That's because they are the rarest tree in the game ;p. There is so much bashing against the AP tree, by ignorant PT's that most AP's hide .

Read my comment two of any class will insta-gib a healer. A single Pyro will not insta gib a decent healer. 2 scoundrels beats a healer hands down. 2 tanks can beat a healer it may take a year but that healer will be unable to do anything. Name a tree and a class that's dps and they can lock down and insta gib a healer. I ran into 2 sorcs from Jawa Bunny Ranch and Sleens on two different occassions, they farm kill healers. The two madness sorcs wiped out two-three equally geared people without breaking a sweat. You can't say PYRO owns a class and then say two of them can kill a healer. You jump back and forth. Reread my entire comment. The only difference between the two is that after 3 seconds is over your damage is backloaded, and AP's is frontloaded. The big difference is CGC. The fact that you think that TD and RS is the big difference shows the lack of proper study on your end. I have spent hours with other pt's testing, studying, and running countless spreadsheets. Watching videos of PT's farming recruit gear people is in no way helpful or informational. Against equally geared targets over two attacks Immolate plus FP vs TD plus RS both hit for around 9k full crits. The key is delivery. TD plus RS is backloaded damage. Immolat plus FP is 1.5 second apart. The big difference over the span of a fight is CGC. Run the spreadsheets and do the tests. CGC is the gamebreaker not "Burst".

The gm of my guild feels the same as you. He actually does better with Pyro than I do, but he is significantly worse at AP than I am. The playstyle and the method of play doesn't jive with him. He even stated 3 times to me, I don't know how you do it Anam, because this is crap. The truth is it took me weeks to get the spec down pat. I can do 300-500k depending on wz and healers with Norse (a complete survival pvp spec). It's the lowest damage out of any single pvp PT tree. I can only do about 500 with pyro at best. With Full AP I do between 400-600 depending on the wz and the team we play. AP feel less dynamic than Pyro for many people because there is no RNG. It's the same damage all the time, no matter which attack you use. It's basic, simple, and lacks complexity. The complex part of it is you have to maintain 10 meters at all times which I do without too many issues.

Two of any class can blow up a healer, but thanks for your input. We have already stated that in the same amount of time that you did 19k AP can do 19k. The difference is in how it's delivered. The TD/RS combo takes 3 seconds to perform but it delivers all at once instead of two attacks. The gamebreaking feature of Pyro is CGC. Two CGC's on any target is as bad as two of the madness dots except it's repeatedly added to the target and spammable. CGC is what tilts Pyro over AP in "insta-gib" situations. I am still looking for my first very good Lightning sorc. I have seen decent ones, but the rarity of a good one is even more rare than an AP PT. Most PT's are Pyro simply because AP's lack of range is too confusing for them to make the change, that and the perma slow of CGC is ridiculously tough to give up. There is no "Burst" Difference over the span of 12 seconds both will have delivered the exact same damage with CGC being the difference between the two trees. TD hits as hard as immolate. Pyro's RS is more powerful, but FP is more powerful for AP at WH gear levels. FP can hit upwards of 3.5-4.4k on a crit (using simulations on a boss fight as well it's the second hardest hitting ability on AP) granted this is at max level with accuracy mods replaced with power. At max gear, a pyro's rs hits for as hard as an AP's FP. and an AP's RS hits as hard as a Pyro's FP. The difference is AP has a crap dot, and Pyro has the second best dot in the game attached to a ridiculous slow.

Pyrotechs are annoying, but cleansing and are easy to peel. I have a bucket of trouble with juggernaughts, because of all their stuns. Mara's are cleanseable though they do hurt, they only have one cc, the rest is pretty easy to get away from them. A sniper or commando I can't los and a Juggernaught are the worst.

Question 3: Would you give up 50 expertise for more cunning and endurance on bracers and/or Belt? By making the change to a modable bracer and belt you will give up 50 expertise per item because you can't swap armoring mods. However, you can add Black Hole Com armoring to your belt and bracers and the gloves mod to your bracers and belt. Can someone do a breakdown of what the difference between War Hero Belt and Bracers and maxed out Moddable Belt and Bracers?

What did you spec into in place of the Wounding Shots reduction? I couldn't imagine doing Wounding shots with it at 25 energy. I found the slow to be kind of meh except in like huttball or when kiting. Combined with Tendon blast though and we have a pretty good snare exchange when kiting and chasing. Without the slow, I was using tendon blast all the time, now that I have it I have reduced my usage. How are you using Vital more than Wounding? Are you tab vital shotting? I use vital once or twice per fight, and Wounding upwards of 4-6 times. As for the bonus to healing and extra uptime, Holy cow more uptime on my UH is definitely awesome. I almost wish I had one more point to get full usage of it. Let's keep this discussion rolling it's been fun learning.

