To put my two cents in as someone that has made the progress from absolutely terribad to better than average at GSF... Flying with a mouse sucks. Wing Commander was one of the first PC games I ever played. I've played every single Wing Commander game to death, played X-Wing, beat Tie Fighter on the hardest difficulty completing all the secret objectives, was an absolute terror in JTL for SWG... Now, that was a while ago of course. You'd expect some rust. However, I did all of those with a flight stick (nothing fancy). Trying to actually fly with the mouse threw me for a loop. I had no idea what I was doing. You add to that the fact that my initial experience with GSF was basically dying every 30 seconds to a missile or rail gun shot, and it was frustrating as all hell. I did this before seasons by the way, so there weren't tons of newbies. GSF takes a while just to get competent at, let alone good. The good players taking advantage and abusing the fresh meat with proton torps and rail guns makes actually getting that experience more difficult. My best advice... read a guide before you ever go out there. Watch a video to get some idea. Focus your skills and upgrades on mobility and defense. Don't just hold down the left mouse button while chasing the reticle, pick your shots. Try not to get too frustrated about blowing up a lot.

I haven't gotten to the current end of this thread, but as someone who played SWG from launch until a year or two after the NGE...this is a myopic view of things. There were all kinds of balancing issues that were apparent because of the mix and match system of skills and professions. My character was a Teras Kasi Master primarily. I always stuck with that as my main mode of gameplay (until after NGE). However, I totally changed the distribution of all my other skill points at a certain point because we found out that you could stack dodge to the point you could barely be touched by NPCs. I used to go to Dathomir and just walk up to spawn points and beat on them endlessly with spin kicks while everything hopelessly tried to hit me. As long as you had buffs from a doctor (another mechanic that caused unintended headaches and ripple effects), you could absorb any hits that managed to break through and essentially be immortal in most cases. This didn't work as well in PVP though, and it took a long time to kill things because the damage wasn't great. It was basically just easy mode. That is just one example. I'm sure there are tons more. I loved the original vision of SWG. The implementation of such a large number of classes and how they could be used together for builds just wasn't designed well combat wise. It was outside of combat where the game really shined.

I just wanted to jump back in here for a second and say something, because I believe you even referenced me in another post much later on in the thread. I don't see how you thought I was necessarily disagreeing with you. I don't have a problem with the earlier content being "too easy" at all. In fact, the whole point was that the claim that it is too easy and that's why they need to remove and rebalance abilities is just an excuse. It should be a good thing that the older content keeps getting easier, because more and more people will be able to clear it and actually experience that part of the game. The problem is that there is not enough new content that is actually challenging to keep players engaged for the long term. Their original solution, and I use that term loosely, was level sync everything and introduce reward systems that made every piece of old content relevant. Of course, that just leads to people looking for the path of least resistance...which is why I've done Hammer Station an absolutely insane amount of times. Even when I'm not trying to do Hammer Station and queue random, Hammer Station pops a ton because of all the people using it to grind gear. I can only do the exact same content for so long, no matter the difficulty, before I stop having fun and need a break. I came back after not having played for over six months and finished all the new content on what passes for my main in a couple hours, and I was taking my time. I agree with everything you've said about not punishing the player for using the tools that you have given them. I also don't believe for a second that every single encounter, in every single flashpoint, in veteran and master mode, will get a rebalance pass to get everything in line with a new baseline of player/class performance. There are still bosses in certain flashpoints right now that are buggy or present a drastic difficulty spike in one mode or the other. It's going to be worse after changes like this go live, not better. Then they will have to decide if it's worth fixing all of it, or if they will just shrug and move on to the next big thing. Maybe they will hand it off as a little side project to some intern who can introduce some more bugs because he's the lucky 1,000th person to work on the code and it's poorly documented. Also, as someone who does do a lot of arguing/debating in different formats. I think you would be better served yourself by addressing the points actually being made that you feel deserve a response and not just blanket dismissing the majority as "emotional appeals". I also feel as if I've read your game/mod design resume a few dozen times now...and it shouldn't matter to anyone reasonable whether you are a founder or not. Let your arguments stand on their merits. Just my two cents

I feel like the very idea that all these abilities that have been added has made previous content too easy should be a non-issue. I mean, as our power level increases to meet new challenges, shouldn't the old challenges become easier? Doesn't that actually open up those Ops to more people being able to complete them? Why is that bad? I think that strikes at the core of really the only reason that I've ever taken a break from SWTOR. The pace at which new content is released and the length of that content. If they were releasing new story content, new flashpoints, new operations, and new pvp maps at the rate of say ESO...I never would have played ESO. I would have been too busy playing SWTOR. Since I've come back to the game again, the thing I've actually spent the most time doing...is replaying content that I've already done countless times. Leveling a new Guardian through the class story, the same flashpoints, the same heroics, the same everything. It will entertain me for a while (I'm the guy that played through KoTOR and KoTOR2 with both genders, and both force alignments, some multiple times, and enjoyed it all), but it won't keep me here forever. TLDR: If they had enough new content to engage players with, then the old content being "too easy" with the "extra" abilities wouldn't be an issue.

