This hurts the entire advanced class- healers and DPS. You want to complain healers have been running a DPS set bonus, blame Bioware for the lack of actual set bonus we can viably take.

We still have our susceptibility for stunlock and none of the healers perform past what DPS can do in PvP- and trust me, the PvPers would be screaming to the high heavens if operatives somehow managed to defeat the overall nerf to healing- without any nerf, the changes to sorc are probably more than enough to put sorc healers back firmly as the 'best'. Operatives just have better mobility than mercs. This needs to be addressed now. We've been more balanced in this tier compared to the last two tiers as healers and it's simply through not being overpowered like the mercenary/commando but being by competitive. And as I've said, if we were really that naturally strong requiring at least a look at, you wouldn't see the high end raiders running double mercs in NiM and losing the advantages of running two different healers. The joke is there is no real healing set. Running Aggressive Treatment even with a nerf to Tactician's is a nerf again. We did not get a special healing set made for us. Same goes for mercs with Concentrated Fire.

(4) Tactical Overdrive additionally resets the cooldowns of Sever Tendon, and Toxic Scan. Gaining a Tactical Advantage increases your critical chance by 10% for 10 seconds. Can only happen once every 18 seconds. This change is incredibly bad form and leaves a horrible taste in my mouth- you left your original changes to sorceror/sage set bonuses alone because you'd affect the healing branch and you'd push this on operative/scoundrel healers, weakening their burst via our crit chance, not only by percentage but putting it on a longer CD? For heaven's sake, make it so when operative/scoundrel healers put on the set, we retain the original four piece or actually class balance. It's not our fault there was only one viable set for healers and no, the Aggressive Treatment set remains a situational joke only helped by the fact there's the shield probe joke set. There's no justification for that. For 4.x-5.x, we were the healer you brought along as long as we were good enough to make up for our class's weakness. You had to bring a sorcerer/sage healer, they were essential and usually tag teamed by a mercenary healer. We have always had the highest skill ceiling among the healing classes and had to work incredibly hard to bring our full potential to bear. We are not overperforming- we're in such a position that some operative/scoundrel healers forgo the strongest amps for our class to increase burst via medtech. Remember when your 'solution' to fixing our burst issues was to change a utility instead of just letting us have what would really have increased our burst which was full upfront + HoT, and before was a sad joke where you specced out of a heal that produced more sustain for still, a fairly weak single target heal with merely the small protection buff Infusion/Kolto Pack provides. The lack of Veteran's Edge is beside the point, we are the least played healer in the game for a reason and we have a right to perform on an equal footing to the other healers in NiM. An equal footing is not the compliment I got in my progression last tier- "You're good, I didn't realize operative healers could heal well enough to do nightmare" to the point you buff sorcerer/sage healers, weaken mercenary/commando healers enough to stop their double stack ability and create the following situation in NiM/MM: You must have a sorcerer/sage healer. A mercenary/commando healer will make up for their AoE and provide burst healing- only bring an operative/scoundrel healer if they are very, very good but despite their ability, if they can play the other matching healer quasi proficiently, it'd probably be in the group's best interest for them to do so. It has been said we don't sit around on the forums, we're fairly quiet and we don't ask to be made into overpowered gods- turning around and doing this basically says us being competitive as a whole was an accident and that you either are going after the DPS and we're the collateral damage and don't deserve the same consideration as sorcerer/sage healers or you don't understand the class's raw numbers are our sustained potential that anyone doing anything competitive in this game doesn't care about and even on fights where it's good... the issue can always be outburst.

I'd like to hear about this stealth nerf. And secondly, operative healers are not overperforming. I know operative DPS are fairly strong but operative healers have been sitting in that weird middle ground place that might be lost if they overbuff sorc healers. Our lack of burst without VE stacks means that some groups don't do a merc/op healing meta, they just go with two mercs. Anything that hurts how the Tactician set performs will be very painful for operative healers. I mean the DPS increase is nice in a NiM setting where it helps the spare GCDs count but this is the issue that came with having one set for DPS and healers which is any changes would have to be levelled against the DPS branch itself.

What stealth nerf to Tactician's are you talking about?

My pet interest with Kolto Infusion/Pack is that you should get the upfront heal (with no reduction from taking utility) and it's HoT (utility is still worth as a DCD and the auto two stack). It'd single handedly balance our upfront healing issues but from a PvE NiM perspective, this buff isn't as scary as you make it out to be in sustaining your probes and is an interesting change but fairly weak as far as increase in our effective healing. I'm assuming you're talking from an arena perspective as opposed to an 8v8. I'd much rather my change because it'd pack more punch burst wise than their change which at best is just an extra refresh and certainly not one I can use group wide and well, I want an extra fast cheap tick, surgical probe. It's not as scary as the changes you're making out. There's every chance the sorc changes will put them as too much in PvE considering how long the meta was a sorc healer and then a merc co healer. My feedback here is, don't make us overpowered but please, don't allow a situation where we're the least viable healer in PvE. There's nothing about this that really decreases the skill threshold required to play operative. I mean, you have a lot of operatives running around with the amps that make them the weaker version of a merc than the BiS ones which produce the best numbers because why rely on the class's mainstay? This won't increase the number of operatives in PvE, especially with sorc healers getting a buff. I would hazard a guess this won't increase operatives in PvP either. You might see more sorcs again.