I switched to a variation of your spec. I skipped the Alacrity boost, but I did move the points out of Cool Head and into healing bonus. I still need to get in the habit of healing during a fight. However, I saw no real difference in my energy drain outside of when I had to chain a vital shot - tendon blast - dirty kick together or close to each other. As long as I kept pugnacity rolling, my energy was rarely an issue. The slow is meh, but it's about as valuable as 15 seconds less on Defense Screen which is what I traded. I can't give up my extra crit - I am sitting at 39 percent and it's very nice. .

Yeah you caught my error. It's two piece Combat Medic plus 2 piece Combat Tech bonus. This is what I use. You get the bonus shield plus the stats are pretty close. You will have to sub out one of the mods to get rid of the Alacrity. I have no idea about the cone shape with the way the game's server reacts in pvp you just can't tell unless you do a test on three guys having each stand at different positions you would then test it. However, both the PFT and the Pulse Cannon have the same raidus but the Pulse cannon shows it better. Sometimes people will run through your flame thrower, but you won't know it until you see them slowed beside you. I hate that one boss in the FP with the three robots and the reflective shields. On my Scoundrel and on my AP I am always getting hammered.

That has been my experience as well. I generally refrain from the word "Burst" as there is a confusion as to how it's done. The biggest difference between Assault and Tactics is timed delay on TD/RS combo and Plasma Cell. Plasma Cell is amazing. But I digress, When I play my AP PT, I can beat just about any PT out there because Norse is so strong on survival and packs a wallop. The 6 percent reduction on the player you are fighting is better than people give it credit for. Pulse cannon with HTL is freaking amazing. The channeled bit is what bugs people. However you stated and so has several others that when fighting in a wz that 9210 is to each guy hit with it. I once dropped 3 guys who were attacking someone else with PFT (Pulse Cannon) slow plus boost in damage. Thanks for the feedback. Did you drop all the accuracy mods out of your gear at War Hero level? The only difference between Tactics and Assault in ranked is unless you are really good, Assault will always end with higher damage numbers. Plasma cell plus better range = more total damage. It's good to hear of another successful player who sees the vantage. Wait til you face those cursed Sents and players who mitigate all physical damage, and it does nothing to you. Fun stuff!

You never stated anything that was troll worthy. You simply stated that the lack of good players and the "idea" of pt's in general is the main issue at hand. This is what every AP player has tried to state in this thread. We have no desire to debate it. Look at the two points in the conversation where Dardack and I discussed the major misunderstanding of AP vs. Pyro. Dardack was an AP convert who went back to Pyro because the backloaded damage of TD/RS and OP CGC was too much to give up. I told several of my guildees that if they can't figure out AP after a week, to not frustrate themselves trying it. Everyone in my guild that has tried AP has done it because they saw me play it, and wanted to do something different. My GM eventually gave up because while he was within 70k damage at the end of a WZ. The playstyle frustrated him - He loves to smash and kite and Pyro fit what he enjoys doing more. He has no problem with people rolling AP because he sees it as easily viable. However you have to prove you can keep up with the team and play competitively with the spec.

You are correct the lack of good AP/Tactics players is what creates the issue. Plus you have Pyro players who make the switch and can't seem to do that well because they play it the same. There is one technical piece that's a bit misleading. Pyro doesn't have a single attack over the span of 3 seconds that hits harder than anything AP has over that same period of time. The difference is in how it's delivered. 1. TD plus RS is 8k instantly even though it takes 3 seconds or 2 Global Cooldwons but it's all backloaded. There is no difference in the time taken to reach it. Simply instead of 4k plus 4k it's 5k and 3k at one time because of TD's delayed hit. 2. Combustible Gas Cylinder is the single reason Pyro end up with higher damage and will end up with more damage in a warzone than an equally played AP player. Combustible Gas Cylinder is the best cylinder in the game and the rolling dots tick for significantly more than RB. IF you don't believe me roll AP with CGC and your overall damage will increase. A spammable 50 percent slow with a dot that ticks for 300 - 500 is way better than 30 percent slow with a tick of 150-300. I have repeated this using facts, numbers, and testing. AP and Tactics in a 1v1 battle will deliver the same amount of damage over the same period of time with the exception of CGC being the difference maker. The damage of Pyro's biggest hitters is equal to AP's biggest hitters of the same period of time. The difference is in method of delivery.

