OK here is proof. 1.The novel Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader says he can't use force lighting 2.The Revenge of the Sith Visual Dictionary says he can't use force lighting 3.Quoted from wikia http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Anakin_Skywalker: It should be noted that Darth Vader, despite being a powerful Sith Lord, was unable to generate Force lightning. This was due to his cybernetic implants, and any attempt by Vader to generate it would cause it to backfire, electrocuting his life-support systems, causing it to short-circuit and kill him. This is ultimately how he was killed, as his act of redemption in saving his son caused him to be bombarded with the Emperor's lightning. Because Vader's Sith powers were limited due to his artificial limbs, Darth Sidious found him less than satisfactory as his heir to the Sith legacy, despite the effort Sidious spent for more than a decade to recruit Skywalker. Upon the discovery of Luke Skywalker, Palpatine concentrated on turning him to the dark side. 4Also from a wikia http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Force_lightning: There was, however, one case where Vader did use Force lightning. When Vader was in close proximity to the presence of the Kaiburr crystal on Circarpous V, the amplification effects of the Force caused his affinity with the dark side to expand. As a result, Vader was able to utilize this power(force lighting), a feat normally impossible for him. Vader's cybernetics, as well as his artificial life support system, made him much more vulnerable to the damaging effects of Force lightning. This vulnerability would eventually contribute to his death. 5 From wookieepedia http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_The_Force_Unleashed_II: Using the force, he(Starkiller) causes the remaining pylons to release a huge amount of electricity, which he then absorbs and uses to blast an incredible amount of Force Lightning at Vader, finally subduing him. 6. Want to see what happens here.From Youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBa7n_a-vSc. Vader is on his knee and does not rise and is able to be caputed because he couldn't take another hit of force lighting. Want more proof? Ok 6.Injuries of Darth Vader http://www.theforce.net/swtc/injuries.html: Vader's mortal injury was inflicted by the Emperor's lightning. The lightning which lashed Vader was of a lethal intensity. The energies which Palpatine had previously used to strike Luke were less powerful, intended merely to cause agony and torment. When Vader seized him, Palpatine was already intensifying his output, with the intention of finishing Luke. These discharges were absorbed by Vader rather than his son. The remarkable intensity of these final energetic bursts (exceeding the shocks that had tormented Luke) is evident in the way they heated Vader's bones enough for to glow visibly through his flesh and clothing. The outbursts were brief enough not to roast him totally, but the instantaneous peak power is remarkable. Luke's skeleton never reached this incandescence, even for an instant. By the sound of it, his mask's breather was broken. His armour was scorched and his electrical life support systems were probably ruined. 7. Count Dooku , Yoda and Sidiuos use force lighting in the movies. Vader never uses force lighting any way shape or form in any of the movies. 8. In no comics does Vader use force lighting. 9.Palpatine on at least one occasion threatened to use Force lightning against Vader as a way of showing how much more powerful the Emperor was in comparison and how easy it would be to dispose of him.Quoted: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Vader's_armor. In the Suit Vader loses to Bane his armor.

0k let me explain I am not saying Orbalisk Armor means bam Bane wins. Bane no armor vs Vader no armor = Vader wins Bane no armor vs Vader in suit = Vader wins Bane with Armor vs Vader not in suit= Vader Wins And Hell just for the fun of it Bane in armor vs Sidious= Sidiuos wins The only way that Bane wins is when Vader is in his suit and Bane is in his orbalisk armor. Vader's suit is a robotic moving vetilator. It is run by machines. Short out the machines Vader is dead. No force technic that Vader uses can get past the orbalisk unless he wants to die also, no sword technic can work cause 1 the orbalisk block all light sabers and 2 if you manage to get the saber in an exposed area it atomaticlly gets healed. The only way I see Bane winning any duel with Vader is when he is wearing his armor and Vader is in his suit otherwise Vader wins.

The helmet and mask were only used while he was sleeping so it takes time for them to grow. Second the only technic to destroy ther orbalisk is force lighting(a technic that vader can not use in his suit.) nothing else can stop them they are imune to light sabers, they absorb dark side power giving the host more power. All powers used against Bane get absorbed by the orbalisk and make Bane stronger.

