Im playing because atm I cant find another better game to play

actually, at this point the only thing left is playing friends....... even that is losing its luster though. Good for you for finding things to do. Im glad someone can enjoy the work that Bioware put into it. I had fun for a while but the penny lost its shine much sooner than I hoped it would.

I normally don't use the "read my post" argument but this time I think it may be appropriate. Not in a condecending context but rather in the sense that it seems you and I are saying the exact same thing but are disagreeing over it...... I understand what WOW is and I dont deny anyone the joy of playing it or hold any judgement over them for it. But WOW is WOW and if I wanted to play WOW I would play WOW, not pay to play a knock off. Bit of a digression, funny story, I just walked into a Game Stop before making this post. I asked them to tell me about an MMO that isn't a WOW knock off and every employee was dumbfounded and couldnt come up with one (then reverted to trying to sell me WOW). WOW is great because it was so innovative. Now the gaming developers are looking at the success and thinking that WOW has the formula. WOW is the end of the story not the beginning and it seems that every company in the world is starting at the end and trying to get to the beginning. I think it may just be time for me to get out of MMOs for a couple years until a company with a new idea comes along and tries something new. SWTOR is just the same car with a new set of tires and a slightly faster engine. (not trying to flame your post at all and sorry if I seem like I am. I never criticized WOW for being what it was though....rather just expressed confusion over why every company in the world thinks it can compete with WOW by using basically the same mechanic).

and so the movie has played...../sigh....oh well

SWG didnt do well because of the way SOE treated its paying customers. Not because of lack of content. I understand the avoidance of SWG on large part but discarding the entire game as whole is akin to throwing out the baby along with the bath water. so many good ideas....lost forever

I might not have stated my position clearly. SWG had some great content but it was rife with problems and more importantly, holds the trophy on the worst treatment of paying customers in the gaming world. SWTOR is much more polished and runs smoother to a very high degree but is frustrating in that it lacks a tremendous amount of the things that SWG did right. I was vastly disapointed in the way SOE treated its customers but I stuck around because every other MMO that I played just fell so short of my expectations. SWTOR is a great game and I don't begrudge anyone who loves it. Like I said before, I'm not the anti fanboi standing on my soapbox and threating to quit unless they satisfy me and only me. I fully understand that the game is what it is and if I dont like it I can leave. I suppose I'm just baffled at the concept of so many great ideas being flushed away because one model worked for one company. One thing is true though, the closer this game sticks the WOW mold as it evolves, the more likely it will be just another failure in a long line of attempted copies. As for me, I'll hang around for now but unless I can find a reason to keep paying, I might go give the SWG Emu a shot, though I cringe at playing a game not run by a reputable company. Maybe Ill just stop playing MMOs for a while.

I think there is a bit of not seeing the forest for the trees by alot of gaming companies. WOW is a great model and wildly successful and I agree that making something completely different than WOW in all regards would be antethetical to making money as it would be so different so as to turn players off at the beginning. However, with WOW and SWG, and EVE online and every other MMO ever made, new companies have the ability to see what it good and what is bad and create something that will not only grab the casual player but also keep the interest of the social and hardcore gamer too. Case in point, Jump to Lightspeed with SWG was certainly not a perfect system (nothing in SWG was), but it was one of the most entertaining aspects of game that a player could spend months in and still not have reached their goals. Ironically, it's the first thing that Bioware discarded when making this game. Simply put, if someone plays a game, any game, then moves onto another more advanced game, the expect to see more not less. SWTOR delivers a little more on a couple of aspects, but overall delivers far less in most regards.

Nice comments so far. Just to clarify, Im not implying that SWTOR is a WOW clone but rather illustrating that they are a very similar base mechanic. As some have said, that may be a good thing. For me, its not. I never found WOW that entertaining. what is frustrating is that it seems that every MMO that comes out has little in the way of innovation and lots in the way of imitation. It is certainly innovative that SWTOR has npc characters that assist players, but if broken down to the basic fundaments, its realy no different than having a pet which most other games have. The voice over is nice but does not add so much to the game so as to get as much out of what they put into it. I can remember laying in bed at night at the hight of my SWG days and thinking over and over about the best way to outfit my ship. Should I pull this shield off and use another one in order to fit a different gun on? Should I drop armor to fit another engine on? That was just one aspect of the game and there hundreds that could offer the same amount of involvement. I see none of that in this game and I find it disapointing. WOW is certainly the one to beat. But even the most avid WOW player will be happy to pour out their opinions on what Blizzard did wrong. SWG had a mountain of flaws that no one will disagree should have been discarded. On the other hand, both games have aspects that are highly motivating and compelling and had bioware simply tried to take as much of the good as possible while getting rid of as much of the bad as possible, I think they could have knocked WOW off its throne by creating the most immersive and entertaining MMO to date. Instead it seems that they bought a chevy, took all the parts off down to the frame, then rebuilt it and called it a Buick. It's unfortunate but it seems that the things that everyone did want to see in some form in this game were the first things that Bioware discarded in the brainstorming phase....... As I said, for now Ill fiddle around in SWTOR but I dont think it will be long before I can no longer justify paying the sub. I agree that there will be changes and evolution that will make the game more entertaining. However, once iimplemented, I forsee most of it being burned up in a couple weeks and then more sitting and waiting with little else to do. With that modle, it's wiser to just level up to 50, unsub and wait for an update, log in when one comes, play it out and unsub again. Heck even clone wars online has private houses that can be decored and customized yet SWTOR, arguably the most advanced MMO to date doesnt? I dont get it.