No one in this thread debating over this would mandate gear or even a level 75 for SM content. The only people with those requirements are SM players.

I've been healing for a shorter span than you raiding and I just did a guild pug of DP NiM- we're a majority APAC group so there were some fun pings to server. We had some pangs across the bosses but we focused and ended up one shotting Council. My probe key even came off and I was hitting the switch as much as I could, on three to four hours sleep. I have been NiM healing for a shorter time span, I have gone further and well, everybody knows my inventory and other memes. I had to focus but I had to do my job and not worry about what magical fairy stacks I did or did not have. Do the same.

New gear sets because of course they have to have us chasing carrots.

I use BR and reorganizing took longer than zippy zippy patch. It's your end.

There's a difference between what a stacked group pulls and your average group but I'm of the opinion at this point, I'd rather have one reality without the devs swinging between two mindsets, screw under/overtuned. So if they really want to establish this whole (especially with Gods, where we're undertuned and things need adjustments- still not major, I agree for balance)- take Veteran's Edge out of HM/VM and disable the guild perks in HM/VM. How is NiM supposed to get any new blood if all they know is a form of bolster before they hit Master Mode? I mean, the lack of Veteran's Edge is either a message that it's overtuning people, in which case it has no place in VM/HM (I have been complaining about guild perks since they were introduced) or it's to cater to a portion of the NiM/MM community who are bored. Progression is how people get better so if you're going for this, either put those stacks back or have no way, shape or form of a bolster in way of VE/guild perks in VM/HM which were originally mechanically lighter/lower check versions of NiM/MM fights which prepared people for Master Mode. You're shooting the VM/HM prog groups in the foot.

Yes, I would like some acknowledgement of the intended fix or at least a timeline. I mean I get immediately removing the Veteran's Edge stacks even with the unintended consequence of leaving it harder than it was on tier to the point a majority of people who cleared in 5.10 wouldn't be able to reclear. Because it was either a case of VE undertuning it below the other NiMs or a kneejerk reaction based on a few. I want it at 5.10 difficulty personally, shove VE in a closet for all I care, but it was about stopping clears hopefully because it was too undertuned to provide the 5.10 level challenge. Gods from the Machine has to be at 5.10 difficulty at least. It's not about providing a challenge to the fraction of original clearing groups who could maybe squeak out a kill, while the rest under current conditions would basically be running around with easier achievements. There was a big rush to kill the operation on tier and now it looks like all those players rushed and killed it when the raid was easier. That's not how on tier raids are supposed to work. Nightmare/Master Mode raiders might be fewer but simply leaving a raid in a broken, overtuned state for months on end without any acknowledgement isn't fair to a community that went without a new raid for years. Put your efforts into making Dxun NiM something challenging that we can be proud we beat on tier in terms of making content harder.

As an operative/scoundrel heal main in NiM/MM- stop crying. My class is the least played healer and even the power creep of 6.0 still allows sorcs a spot at the table- if my class was as weak as they were, we'd be begging for spots in NiM because we're that sensitive to changes. To play one at this level with power creep, you have to be trusted to play an operative/scoundrel healer. When they nerfed all the healers in 5.x, they ripped through us despite a delay- in which they took away a HoT which is now utility dependent. Yes, we kind of need the double probe/defensive and the HoT but it should be built into our passives. So, we had zip help with burst. We're still considered the worst healers at burst- we can just mitigate it through our HoTs and what burst we do have. They only went after us because as a sustain class, we put out high HPS- in prog or heavy damage sustain fights, we lap up the numbers, otherwise our numbers are quite easily shut down and pointless. I agree that PvP affecting PvE and vice versa is a pain in the *** but I take it as a mark of pride I can play my class at this level despite it being harder. The issue many sorc healers have is they aren't used to the same and at the same time mercs became the easiest by a crazy margin. Personally, I like anyone who can play a tank in NiM. I don't care what class they're playing- if they can tank NiM/MM content, I couldn't care less if they were a PT or a Jugg- and any healer would tell you sins are great at suddenly taking a huge spike. The problem is- the devs aren't going to listen, Lightning will be nerfed, Madness will... I just feel sorry for PvE sorcs who main Madness and Corruption will likely get some epic buff as though the last two expansions of being overtuned for their tools wasn't a problem in which they nerfed the survivability of the DPS specs repeatedly trying to retune the class. I don't think Bioware know how to balance the sorceror/sage advanced class so they keep overreacting and doing what they'd do to any other spec. But to the point, no one's class is special, Bioware will not stop and listen to you irregardless of whatever you post because it's your class.

And healers are yet again left guessing and wondering where your meta is going to leave us. Giving us details about targets and stuff now would allow us to give you constructive feedback which could actually be taken onboard.