It was a weakness as far as hiding that he was a Sith and Sublty needed to stay in hiding from the Jedi. I mean he really couldn't come up to some one and say "Hey I'm just a normal guy." With an orbalisk armor suit on could he?

If Bane is not in his Orbalisk armor and Vader is not in his suit. Vader wins. He has more force power and can use them against Bane as well as his ligthsaber. Bane in his Orbalisk armor and Vader in his suit Bane detroyes Vader. The only thing that can work aganst the orbalisk is force lighting a technic that Vader can't use in his suit.That and they amplify Bane's force powers to a point where he is indestuctable.

because they are stupid. Darth Maul: kills a Jedi Knight but can't kill a Jedi appentace(writer's flaw but I'm going to use it) Darth Tyranus : What you mean a person who lies and betrays people to get a head just betrayed me? It can't be. Darth Sidious: The person who betrayed all his freinds and has spent the last 5 years trying to get his son to murder me, well I'm going to turn my back on him. I mean what can he really do. Darth Vader: Where do I begin? Palpatine: Kill Dooku Anikin: herp derp OK Palpatine: Darth Plagues could keep the people he loved from dyeing Anikin: AW Sweet. Can anybody do it? Palpatine: Not Jedi. Palpatine:My master taugh me everything about the force including the nature of the dark side. Anikin: Hey wait your the Sith Lord we've been looking for? Palpatine: /facepalm Vader: Ok I just killed Mace. Lets go save Padame. Sidious: Well um you know how I said Palgeus could save people well um I don't exactly know how to do it. Vader: /facepalm Vader: The emperor has forseen that you can kill him. Together we can rule as father and son. a Few years later.. Sidious: I am defenseless take your weapon.Strike me down with all of your hatred and your journy to the dark side will be complete. Luke force pulls his lightsaber ignites it and starts to try and decapate Sidious. And Vader blocks it. Stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, Sith.

Mace Windu : We are keeper's of the peace not soldiers. By the end of the war what are they hmm?? All Jedi's become generals. They can't be soldier's but they can order them around. Good Job Jedi good job. When he was caught in the lie instead of owning up to it and said: You know your right I lied and it was wrong. What does he do he tryes some b.s. that anyone who has half a brain could see though. It's something a kid would say when caught in a lie. Gui-Quo is using the force to make i repeat MAKE a non force user do what he wants him to do. He is saying by doing that, that the Jedi needs are more important than anyone or anything else. Sounds very arragant to me. And who looks worse the appertace who should know better but is still in training or the Master who should put his ego aside when dealing with a head strong appentace but sit and bickers with the appentace? So Dooku the cause of Anikin's fall is not alright to kill but Palpitin who is just as unarmed and who would have died if Vader hadn't stepped in is ok to kill? The Jedi are hypocrits. They have rules. When they are conviant they follow them when they aren't they don't.

The fact that they break their own rules. Episode I Qui-Gon to Padame : We can't fight a war for you. Episode III Geivous to the promoted Kenobi who is sent to end the war: General Kenobi. You are a bold one. Honesty was the first responsibility that aspiring Jedi were taught. Obi-Wan to Luke: Vader betrayed and Murdered your father. After being caught in a lie instead of owning up to it Obi-Wan: What I said was true from a certain point of view. Conquer Arrogance Jedi were required to learn that, although they were able to use the Force, they were no better than those who could not. Qui-Gon to Boss Nass using force persuade: We could use a transport. Boss Nass : We sa give yousa bongo. Qui-Gon to Wado using force persuade: Credits will do fine. Wado : No they wont Qui-Gon to Wado appearing annoyed agian trying to use force persuade: Credits will do fine. Wado: NO THEY WON'T. Honor Your Padawan: A Jedi Master was required to know that they must treat their Padawan with respect. They should never reprimand his Padawan in public Obi-Wan to Anikin in front of Padame and her Securty: You will learn your place young one. A Jedi will not kill an unarmed opponent. Mace Windu to Anikin with unarmed Palpatin on the ground : He is too dangous to be left alive. Palpi: I'm too weak Anikin : You can't it's not the Jedi way. Mace raises sword Palpi: Please Don't Anikin:I need him. Mace starts to bring sword down Papli: Please don't Anikin: NOOO !! Anikin cuts off Maces hand. Quoted : http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Jedi_Code

sorry http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Plo_Koon

Plo Koon . The Jedi was shot down over Cato Neimoidia by his clone troopers, killing him in compliance with Order 66. His fighter crashed into a clone assembly area, killing 141 clone troopers of the 7th Sky Corps.