So I will start by saying that this is going to be a somewhat negative rant. However, it will not be the typical "I'm taking my subscription money and quitting, no you can't have my stuff", whine fest. If you are a SWTOR addict and refuse to entertain any critisism of the game feel free to go ahead and move on. I see a growing and interesting trend in MMO's as of late and SWTOR is no exception. There seems to be two periods of MMO play and design; before World of Warcraft and after World of Warcraft. Before WOW, game designers were trying all kinds of new things. The engines and mechanics of games were as varied as the titles. Then Blizzard released WOW and turned the gaming community on its head. I think we all understand that no engine is perfect. In MMOs there will always be shortcomings, bugs and things that are quirky and non-preferential. When SWG was released though, they were the envy of the gaming community with their radically advanced character customization options. There was alot of criticism about the game at release (much of it deserved) but in all honesty, every MMO gets a tremendous amount of criticism. Let me break away from the train of thought and say that I do not advocate SWG as being a pinnacle of MMO play. Quite the contrary, I think that SWG is the poster child for what NOT to do to one's player base. More's the pity and point. I played WOW for a time as well as a myriad of other MMOs, but I always found them to be very cookie cutter and constraining. Since WOW has been released, it seems that almost every MMO is taking steps to be similar while building on what has been done by Blizzard. The result is that MMOs as whole are stagnating. While there are improvements to SWTOR, the basic engine is not tremendously different than that of WOW and I suspect that any and all MMO endeavors will be similar for a long time come. We in the gaming community are often times starving for something new. I see many things happening. Players who left WOW are becoming more and more disenchanted as they come to the realization that SWTOR is not that far from the same game. Those who expected a space game are coming in and finding a gross disapointment and the hardcore gamers are getting several characters to 50 and then waiting around hoping that new content will be released soon. I appreciate what Bioware has done and congratulate them on their accomplishment. As an extended game with new and inovative content though, I feel SWTOR is a bit of a dissapointment and will slowly begin to lose subscriptions as more people reach 50. So what am I getting at? Well, I'm not rage quitting or making obtuse declarations. To put it in perspective though, I played SWG (flaws and all) for almost two years before I began to lose interest and needed a break. I've been at SWTOR for two months and already find myself drumming my fingers on my desktop trying to force myself to find something to do........ If you got this far, thanks for letting me vent. If you only read the first two paragraphs and have your flame ready feel free to light it up. As for me......for the first time I may actually consider trying out the SWG Emu. I would love to hear about that if anyone has any positive or negative stories. In the mean time, I guess Ill just level a couple more toons till I find something else to do.

To play devil's advocate here, I have a feeling that the developers of this game were under time constraints to make release deadlines. That being said, there is no reason to leave us in the dark on this unless there was never any intention to add or upgrade this to start. Of all the things wrong with SWG, JTL was NOT one of them. There were many flaws and it was not a perfect system by any stretch but even so, it was still a fantastic aspect of the game. For those who have not played it Ill summarize the differences; JTL had (among other things) -A variety of ships with different base performance stats so that players could choose their preference of ship -Customization kits to allow players up to 9 different options of paint styles and dozens of options of paint colors -Ability to customize the name of each and every ship flown -Interchangeable part options allowing a player to choose how the ship performed by changing out parts -Reverse engineering of looted parts to allow players upgrade their equipment -POB ships where multiple players could ride along and join in group combat -About a dozen space areas where players could explore and engage in quests and random pvp/pve SWTOR has -One ship -One direction of travel -Zero control of the ship -Almost no customization options (by comparison) SWTOR is supposed to be the cutting edge of MMO's but not only did it fall short of expectations in space, it took the absolute worst possible option available. Of all the problems with SWG, Bioware disgarded one of the only things they should have used as a standard of comparison. The tubes are fine for those who enjoy them. I personally spent about 5 mins in one and will never do it again. For those of us who played JTL or any other 3D space sim, its about the same as being told to be happy about a moped after we have been driving a Ferrari for 8 years. The coding is there......Lucas Arts has access to everything that was created by SWG. Change the skins, make it smaller, fix the loopholes and add it. Do that and SWTOR will solidify itself in the annals of MMO history as the msot advanced and diverse game to date. All the time waiting for this game and suddenly the EMU is looking more appealing every day.

So the majority of the game is well put together and entertaining. I have some preference disagreements with gameplay but nothing worth pitching a huge fit over. The game is what it is and overall is a great game to play. With one glaring exception..... Space flight/combat is an absolute joke. I was concerned before release but having actually played it now I am astounded at how much time was put into the ground game and how little was put into space flight. SWG did alot of things wrong (in some cases more things wrong than right). In the one area that Bioware should have payed attention though, everything was completely disregarded. The saga of Star Wars is based heavily on space flight and interaction. For a game that puts so much emphasis on emmersion dirtside, I find it particularly discouraging that so little emphasis was placed on space flight....... To be clear, the game overall is fine. There are things I might prefer to have been done differently but nothing that isn't intollerable. Space flight on the other hand is in my opinion not even worth playing.... /thoughts?