Just to compare apples to apples..You were able to hit the level cap within 2 weeks of WoW's ORIGINAL release and then raid for the best gear? Did that happen when WoW first came out? (i actually have no idea) I played WoW for 4 months from release and casually quit at level 42..I picked up SWTOR, played at the same pace and hit 50 in 3 weeks! And this includes doing all of the optional content along the way! Dont think its an mmo prob, the pacing in this game is way off. And for the record i think the game has max 1 playthru worth of replayability (rep vs imp)... Too much overlap and repetition across all of the non-class same faction quests

500k concurrent would imply ~2380 concurrent / server (210 servers na and eu) Similarly, 2 million subs would imply ~9500 subs / server obviously not all servers are equal but based on the numbers cited do they align with what people are experiencing in game? There are a heckuva lot of light servers (i played on one). Are the heavy servers that heavy as to make up the rest of those numbers?

Is it truly world pvp if ilum is sharded? Best case scenario... Servers are packed, ilum is full. So under these circumstances how does a guild or group of friends get in without being split into 2+ instances with a 50/side cap? (or any cap)

In combination with some additional gameplay options it certainly would help break up the linear feel of everything. Say for example on voss you could actually build faction with one side and it legitimately altered your questing options, accessability to towns/resources, and npc hostility/friendliness to you, etc. Take that same concept, apply liberally across worlds, and youd have some interesting choices to make that you have to live with later. As it stands now, regardless of what you do nothing actually changes.

The sad thing is...with the way everything in this game is segregated (instances, factions, etc..) i wonder if they could actually pull off a true "server-wide" event from even a technical standpoint

The irony is that I always played solo classes (Necro in EQ) since like you, I am a casual gamer...it took me a very long time to hit 50 in EQ and by then they upped the level cap (I actually never hit max level out in my time there). The first point i raised is about the actual "impact" to the world. For example in EQ my PVE actions impacted the world permanently...as a human necro I was an evil character who couldnt even walk around in my own starter town without getting KOS'd by the town guards! I had to build up faction to eventually be able to walk around in the open. The second point is around the MM part of the MMORPG...what is the point of paying a subscription to play with other people when most of what you do doesn't even require or involve them? The way PVP, warzones, and instances are structured....you might as well be connecting to a 3rd party matchmaking service for a co-op minigame and have the main game be standalone KOTOR3

its not about just having a challenge, its about doing stuff that actually matters... as it stands nothing you do in the game really impacts the world or other players (even on PVP servers which is ridiculous) there is no need for an in-game community, no player politics, etc...the whole FP, WZ, instanced structure makes it more like a single player game with a co-op option rather than an mmorpg

First of all, totally agree with your post and many of the replies here, EQ1 was the best MMORPG i've played and its tied with AC1 for best PVP MMORPG in my mind. Secondly, it seems like alot of modern MMO's are missing key elements which really added to the experience in these games. Just off the top of my head, some of these elements were: -Death Penalties: Having severe consequences for death actually impacted how you played and made you a better player for it. -No Radar / Map: Every modern game has these and i think they take away a lot more form the experience than people realize. Hear me out on this one, in EQ1 you actually had to know your way around. Getting lost was a legitimate issue and it actually forced you to talk to other players to ask for directions. On the PVP servers it meant you could actually LOS people behind rocks or the land and you had skills like turning yourself into a Tree or Chair -Factions: Killing almost everything had an actual impact/consequence and you could change how npc's in towns and even dungeons regarded you by improving your faction standing with them -Non-linear storylines / advancement paths: Having multiple zones/areas/ways to advance added a lot of replay value and as mentioned in this thread -Open PVP: Being able to have meaningful PVP (with full looting and corpse camping ability) that impacted the actual politics in the game, dictating what dungeons, areas, and even towns you could and could not visit I suppose the gist of these things is that your actions could do two things that I feel are the actual point of playing an MMORPG vs just a regular RPG: 1. Impact and shape the world you played in 2. Impact other players (for better or worse)