Darth Maul. HE HAD THE HIGH GROUND!!

Mira from KOTOR2 . She's hot and she knows it. In case ur wandering http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mira.

Pretty much what everyone else said. IV,V,VI. But rember show the originals not the remade versons. Han shot first, Vader didn't say no before thowing the emperor and Luke did not see Hayden Christensen as a force ghost.

Bao-Dur:Male Zabrak. The computer Tech who see the universe though his hydro spanner. Was a tech in the Manaloran war with Meetra Surik. Contantly refers to her as general. In Bao-Dur's mind any problem can be fixed as long as you have the right tool. Goto: Mercenary and Criminial who uses "his" criminal empire to help the republic. While completely evil has an undeniable logic to what "he" does and why "he" does it. Visas Marr: Miraluka female who survived a tradigity. Although not overtly evil or sadistic is a follower of the Sith. When you listen to her she sounds almost calm and rational perhaps making her and even scarier type of sith. T3-M4: (also called Teethree for short) is a T3-series utility droid and depending on your alignment could be your best friend (Revan) or worst enimy(HK-47). Very loyal to certian people. Can fix any problem on the Ebon Hawk and has ADD (LOL jk but I swear the thing is always moving around the ship very hard to know where he was.) Hanharr: Male Wookee. One of the (dark side) bounty hunters on Nar Shadaa. He has simply been driven to the point of near-insanity by his anger and the pain of his past. He maintaines a strong, if somewhat warped, sense of honor and duty. However, even with his rage, he is cautious and never underestimated foes who are truly strong or superior. Mira:Female Human. One of the (Light/Grey side) bounty hunters on Nar Shadaa. Mira is a fast-talking, no-nonsense woman, with a dry wit and, in the words of Meetra Surik, "lots of attitude." Despite this, she had sympathy for all life and due to this, never killed unless absolutely necessary. Mira is an exceptional tracker and demolitionist. When given a target, she would "listen" for her target and get a feel for him. Due to her Force-sensitivity, she feels the natural flow of life on Nar Shaddaa and knows where her targets were going to be even before they do. Mira dresses in tight, revealing leather, which she said helpes to distract her targets. She is good at what she does, and joked that if she ever became a Jedi, she would have to turn herself in for the credits. Brianna: AKA the Handmaden:half-Echani Female. She expresses her passion through combat. She sees the galaxy as either black or white, good or evil. Their is no grey area for her. She has some naïveté due to where she lived and who raised her. She also failes to grasp jokes made by Surik, Mira, as well as Rand's sarcasm. Mical:AKA The Disciple: Human Male. In the aftermath of the Jedi Civil War, Mical was one of the few who maintained the distinction between the Jedi and the Sith. With the Jedi gone, he sought to preserve their history by studying their teachings and gathering artifacts. He had heard mention that one of the Jedi had gone to Dantooine, so he went to the ruins of the Jedi Enclave, but found no trace of them. Also has a hard time grasping Rand's sarcasm. Atton Rand: Human male. The smuggerler who has a sarcastic wit and naturally cocky. He has a big chip on his shoulder towards Jedis, droids, and either Mical or Brianna. Rand is also a man who stubbornly refuses to give up, often standing to rejoin a fight even when seriously wounded. He furthermore relies on his gut instincts to see him through. These instincts turn out to be surprisingly reliable.

