Get some HP. Seriously, do everything you can to get ~20k. It'll actually make those defensive stats valuable.

/facepalm Sometimes I wonder why I even try here. Go on, keep believing false claims. I'm sure it'll do this community good.

I wanted to touch on a few things here, since I see a lot of misinformation floating about. It worries me to see interest in PvP tanking being redirected due to some experiences that have been shared here, and I want to at least try to stem some of that. PvP tanking is entirely viable (with all tanking classes, I might add) and is actually necessary in competitive PvP. There are very few of us though, and I don't want to see our numbers dwindle any further. I want this to be an open discussion, for the benefit of all tanking classes in PvP. Please feel free to add your thoughts, but I would like to keep things constructive. The "Tanking Gear" Debate I've been seeing this a lot lately. The general feeling is that tanking gear doesn't seem to add any significant survivability, compounded on the discovery that there are a bundle of attacks that bypass all sorts of our tanking stats. The latter discovery is actually widely irrelevant - attack types that bypass certain defensive stats are pretty standard in MMO design, and it's no different in SWTOR. It's actually not part of the issue, which will make some sense as I explain further. The former item - tanking gear not noticeably adding to survivability - is actually true, pre level 50. As of now, it is actually impossible to achieve the tanking stats threshold you need to make an impact in the 1-49 bracket, thanks to the Bolster system. The Bolster System and PvP Tanking Defensive stats are broken down much further than DPS stats are, and as a result, you have to have a good combination of all of them to achieve a significant impact in survivability. However, you can't get enough of those stats on any gear below 50, and the Bolster system actually brings you to suboptimal levels. The big culprit here, though, is HP. Everyone is undervaluing the importance of HP, yet it is so vital to how tanks perform in this game. With proper tanking stats, 1 HP on a tank goes a lot further than 1 HP on a dps or healer. The reason tanking stats don't seem to add any survivability is because we don't have a big enough health pool for the mitigation to make any meaningful effect. This has direct gameplay implications. Guard is a vastly important ability in the playstyle of PvP tanks. Remember though, that when used, we share 50% of that damage. The Bolster system simply doesn't provide us enough health to really utilize Guard in a meaningful way that doesn't basically suicide us. As it stands, right now the only way to get increased health levels is with heals - so if you plan on doing any pre 50 tank PvP, you HAVE to have a healer. Without one, you cannot properly perform as a PvP tank. The Bolster system is the direct culprit here. Tanks should pretty much be ahead of other classes by 4-5k hp. (Yes, that much.) Yet, bolstering only gives us an extra 1k, maybe 2k tops. It's this issue that needs tackled before delving into the other tanking stats, or examining attacks that bypass defenses. I think, though, that once the HP problem is addressed, you'll see a lot of our survivability/functionality issues pre 50 go away. The PvP Tank @ 50 The road isn't over once you reach 50, but you can start the walk into sunset. Once you start getting Columni/Champions gear, you'll begin reaching suitable mitigation levels, and PvP will become a lot more fun. This is why you see so few PvP tanks though. It's a tough road to get to the point where you actually feel like you function correctly, but once you're there, it's awesome. (And in my opinion, worth it if you are a fan of the tanking style of gameplay) So having reached this point on both a Vanguard and Juggernaut, I wanted to at least let you guys know there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Why post in the Juggernaut Forums? I feel like Juggernauts/Guardians have a lot of extra frustrations that add up to making the road to a PvP tank incredibly difficult. My biggest frustration coming from a Vanguard to a 100% melee class (Vanguards are a <10m class, which makes a difference, believe me) is dealing with positional issues in PvP. A Juggernauts range of effect is much smaller, and they feel like they are punished for it due to buggy game mechanics. When attacks don't fire, or enemies' positions don't register correctly, it can be hard to feel like you put on any pressure as a tank, as you already do less damage than other specs. While these issues will still effect you even when properly geared, they don't feel as punishing since you can last a lot longer. Stick it out guys! Overall Comments I'm only here to share my observations. I think in general, people are quick to scrutinize talent trees and skills, when there are actually other (and larger) issues that end up being the cause of the problem. This doesn't mean that there should be some talent changes or what have you, but I think a lot of our woes come from the implementation of certain systems, or those systems functioning incorrectly. (ie., bolster, pvp positioning) In this, I want us to actually strive for some meaningful changes. We can't realistically make a lot of "buff" or "nerf" calls without these systems operating correctly in the first place, nor would I want to make them without any way to realistically compare data. So this is kind of a call out to you guys. Take it for what you will, feel free to bash me if you want, but please, do some rational observation on your own. Don't give up on PvP tanking.

Been leveling as Immortal, mainly using Vette. Do the bonus series and stay a few levels ahead of the zone you're in, and you kill much faster while being able to use a DPS companion. It's a lot more enjoyable.

Vanguard and Juggernaut player here. He is highly exaggerating. I've gotten 280k before in a really intense Voidstar match, but that was more a complement of my group, not myself. You can't achieve 280k without a good team. I basically didn't die, and didn't stop fighting. 120k - 150k is a pretty good average for most PvP geared Shield Spec Vanguards (with tank gear of course) My Jugg is only 39 right now, but I don't see those types of numbers being hard to get. You guys falling around the same @ 50?