Posted this in response to another thread but wanted to get broader input on some solutions to address the boring PVP The gist of these solutions is to give us true open world PVP on the PVP servers. Real PVP is being able to loot people's gear and disrupt their leveling areas, dungeons, hell even disrupt their ability to shop! Without this PVP is absolutely pointless. Solution 1: Open it up so that we can travel to all planets and zones for both factions and open up the ability to loot peoples gear (like the top 5 most valuable/expensive things they are carrying). People might hate this, but it would force everyone to balance the performance of the gear they wear with the risk of losing it (or at least losing very expensive death items). Solution 2: Make NON-instanced raid zones and dungeons that are contestable...SO WHAT if only 1 guild can kill XX Boss every XX hours/days...the fun is actually allowing players to fight over ownership and try to hold spots Solution 3: Same faction PVP...open it up so I can kill fellow repubs...not just so we can compete for non-instanced raid zones but particularly so the smack down can be laid on chest camping bots and warzone deserters The best PVP was old school EQ1 and AC1 (talking directly after release) where dying had severe penalties and players actually had an impact on each other, not this carebear co-op stuff with a chatroom These changes would allow players to shape the world and keep things interesting. As it stands now there isn't anything to do once you hit 50 but repeat the same recycled material over and over again

Screw frontiers, just give us true open world PVP on the PVP servers! Real PVP is being able to loot people's gear and disrupt their leveling areas, dungeons, hell even disrupt their ability to shop! Without this PVP is absolutely pointless. Solution 1: Open it up so that we can travel to all planets and zones for both factions and open up the ability to loot peoples gear (even bound stuff) Solution 2: Make NON-instanced raid zones and dungeons that are contestable...allowing players to actually fight over ownership (not that useless ilum crap) Solution 3: Same faction PVP...open it up so I can kill fellow repubs...particularly the chest camping bots Screw DAOC, the best PVP was old school EQ1 and AC1 (talking directly after release) where dying had severe penalties and players actually had an impact on each other, not this carebear co-op stuff with a chatroom These changes would allow players to shape the world and keep things interesting. As it stands now there isn't anything to do once you hit 50 but repeat the same recycled material over and over again

Totally agree, PVP was meaningful in AC1 and EQ1...death actually had consequences and guild alliances / world politics actually mattered because they had a direct impact on where you could and could not go to level/raid/explore...hell even shop! Ahwell, those were the days...

Yea some of the best pvp moments I've had in mmorpgs were legit guild wars over resources or coming to people's aid to lay a beatdown on gankers. I didn't do my research before picking up this game over the holidays and expected more (particularly on a PVP server). I gave up hope when I realized I had only had 5 or so open world PVP encounters by the time I reached Hoth...

Yes but the path to get that gear in the past MMORPGS I played for any sort of time (EQ1, AC1, AC2) was via non-PVP means. And they had open PVP so you had other options to win fights like bringing numbers, training mobs, etc... I suppose the problems i'm experiencing are magnified since i am playing Republic on a server that tops out around 50 players in the fleet at prime time. This really limits both the availability of people to raid with and the competitiveness of the PVP with the other side. Ultimately though, I'm finding the game rather pointless without the story. At least in EQ1 and AC1 you had a reason to PVP. You had to kill off other players/guilds to secure leveling spots, towns/supply sites, and raid zones (i played on full pvp servers). It just feels like there is no point to it in this game.

Because I rolled so many lvl 15s in the 10-15 WZ's i played on my way to 50?

This is a re-post of a reply to another thread i posted on my lunch break earlier today only to find the thread was deleted when i got home! but I still think this is a very valid point: /Rant on Background: I PVE'd through the story at what I thought was a casual clip, playing a few hours after work and on weekends, doing every bonus series and heroic that i could find a group for. I also threw in the odd WZ here or there and am sitting at only lvl 11 valor. Problem 1: I hit 50 just in time for this god awful bracket change and have absolutely zero chance to win/contribute to any WZ and get destroyed in any PVP encounter thanks to severe gear/expertise differentials...everyone in the 50s bracket is rolling with 5K more HP than me Problem 2: Trying to catchup in terms of gear is going to take forever (as a Repub)...not to mention that many WZ's are ending early due to lack of participants. Problem 3: There aren't any alternatives to PVP on WZ's or Ilum since my server (Cho Mai) is desolate and averages 40-50 (I'm being optimistic its mostly around 30-40 when i play) Repubs on the fleet during primetime and around 4-5 on Ilum Summary: There is absolutely NOTHING to do after you hit 50 and finish your story but PVP for gear (AND NO I WILL NOT REROLL AN ALT TO REPEAT 75% OF THE SAME SHARED QUESTS OVER AND OVER AGAIN). Possible solutions: 1. Allow server transfers 2. Merge servers 3. Overhaul PVP System (get rid of expertise?) /Rant off I suppose this rant is intended to hopefully kick BW into action sooner rather than later. I'm on a month to month sub that I've recently cancelled but will be following these forums and the game updates to see if any changes are made to give us something to do at 50 (after all i did drop ~$70 on this game). Until then, my acct and char are probably going to sit on the shelf.