Um, firstly operative/scoundrel is your HoT class and it doesn't even have HoT spreading (nanotech is an AoE bounce HoT heal) and secondly, your class is viable- that's asking to be broken.

Can we get some sort of idea what you think 'intended' targets are for all three healers? Tanks are getting hit harder and while sorcs were more or less fine without just needing a better tactical, all except one healer class is effectively healing for less than last expansion. If you're buffing sorc/sage healer's bubbles (which might be a step in the too much direction) compared to simply buffing their force surge chance. Operatives/scoundrels, for example are balanced in all but our burst (the loss of auto crit for Injection set bonus) and we can compensate for that somewhat- we've always been in a precarious position and are incredibly fragile to being broken either way. But even with periodic restoration or medtech- we are effectively healing less of the health pool in PvE compared to DTPS and that's before you touch PvP. Same goes for sorcs. The only healer overperforming is merc/commandos- mostly for that one tactical. All that needs to be done is to tweak that tactical because as always, whenever you break a healer having energy requirements, you break the healer. But outside of that- healing got a broad nerf bat in 6.0 and I feel like we should know now what your thoughts are- is one healer branch overperforming, or are the other two underperforming or are you sort of nuts and think healers healing for less of a health pool need broad nerfs 5.x style?

That roaming mend tactical is potentially balanced- the rocket fuel vapours is anything but.

Sorcs were too strong for their entry point and that in 5.10. Half the problem is a situation which is far rarer these days for me as an operative/scoundrel heal main but noticeable now in spades across the board. Merc/mando heal spec needs to lose that tactical or have it's main power altered into something less god mode, it actively confuses me they denied sorc/sage healers the roaming mend tactical and put something this brokenly overpowered in the game. They can't even begin to look at class balance for healers until that happens because Bodyguard/Combat Medic has no true energy management with that tactical and can switch into their ultra burst at will. It'll probably be easier to tell where things sit afterwards. The rule of thumb is if you can double class stack in a NiM Apex boss without a drawback, for ops/scoundrels, it's burst, for sorcs/sages, it's AoE. For mercs/commando healers, their current state overpowers what was once their weakness which was sustain/healing over time. Anything like this is always going to overshadow other healing specs. I'm not saying they shouldn't give you guys the roaming mend tactical, because they should. I'm just saying it's hard to see what they need to do when one healer class is like that.

I'm going for they got globalled.

Yeah, the sheer amount of people afraid to admit they enjoy a movie that's not reviewed well by critics. I mean, to me, Rogue One's greatest weakness is it's essentially a very safely played, can't change anything, tribute to everything people wanted to see while adding enough gritty parts to appeal to critics. Honestly, critics in 2019 would eviscerate the entire original trilogy... because they have always had a bias against science fiction. Star Wars as the most successful science fiction franchise of all time galls them so they've always wanted the series to be more palatable to 'them' if a sci-fi series has to be this big. And as for Rey's power... Because this game is seen as dead weight to the franchise. EA can make Star Wars games and add a mini pet based off the most recent one, but they were probably told in no uncertain terms they weren't allowed to make any items which tied this to IX until such-and-such date.

I don't give a damn what a bunch of 'hip' reviewers, too much in love with things like Rogue One which played it so damn safe have to say about the new Star Wars movie and the sheer whining of people who profess to be fans of the franchise drive me insane. The fact we had an entire stagnant film in between the seventh and ninth movie that was essentially filler can be blamed on one of those idiots who didn't understand the series and it has nothing to do with superweapons. The real fight in that film was between the Jedi and Sith finally coming to a head and the antithesis to the relationship (Papaltine and Vader) that doomed the galaxy in the prequels. This game's issue with story is they've never gotten back to the height and can never take the story as far as they can because of MMO constraints. To be blunt, The Last Jedi itself and all the questionable or fan service Star Wars films have been better than the story telling in this game which if you take away the rose coloured glasses of RPing for a moment, really hasn't managed to be better than KOTOR or its sequel and just got its *** handed to it by Jedi: Fallen Order because they can progress and tell a whole story. The frustrating lack of imagination is this game and the illusion of character choice.

According to some people who've talked to Matt, it was a deliberate choice to remove Veteran's Edge from Gods NiM, just one of those 'not in the patch notes' things so not a bug. It's just knowing where their tuning is with our scaling is what I wanted to know.

We're assuming right now that each boss instance and trash in Master Mode/Nightmare Gods from the Machine will have us scaled to a particular gear rating- could we get an official anwser to the scaling ilevel we will have in Tyth (which we currently assume is 248), Aivela and Esne, Nahut, Scyva and Izax. Thank you.

You have to add the crafted tacticals into the general game outside of crafting- unlike 258 where you could earn the gear and not shortcut buy it- you have some of the best tacticals for respective classes or decent ones, locked behind the exact issue you're trying to stamp out in game. All you have to do is add them as a drop chance in PvP crates and in NiM/MM operations. It'll balance things out so that the people who need them have a way (still your RNG which is still pretty bad) to get them. Endgame main gear pieces should not be exclusively tied up in crafting.

It affected multiple people who live in different countries (APAC) so I think it's their routing.