I've said in other threads that I don't actually mind taking down the necessary keybind count to something a little more manageable than what it is now. The thing that I think has been hit on in this discussion is what is it that not only forms the core of a certain class, but differentiates it from the other classes. I've played tons of guardian/juggernaut dps (mostly vigilance/vengeance). I've also played all the other classes in the game. The thing that makes guardian dps a unique melee dps is the ability to basically off-tank a little, or in extreme emergencies just straight tank for a short period of time. The incidents I remember most are things like saving a fight by taunting and essentially stepping up to tank when the real tank went down. We also can't pretend that all the dps classes are actually equal in dps output, or that they ever will be. Besides the fact that at one point in the past at least (and I have not seen anything that tells me this has changed) Bioware had certain metrics for where each dps class should be parsing relative to a baseline. Add that up with the fact that melee and ranged dps will never be equal in this game in a ton of fights...there are so many fights that seem designed just to aggravate melee dps (that will only get worse if they reduce mobility from where it is currently). Up time is a thing when you aren't on a training dummy. The point I'm making there, is that each class is supposed to have a little bonus that makes up for their downsides. Guardian is supposed to be the heavy armor, defensive cooldown having, tough to kill melee dps. We get a little bit of tank kit. Other classes get a little bit of healing kit. Some classes are just pure dps and give all that up, and they rightly feel they should do more dps because of how squishy they are. This has all been part of the class design since day one, and that is what we don't want to lose.

I feel like this is actually a pretty good assessment. I didn't have as much trouble staying alive in Guardian A as you apparently did. I had Shae with me on heals if that makes any difference, I'm not sure. The aggro problems are due to a bug with the passive that makes blade storm aoe in a cone. It's apparently hitting things hundreds of meters away. I do really echo your take on the goldilocks zone for abilities and keybinds though. I have a razer naga mouse, and I'm super comfortable using modifiers for keybinds at this point. So I have 36-48 abilities that I can use without too much issue. I always have at least 36 keybinds for each class. I didn't even have abilities to fill up the standard quickbar though. So, I went from the 36 abilities I use regularly or situationally on live, to maybe 12 that I was using here. That's way too much. If they cut it down to something around the 24-30 range, it would be perfectly fine and we would retain much more of the functionality that we have and need on live.

I echo the sentiment that there seems to be a lack of thought and imagination in what they have chosen to present to us. Consolidate some abilities, sure. Roll the utilities into passives you select on level up, ugh...ok I guess if you want to. Add new passives that can switch up your gameplay style by adding aoe or other effects to abilities, great. Taking away things that aid my mobility in crucial moments, my damage mitigation, and the only potential I have for a self cleanse...and make me choose which one I want? No thanks. You just gimped what my character is capable of doing. Now, could I tank without those things? Absolutely. And what is on pts right now, against trash mobs, felt tanky enough. It wasn't the end of the world in that regard. However, do you have any idea how many times I've only stayed alive running a pug flashpoint (especially the more difficult ones) because I could blade blitz over somewhere quickly, or self cleanse because the healer doesn't know they needed to do that for me (or doesn't even know what it is in the first place). If I have a group that knows their roles and works together well, I might not need these things. How often does that really happen in group finder though?

So much this. I'm assuming they aren't taking away the interrupts, but if they actually did...then they seriously need to look at a bunch of encounters in the game to take that into account. If we can't do X anymore, then X can't be required to successfully complete any encounter in the game. I also, as mentioned in my post above, hate standing around doing nothing...and I started to feel that a little in the combat on test. It was just trash mobs, not tanking a FP or Operation though.

I don't think it is dishonest at all in this context. If you compare ESO to SWTOR, then what would be the equivalent of the dodge roll say? It's an ability on your bar that you hit. Block is essentially an on demand defensive cooldown that consume resources. I don't think there is a direct comparison skill in SWTOR, but if they create one, it would be an ability on your bar. The basic weapon attacks are...abilities that are on your bar (though most people take them off at some point because we stop using them). Interrupting is holding the right mouse button and tapping the left mouse button in ESO, but in SWTOR it is...an ability that is on your bar. In ESO, those ten spots on your bar are in essence your rotation or essential core skills, and all the stuff that isn't on your bar is the basic utility package that every single character gets regardless of class. I actually like both combat systems for different reasons, but saying that ESO gets away with just 5 abilities on your bar as a justification for pruning abilities is actually a little disingenuous in my eyes, which is why I made that comment. They took a lot of the functionality that exists in a SWTOR type system and put it off the quickbar and onto standardized keyboard and mouse buttons. Edit - they do still have less "abilities" total than SWTOR does, which leads into my next paragraph. I actually have 1-12, shift + 1-12, and alt + 1-12 all bound on every one of my characters in SWTOR, and I use all those keybinds. I'd actually be fine with knocking that number down quite a bit, but not by taking away functionality that has existed for some time now, and is part of the way the class is played. I realize that I'm probably an edge case in a some ways. I play PVE and PVP. I have an MMO mouse. I keep up a fairly high apm. I just move fast. The thing I liked the least about the play experience on test right now was that I actually ended up waiting for a button to press instead of always having something off cooldown. It just felt slower and less engaging for me mentally. If they tweaked the global, reduced some cooldowns, or put more abilities off the global that problem would go away. Besides, how am I supposed to play Huttball on my tank without blade blitz / mad dash? :-P