Shield tech to 20 - Pyro to 40 - and then anything you want is the right there in fastest way to level. Pyro gets really good around lvl 20.

I like your build. I was thinking of moving the points off Cool Head, because I haven't seen the return on it I like. Why not anatomy lessons? I use Dirty Kick and tendon blast all the time and figure the energy savings is worth it. I took smuggled defenses over the slow because there are so many better slows than mine, and I wanted the faster defense screen and faster escape. Have you ever thought about putting points in scar tissue? So you took points out of crit because you are near the cap already. That makes sense. I am still in bm gear so crit seems crazy important to me. Hmmm, I am going to try moving the points out of crit and taking the slow. Can I ask why Black Market Mods? How often are you healing yourself where the extra 4 percent is a must?

Thank you for your input. We all are better off having known you and heard from you. You have contributed greatly to the powertech forums. We shall sticky all you say for future players who wish to know greatness.

I am sure you are right. Because you are Liono, king of snarf, pyro god of Jung Ma. You are the greatest pvp player of all time, and all who dare cross your path are evildoers who must be vanquished. Only you may dictate who can play and who can't. Do not dare cross the paths with this man! No one ever successfully played any other tree to ranked play. Thank you for your input. We all are better off with your input. You have contributed greatly to the powertech forums. We shall sticky all you say for future players who wish to know greatness. Many great pvpers will now reroll to Jung Ma to see your greatness in action. Sleens and Jawa Bunny Ranch will come crying back to you for guidance because their pt's are tanks and therefore worthless. Thank you so much for showing me the errors of my ways.

ooo burn!! I bolded the best TWO parts. Please relearn the trees than talk to me. Anything you don't think of is NOT IMPORTANT. PYRO LIONO HAS SPOKEN! IT IS LAW. Can we please get input from tidus? I mean doesn't he stir up enough trouble without you?

ooo, like I said Wnk - too much logic for him to handle. I love it, because in his world no one ever groups up, and no one ever steps in a cone. PYRO RULES and Liono is the king of them all! All hail the Troll! Dangit, he got me again!

Pyro troll about to be incoming this is too much logic for him. Haha, This was my first thought but I refuse to reply to any post he makes. I am going to take the dardack and agooz method of ignoring the troll and hoping he goes away since logic isn't his strong suit. My favorite part of all his comments is when he goes this isn't personal. Than calls me an idiot 10 different times in 3 different posts, but hey it's not personal. I swear I must have farm killed him or trolled him in game sometime, or maybe I just never acknowledged him after he got killed. Meh. Dangit, I told myself I wouldn't get pulled in by the troll ARGH! Wait I do remember liono!! haha, oh man, this guy is epic. If I could I would tell you stories of him in WZ's. Haha, my brother fought them recently hahaa, oh man. But I digress I will leave it alone. I have to keep telling myself - I refuse to be drawn in by the troll.

I refuse to be drawn in by the troll.

I refuse to be drawn in by the troll.

I agree with just about everything you have posted. The Vigilence guys I have faced in a WZ are significantly harder to kill, and do way more damage to me as a healer than the focus monkeys. Focus guys are kick away now kill. I am in the process of leveling a Guardian tank because my guild desperately needs a good tank and we have a lot of good dps. The three builds I am looking at are as follows Unremitting Tank - I don't see how unremitting isn't amazing every time I get stunned during huttball or prevented immediately after a leap I scream give me unremitting! Jumping Bean - I really like Zealous leap and having a forth jump makes me laugh Vig/Tank Hybrid - Standard PVP hybrid - I am not a big fan but I can see it's potential. Force Sweep Tank - The awesome part is you can switch forms depending on what you want to do. But without Force Exhaustion your big Force Sweep hits will only come every minute. Anyways would love some feedback . But Guardians are seriously undervalued in WZ's .

What do you swap out for the alracity? Do you run the Utility belt build? I tend it use Flash Powder as an interrupt.

Find a guy in every team to stick near. Announce you are a tank at the outset. I love to toss guard on sentinels and dps vanguards ;p.

The downside to Alacrity is that it only boosts two heals cast times, the benefit is those cast times can get down to 1.5 sec cast times. I know a pvp healer whose heals are under 1.5 sec. She is incredibly hard to kill. However, I see your point. Spending points on something that only benefits a single heal seems like a waste. More power = better hots and better Medpac. It really depends on how you heal I guess.