OK the question was not who is more powerful Vader or Revan . It was in a fight who would win Vader or Revan. Just because Palpatine and Vader are the more powerful Sith does not insure that Vader wins the match. Proof Greatest Swordman in the Jedi Order was Yoda (That is strait from GL) Second Is Mace Windu Third was Obi Yoda lost to Palpatin. Mace Disarmed and had Palpatine down. Had his hand raised for the killing blow. If by your logic the most powerful must win then why did Mace have Palpatin down and disarmed but Yoda the more powerful of the two couldn't? Obi less powerful than Anikin Yet was able to beat him. If power means that you automaticly win then how was Obi able beat Anikin?

In answer to your questions: Yes out of the two Kotor1 is better than Kotor2 (only because it was rushed) KOTOR1 was Revan's story. KOTOR2 was Meetra Surik's (aka the Exile) story. Darth Nihilus along with 2 other Darths were the main antogonist in KOTOR2 (Darth Traya and Darth Sion were the other two.)

"Peace is a lie; there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me." —The Sith Code The sith code dose not have an actual auther but some belive it was Darth Treya who created the Sith Code. So thats who I'll go with for this. The Sith see themselves as seekers, challengers of old and stagnant ways, in touch with the laws of nature and the universe. They see the Jedi as denying their natures and afraid of the truth around them. Passions were what kept all creatures—from the most rudimentary to the most evolved sentient—alive. They believed that mastery of their passions give them strength the Jedi lack. The Sith do not believe that victory by any means is desirable, but believed that unless victory proved your superiority, it was an illusion and temporary. Though there might be different types of victories—peaceful victory, victory by sacrifice, even a truce—Sith dogma teaches that unless the victory was achieved by demonstrating that one's power was superior it was not a true victory. The stronger a Sith became in the Force, the more power he or she could achieve, but he or she always has to fight for that power. The true meaning of the line "…my chains are broken" was a subject of argument among many Sith. The chains represented a being's restrictions; not just a Sith but any being in the universe. The restrictions could be those placed upon a being by someone else, or restrictions that one placed upon oneself. The ultimate goal of any Sith was to free himself or herself from such restrictions, but not (as many failed Sith pupils believed) in the simplistic meaning of just being able to do whatever they wanted. The Sith desired to free themselves in order to reach perfection and fulfill their potential. They want the perfect strength, perfect power, and perfect destiny, which, in turn, allowed one to do whatever they wanted FOR THE MOST PART. The person who had these abilities was known as the Sith'ari. The Sith'ari was supposed to destroy the Sith and then make them stronger than ever. Many Sith do not believe in the Sith'ari and treat perfection as a goal to work towards rather than a strict state of being. When I say don't break the rules I don't mean you can't bend them like Lord Kaan did for the brotherhood but you can't shatter them by saying "All Sith and Jedi should work together peacefully towards mutial gain. Breaking Peace is a lie. Of the Code."

Ok why I think Revan could beat Vader. First Pre Mustafar Vader did kill many Jedi at the Temple but he was defeated by a Jedi that had less force powers than him and was about equal when it came to light saber combat. Pre mustafar Vader didn't have alot of powers yet he had just turned to the dark side. Revan had four masters that were known. Some Jedi some sith. While it is unkown exatly what he learned the masters he was Recognized as a talented military tactician and strategist, and the Jedi Order's most powerful champion. Vader had two masters train him Obi and Sidiuos. Both of whom kept things from him. A quote from Ankin himself "I Know There Are Things About The Force That They're (the Jedi) Not Telling Me" and Palpatine bitterly judged his hobbled disciple to be a failure. The reason he tried to get Galen Marek and Luke Skywalker as his appentice. Also Palpi learn from Plagus that once the appentance learns everything he can he destoryes the master. Palpi didn't want to die so he kept things from Vader. In both cases pre and post Mustafar Vader was on the losing end from either not having been trained in the dark arts yet or losing his Midichlorians by becoming crispy crittered by Obi.