ESO seems to make due with 5, but then you eventually get weapon swap and realize to really do your job in anything other than the overland content you need to use the back bar and all 10 slots. ESO is also an action combat game, and you get an interrupt, a stun break, a block, a dodge roll, light weapon attack, and heavy weapon attack that don't take up quickbar slots. They are all used through movement keys or mouse button presses and holds. A sprint as well. There's also stealth (sneak) that is available to all players. So that's 17 "abilities" so far with those 5 button bars. I forgot about the Ultimate abilities on each bar though. That's 19 now. Plus, they just added companions to the game...and those companions have their own Ultimate abilities that you have to trigger to use...that's up to 20. You also need to learn how to weave light attacks in between all your abilities to animation cancel in order to get optimal dps output. Of course, you can get through a lot of content by just standing there and pressing 1-5 over and over again. However, to actually master your character and get through the advanced content with mechanics, or to solo difficult content...you need to be ready to use all 20+ of those abilities at the appropriate times, while managing cooldowns and timers for dots and buffs/debuffs. And that's a game with "simple" combat. It isn't, it just isn't quickbar focused combat. This game is.

I also want to make my opinion heard here, though I doubt it will have any impact on actual decisions made by the developers. I have been a subscriber since launch with one real break around RotHC. I haven't been playing much the past year, but always keep my subscription active. The initial announcement of the new expansion and the features announced got me reinvigorated and I have jumped back into the game this past week and been enjoying rolling another new character (Defense Guardian). I am now seriously doubting that I will keep playing when 7.0 goes live, and am not planning on renewing my subscription if this class revamp is the actual plan. If you want to prune things and get rid of useless skills, then go ahead. Do NOT take away functionality and skill combinations that have become essential to our roles in the game, or expected as quality of life enhancers for us. The way this is currently structured makes the passives I usually select for PVE through utilities absolutely impossible, and if I take what I actually enjoy I will be gimping myself as a tank (mobility enhancers vs. damage mitigation). This does not look fun. This will not make me feel like a powerful Jedi. This will make me feel like a lesser version of what I've been for some time now in game. I'm not paying you to ruin my Jedi power fantasy. Edit: If your hope is that this will somehow bring in and retain more new players in order to make up for all the long time veteran, loyal subscribers you drive away...then may the force be with you. I won't.

As another fellow NGE survivor who has played this game since launch... I'm ok with cutting down on the number of necessary abilities. However, you need to do it in a way that actually retains the overall functionality that we have within the current system. Unless they are doing a complete redesign of the fundamentals of combat in the game...which...yeah... Combat Upgrade, that went well too. I'm sorry, but if I load up a new expansion to a game I've played for a long time and I am suddenly lacking part of my existing toolkit, and feel less powerful and useful, that is not going to be a good experience for me. You can't expect me to be happy as a Defense Guardian if I'm forced to choose between added mobility (which was given to me in a previous expansion), a reflect (which used to be exclusive to our class, but was then passed out to a bunch of others), and a temporary hp pool...also, potentially not having saber throw (which has been part of the class since day one). I'll feel gimped, and not because I won't have as many buttons to push on my fancy MMO mouse. I'll feel gimped because there will be situations that will arise where I would have used those abilities in the past and they will not be available to me anymore. Also, as a long time subscriber, this just further fuels my frustrations with the seemingly schizophrenic design philosophies from one expansion to the next. I get that the turnover in the dev team and leadership will do that...but last expansion we got a move towards a kind of horizontal progression with the gear sets and tacticals as opposed to just pumping up stat numbers that just bump into diminishing returns most of the time anyway. Now, first appearances are that a lot of that is getting rolled into this redesign of the combat classes. So, instead of taking the already existing foundation and building on the things that work while discarding or minimizing things that don't...we get another sudden left turn and we'll just see what happens next. We could have had some new and interesting gear sets or tacticals that could truly alter the style of gameplay (go look at ESO and all the diverse gear set effects they have and use your Star Wars imagination a little), but instead I will get to "choose" passives or abilities that will inevitably not be an actual choice. One of the paths will be optimal or necessary to tank, and that's the one I will choose, or I won't be a very good tank. TLDR: don't give your players cool toys to play with and then yank them away...and if you do, don't be surprised when they stop having fun and leave

I have been having the same issue. Before you go through any of the troubleshooting for BitRaider, please try what I did. Shut down the launcher and then go into task manager and end all the BitRaider processes that are still hanging around. Then relaunch. It fixed the problem immediately for me.

I have a much older cpu, but just upgraded to a 1060 6 gb. I had a similar problem, running all my other games great, but swtor wouldn't stay near 60 fps at the high setting. Eventually I found that overriding the anti aliasing through the driver made a huge difference. All other settings on ultimate and AA at 4x through the driver on override and I peak at over 200fps, only dips below 100 when there is a ton of stuff going on, lots of shadows, or I'm on my speeder. Worth a try. The in engine AA apparently sucks.