) and/or Demolition (Tactics).

 

I personally am largely specced into Assault Specialist, but will not take many skills that do not effect my damage (or ammo conservation/recovery) instead putting them into relevant skill in the other trees (as above).

 

This is just my opinion of course.

[KalanSteel]

There's a couple of points that can be moved for your convenience in the spec, the 2 pts in Soldier's Endurance could be moved to Parallatic Combat Stims.

[bbqsauced]

I'd have to agree with Artful. This build is vastly inferior to a full Tactics or Assault Specialist build for PvE dps, especially at 50.

 

You're essentially trading off the higher tier Assault talents for...Gut, Battering Ram (you won't have Fire Pulse, either) and Combat Tactics. A lot of the big damage increases happen later in both trees, which you miss with this build. (And in general, is the issue with any hybrid build for Vanguard pve dps)

 

The only reason you should be looking at hybrid dps builds is for PvP, and even then I would recommend against it unless you needed certain utility talents in order perform a specific function for your team, or wanted to sacrifice a bit of damage for survivability (shield spec)

[KalanSteel]

Is those affirmations have been tested or they are pure speculation too ?

 

Because I don't know how a 15sec CD that do barely more then 40% dmg then Ion Pulse would be TERRIBLY better then a free (auto-crit) High Impact bolt shot every 5-6sec.

Edited January 3, 2012 by KalanSteel

[bbqsauced]

Is those affirmations have been tested or they are pure speculation too ?

 

Because I don't know how a 15sec CD that do barely more then 40% dmg then Ion Pulse would be TERRIBLY better then a free (auto-crit) High Impact bolt shot every 5-6sec.

 

I haven't tested your build in specific, but I have played both Tactics and Assault Specialist @50 quite a bit. My analysis comes not so much from what you're missing in Tactics, but what you're missing in Assault Specialist. (As in general, I'm not a fan of Fire Pulse either, although it is pretty essential to the Tactics build)

 

Your view here seems somewhat narrowed to specific talents. I would suggest against that, as you are missing the importance of other talents in the tree, and its those talents combined that normally attribute to better dps overall. For instance, I would wager that Assault Trooper, for what would be just 2 more talents for you in the Assault tree, is vastly superior than almost all the stuff you picked up post-Gut in Tactics. Rain of Fire almost equally so as well. You are forced to make a tradeoff between Combat Tactics and Assault Trooper - mathematically though, I think Assault Trooper ends out on top.

 

That's just one comparison. You're also missing out on Burnout and Assault Plastique, both of which are solid dps increases. As others have mentioned here, Pulse Generator, Havoc Training, and Fire Pulse all add up to be a pretty significant boost as well. You are sacrificing a LOT just for auto critting HIB. Just because an ability crits more, does not mean it does better dps than everything else. It's a dps increase, to be sure, but is is measurable along with the other talents, and is, in general, not nearly worth as much as you are sacrificing.

[KalanSteel]

It's true that Assault Plastic seems to hit very hard, hmmmm... think my theory is busted

[bbqsauced]

Nothing is stopping you from testing, and remember that respecs reset every week. I do suggest that you try both full Tactics and Assault Specialist. I bet you'll find one you feel pretty comfortable with. Edited January 3, 2012 by bbqsauced

[aRtFuL]

Just because an ability crits more, does not mean it does better dps than everything else. It's a dps increase, to be sure, but is is measurable along with the other talents, and is, in general, not nearly worth as much as you are sacrificing.

 

Exactly.

 

At the end of the day it is important imo to look at the overall synergy of the damage increase and abilities rotation that the spec as a whole gives, rather than just one boon in the spec.

 

There is a reason why the major builds that are out there for dps are usually some variation of 31 Tactics 10 assault or 31 assault 10 tactics or 31 assault 5 tactics 5 shield or any other similar variation. These builds have great synergy.