Ok a little explaination is involved. This is for fun. I saw that the Sith had a few differant rules as in Bane's rule of two or Darth Krayt rule of One or Lord Kaan Brotherhood of Darkness. Think you can make a better rule for the Sith here is your chance. Some rules(to the rules) of coarse: 1.This is the Sith so no rule can break the Sith code. 2.You must put both pros and cons to your rules. 3. How will your rules help or hurt the Sith (the Religion not the race)? I'll give an example using the two I already listed: The rule of two: Two there should be; no more, no less. One to embody power, the other to crave it. Pro: Prevent infighting between Sith by making only two of them. Con: There are only two and lets say they are together in a shuttle when it explodes there goes the order. The rule of one: Instead of two there is now only one—the Sith Order itself. Pro: Many minions, acolytes/adepts and lords with only one Dark Lord of the Sith. Cons: In fighting. Eventallty the one will be killed die or be destoyed and the power vacuum has all the other Sith turning on one another and the Sith destroyes it self. So there you go. Your turn create your own rules for the sith, and rember have fun.

Yes the Sith are evil. They use the dark side of the force. As a rule if you use the dark side for the most part you are evil. Look at the dark side powers. Force lighting: bringing the sith's anger into the world. Force Choke: causing the person caught in it to struggle for air for minutes before death. All of their powers are to cause pain and fear in the victim. The ones who believe the sith are good mostly forget the first line of the code: Peace is a lie. The sith say to unlock the dark side of the force is though the sith code. If you wish to become powerful you must believe the entire code not just parts of it. Sith do not use love or joy for any of their powers because the sith are all about the self.To be in a loving relationship if someone in it is being selfish the relationship doesn't work. The sith believe they are better than everyone else. If they find someone who might be stronger then them they must see if they can destory the enemy or die trying. Ask yourself this: The empire had the republic. They had them beat. Coresant was sacked the Jedi temple destroyed Jedi were on the run and then Empire stopped and singed a treaty. Why? If the Empire destroys the republic what is the first thing the sith would do? When Revan left the acadamy on Korreban what did the sith do? As for what happened between Palpatine and Windu. If you look at EU what powers Palpi had and Mace had. Mace had no chance of winning. Mace was only being kept alive so Vader could come to the dark side and cut his ties to the jedi. When he killed Dooku Vader could argue Dooku was a sith armed or disarmed he needed to die. When Vader cut off Mace's arm, Vader knew(thought) there was no going back to the jedi. He had just helped to kill a master jedi. Not evil sand people not an evil sith but a master Jedi in order to protect a Sith. As for Mace's attempt to kill Palpi. It kinda reminds me of an episode of Star Trek tng:"The Most Toys". Data is kidnapped and tries to escape. When Data is trying to escape Varria (the one who helps Data) is caught by Fajo (the kidnapper) and he kills her with the Varon-T. Her death is excruciating and painful to witness as she is destroyed from the inside out. On hearing her scream, Data exits the escape pod he was preparing for launch, and picks up Varria's discarded disruptor, aiming it at Fajo. Fajo proceeds to taunt Data, saying that if he does not return to his chair, he will start killing others, and their blood will be on Data's hands as well. He continues by saying that if only Data's programming allowed him to feel rage over Varria's death, he could kill him and stop it – but he has no feelings; he is only an android. Data, however, decides that he must stop Fajo, who has already committed one murder and announced his intention to kill others. Data draws the disruptor at a suddenly-panicking Fajo, but is beamed back to the Enterprise just as he pulls the trigger. O'Brien detects the weapon in mid-transport and remotely deactivates it as a precautionary measure. Data hands it to Riker, and tells him to arrest Fajo for murder, kidnapping and theft. When Riker asks about the discharge, having noticed Data's pose on arrival, Data pauses and says perhaps something occurred during transport. In both Mace and Data were trying to stop more murders by killing the cause of them. Both fail because of others interceding and imo both were doing what was right. tl;dr yes the sith are evil.