How are you bored? I'm level 50 and I still can't seem to find the time to do everything I want to do in the game.

The standard 31/8/2 works fine. I find Energy Blast to be useful in operations, but I'd wager you can get away with sacrificing it for Gut if you really wanted. The main problem with Energy Blast right now is not so much its ammo gain, but how horrific the delay is to use the ability. Once that's fixed, I don't see people hating on it as much.

I'm having some issues tanking the last phase of Soa, mainly lining him up for the falling pylons to break his invuln shield. I set my camera to max view distance, and enable the option (forget what its called) that lets me pan around my character without the view resetting from behind. It still seems like the distance isn't enough to really get a good idea of where it is dropping. I end up having to point my camera up, and depth perception at that view is limited. I've been able to get close enough so that the pylons will hit him, but I almost always get hit myself. Any tanks have some tips on how to get around the limitations with the camera controls?

Was about ready to post, the OP was on to something, just needed some tweaking. My question though is: Is Focused Impact better than Static Surge? How much of a survivability hit do you take without having Counterattack, Ion Shield, and Power Armor? Right now I've been using full Shield Spec with great results in PvP due to my survivability, but this spec intrigues me a bit.

The bottom few tiers are fine for splashing a few points into (I grab a lot there for Assault). I think people are just generally finding that Tactics as a whole isn't that great. (i.e., fully speccing into the tree) My experiences would match that as well, but both Shield Spec and Assault utilize talents from the lower parts of that tree.

Hate to hijack the thread, but I've been 50 since release day, and i've done quite a bit of PvP so I'll at least throw in my experiences. Healers aren't a threat alone if you know how to handle them, which is using Riot Strike/Storm to keep them locked down for the majority of the fight. (Back out of melee range to get a Storm off if you have to) Save Cryo Grenade/Neural Surge until they're low and Riot Strike is on cooldown, and finish them off with a good Stockstrike -> High Impact Bolt. Played correctly, your dps should be slightly more than they can handle, so you'll get them down eventually. Other tanks end up being your closest match, and a well-played Assassin tank can be a huge threat if they manage to get an opener on you. Stealth Scan becomes insanely important in this matchup, sometimes deciding the victor right from the beginning. DPS classes shouldn't give you many problems unless they swarm you (and it then becomes a non 1v1 situation). Do be wary of geared/good Marauders though, as they can do a number to you. Fortunately, good Marauders are few and far between, at least on my server. If you're on top of your game though, you shouldn't have any problems taking them out. You should be able to survive Concealment Operatives openers, (most don't take me below 60%) and after that they're pretty simple to take down, just don't let them get away. If you're really into PvP, I suggest getting Biochem. The reusable health pack is absolutely insane for us. I've had Alderaan games where I literally can't die defending a node, mainly due to being able to drag out the fight long enough to continually use it. (Obviously, call in reinforcements if your node gets swarmed though) Overall, you should not be worried if you're looking to do some tanking pvp. We're in a good spot.

This is the coolest one I've found so far. (at least, in my opinion) I still used it at 50 until I got my PvP one, which doesn't look as cool.

Nothing is stopping you from testing, and remember that respecs reset every week. I do suggest that you try both full Tactics and Assault Specialist. I bet you'll find one you feel pretty comfortable with.

I haven't tested your build in specific, but I have played both Tactics and Assault Specialist @50 quite a bit. My analysis comes not so much from what you're missing in Tactics, but what you're missing in Assault Specialist. (As in general, I'm not a fan of Fire Pulse either, although it is pretty essential to the Tactics build) Your view here seems somewhat narrowed to specific talents. I would suggest against that, as you are missing the importance of other talents in the tree, and its those talents combined that normally attribute to better dps overall. For instance, I would wager that Assault Trooper, for what would be just 2 more talents for you in the Assault tree, is vastly superior than almost all the stuff you picked up post-Gut in Tactics. Rain of Fire almost equally so as well. You are forced to make a tradeoff between Combat Tactics and Assault Trooper - mathematically though, I think Assault Trooper ends out on top. That's just one comparison. You're also missing out on Burnout and Assault Plastique, both of which are solid dps increases. As others have mentioned here, Pulse Generator, Havoc Training, and Fire Pulse all add up to be a pretty significant boost as well. You are sacrificing a LOT just for auto critting HIB. Just because an ability crits more, does not mean it does better dps than everything else. It's a dps increase, to be sure, but is is measurable along with the other talents, and is, in general, not nearly worth as much as you are sacrificing.

I'd have to agree with Artful. This build is vastly inferior to a full Tactics or Assault Specialist build for PvE dps, especially at 50. You're essentially trading off the higher tier Assault talents for...Gut, Battering Ram (you won't have Fire Pulse, either) and Combat Tactics. A lot of the big damage increases happen later in both trees, which you miss with this build. (And in general, is the issue with any hybrid build for Vanguard pve dps) The only reason you should be looking at hybrid dps builds is for PvP, and even then I would recommend against it unless you needed certain utility talents in order perform a specific function for your team, or wanted to sacrifice a bit of damage for survivability (shield spec)