Ok first Vett: Yes she is good as a dps but she is a non force using alien. In the empire it doesn't matter if it is a female or male those two items make Vett the bottom of the socety not her sex. Next Thana Vesh: Some of what you said I have to agree with but some I must disagree with. First she is a powerful force user burning down a whole city block with the force is nothing to sneeze at but what happens to her on Taris is suppose to make you either hate her or feel sorry for her. Lets put Thana as a man instead of a woman sith. He kills his paremts and becomes Darth Gravus appentance. Everytime you meet him he tryes to take credit for things you have done, women flirt with him and he shuns them and everytime he tries to do things on his own he ends up locked up knocked out or tied up. He would be a weak Sith and you would either feel sorry for him or hate him and want to kill him. Its not male or female sexism Just a weak sith. Then there is Jaesa Williamson: The ""I cannot resist your will, Master." Is the same if you are a male or female SW so it is more the whole master/appintice thing than anything else. Plus she could be paying you lip service until the time she decides to shove a light saber in your back. Darth Lachriss is only being dissed by the player base so not really the writers fault on that one. Finally Lady Grathan (I guess you killed her. If you let her live, she uses you to kill her husband and becomes de-facto-leader of House Grathan, controlling her son who is officially in charge.) While yes she becomes a strong ruler and is then power behind her son but she also has flirt option that lets you have sex with her while Vett watches so um that a kiinda a mess up the but w/e your a sith.

I Looked it up yes there was Darth Desolus but I still dont see how u get 50 years. Quote from Databank in The Force Unleashed:Born nearly 3500 years before the clone wars, the warrior who would become Darth Desolous was once a revered Jedi Master whos name is now lost to history. Sadly his lust for battle led him to the dark side and he embraced the teachings of the Sith. Expelled from the Jedi order, the fallen Master took on the name of Darth Desolous and vowed to have his revenge. He began training an army of Pau'ans in his own style of martial arts, which favored the use of a cortosis alloy shield in conjunction with a melee weapon. The shield was typically used to block incoming attacks (Including a Jedi's lightsaber) leaving the opponent open to counterattack. Darth Desolous eventually rallied his bloodthirsty soldiers against the Jedi, ambushing Jedi Knights across the galaxy. After each attack, he became bolder and more reckless, his desire for revenge and hatred for the Jedi eclipsing all other emotions. Desolous's rampage led to the slaughter of nealry two thousand Jedi, but eventually he grew overconfident. Desolous confronted a small Force of Jedi on Yaga Minor, btu these Knights were simply bait to draw the killer into a tactically disadvantegous position. When Desolous attacked, a large Jedi fleet appeared out of hyperspace, preventing Desolous' retreat. Outnumbered and outmatched, Desolous' army was destroyed and the Sith Lord was finally struck down. In some ways, however, Desolous became even more powerful in death. Over time, his legend grew and his name became synonymous with hatred and rage. His visage was later used as part of the Jedi Trials - an enraged opponent for Padawans to face in the hopes of mastering their own base emotions. Desolous was Born around 3500 years before the clone was. Tor lakes place at 3641. Time between Tor and THE BIRTH of Desolous if he was born exactly at 3500 (which is not what it says.) would still be 141 years. I think you are also mistaken that they only have 50 years because Desolous is Pau'an not human. Which as a species can live up 700 years. It doesnt say "At a time of peace Darth Desolous raised an army in 3500 ect." So the time between when Tor ends and Desolous rises is very open and is alot more than fifty years. Darth Bane Novel Path of Distruction takes place Between 1006 and 1000 BBY 2641 years after TOR give or take..

Where r u getting the time of fifty years from? SWTOR take place 3643-3641 BBY* Lost Tribe of the Sith: Pantheon takes place 3000 BBY** Darth Ruin is around 2000 BBY*** so by that time line the creators of swtor has 641 years to play with. *http://timelineuniverse.net/History.htm & http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline_of_galactic_history **http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lost_Tribe_of_the_Sith:_Pantheon ***http://misc.thefullwiki.org/Darth_Ruin

I alreay said others might not agree my thoughts you are one of the ones who don't.

Some of the dark/light side points I disagree with on the Empire side (just my opion others may disagree): Dark Science on Korriban. I don't see how betraying a quest giver for credits is light side. Creeping Hunger on Korriban I think posioning the monster who eats acolytes should not be light side its self preservation. Testing Ground: I know its light side to kill the slaves out right without having them suffer but posioning them seems dark side to me. Finally I know its not topic but I think Thana Vesh should of had three choice options like Lord Rathari instead of just light and dark.