Lower level PVP is like this in EVERY game. Which is why lower level PVP is more fun in EVERY game. Warhammer for example, low level pvp is almost entirely based on tactics and skill. 40's PVP is entirely based on who has the best gear, and skill simply doesn't play into it. For example on my server there was a Warrior Priest named "Herbie" that could solo entire warbands himself only because he was rigged up with Warpforged and playing a grossly OP class endgame. Balance? Forgot it. But PVP in warhammer from 10-39 is actually fairly good. Rift is the same way, PVP is a blast from 10-49, and goes down into the dumpster at level 50 the instant you arrive because you are facing people with Rank8 gear, and exceedingly overpowered armor/weapons. Basically, developers can't seem to understand that there should not be any special progression at 50, no special stats, no special skills, no realm ranks, keep it all even keeled, and the PVP will be fun and skill based, like it is early in the game. This is how older MMO's had fun, balanced PVP that kept people playing. All of the new ones fail because they add progression beyond 50, and special 'stats' and other nonsense that only make it all imbalanced and skill becomes a NON ISSUE. Of course the skilless kids that grind to 50 and farm newbs love it, nobody else does. (1% vs 99%)

Eewwwww, Repubs are short in number. On my PVP server, Fleet on Repub side has a dozen or two sitting around.. On the Imp side, it's at capacity, and another instance of it is loaded. Queues for PVP are... 90% Huttball because of this imbalance. Nevermind fleet looks a LOT better on Imp side, those Holo-trees add a lot, Repub side his terribly bland. So what did I do? Switched sides.. Why? Nobody likes to play alone - do they? Nobody wants endless face-stomps in non-huttball, do they? Imp side feels more complete, like more time was spent on it, like things run better on that side. Besides, ALL armor looks better on Imperial side, the burlap sacks for Repub Jedi's are hideous. Bottom line, if Bioware doesn't get a handle on this they're in big trouble.

100% true, this is what PVP has become. I've seen this happen 5 times today alone.. Same thing happened in Rift, and Warhammer. Expertise is partly to blame, lack of brackets is another part to blame. Once the hax 50's are out of the normal warzones, this problem should be much less pronounced.

Wow that makes so much sense they wouldn't do it! Amazing how players seem to have the best ideas, companies should hire gamers to sit around and discuss this stuff. Stardock does, look at their games as a result - games you can feel a gamer made.

When Rift launched, there was no valor. Then the kiddies rushed to 50 (less than 10% of total game pop), then they wanted a 'grind' to keep them playing, and they wanted 'special perks' for having rushed. Trion tossed in Valor without much thought. It seemed OK at first. Then suddenly people started getting really high valor, and everyone else realized people with high valor had a huge advantage over people without. Unfortunately getting it required you to quit your job, and play Rift 10 hours a day for weeks. Suddenly PVP became tremendously imbalanced, the 10% totally owned over the other 90%. Trion added valor to PVE gear to try and balance it, the babies cried, and they removed it from PVE gear. Trion released a big patch, adding in up to Realm Rank 8. Big problem got HUGE as suddenly the kiddies that play 10 hours a day had R8 super-gear with even MORE valor! Within a couple weeks of doing this, it became clear that PVP was IMPOSSIBLE against people in R8 gear with very high valor. Trion went into 'panic' mode, and added the same valor as Rank 8 to ALL pvp gear prior to rank 8. Which means a Rank 2 guy had same valor as Rank 8. This kind of helped, but it was too late. The people that rushed to 50, rushed to r6 and rushed to r8 were already there, in MUCH better gear - valor or otherwise - so you literally had to grind out MONTHS getting owned by unskilled kiddies to get R8. Lots of people resorted to AFKing in Warfronts, and other tactics. But the sad reality is, most of their core pvp base simply quit the game.. Most of Rifts servers are dormant, struggling to keep their populations above 'LOW', and I really do not know more than a few people that stayed. Who are they? Of course the 10% that have a severe advantage over everyone else. Unfortunately you CANNOT pay your bills with 10% of your playerbase still active. Trion deeply regrets this design decision, and has paid dearly for it.. I heard a rumor that Trion is 'heavily' increasing the quality of lower rank gear to try and offset the kiddie 10% in a last ditch effort to draw people back. But I think its too late. SWTOR is heading down the same slippery slope.. You got 10% (probably much less) of your kiddies farming your majority playerbase for severe advantages that may never be able to be corrected. I am stunned that this design decision was made - personally - as it makes no sense business wise to piss off your majority to keep a few kiddies happy.

Because there is absolutely 100% no reason it should be there. Using your logic, 2 even players going head to head, SHOULD match up without expertise, right? So what's the point of expertise again? Speaking from experience, Trion made a HUGE mistake with Valor, and they admit it. Now they are stuck with it, and have really tried to get around it. It shouldn't have been in there in the first place. Only bads need 'special' stats to compete in pvp games, they weren't needed in all of the MMO history,but apparently they are needed now? Makes no sense at all. Gear grind is only needed if you have ADD.. All previous GOOD pvp mmos in history had no gear grind at all in fact. You are a bad spoiled pvper if you need constant 'grinds' to keep you fighting. Shadowbane, UO, Neocron, Meridian59, and more - NONE of them had a gear grind for pvp yet survived for a long time without it. Only kiddies want more and more gear, not real pvpers.

Yeah no kidding, there is LITTLE EXCUSE for this wait.. It should have LAUNCHED with a bracket.. Rush to 50? Tough luck, sit around doing nothing while the real players actually play the game - kid... Allowing these punks to farm (and MAX) valor on level 10's was a hideous mistake. In fact, they should roll back all pvping 50's to valor 40, and strip the pvp gear from them. Seriously, it would only be a tiny percentage of the population anyway! So here we sit, day after day, being farmed, waiting for the bracket.. On Ven Zallow there is a guild called "Invictus" and all they do is farm newbs, if there is another 50 premade in the warzone they leave, and queue back up to find more newbs. Pathetic, they should be rolled back. I've lost almost all faith in Bioware at this point.

Rift has - arguably - the most hideous PVP in any MMO in recent memory. The most unbalanced, atrocious nonsense ever this side of Warhammer's RR100 lumped in with RR10 garbage PVP system. Yes, a R8 cleric is still - unkillable - well unless you have 30-40 R4's to try to take him out. Even worse are rogues, doing so much burst they can kill you before stun wears and you can even hit a key. Sadly, I feel SWTOR is probably heading in the same direction unless some big changes go in. Expertise will only cause hardship unless it's scaled based on valor, and not gear. I am unsure why companies ALWAYS seem to want to cater to BAD PLAYERS that need all of these toys to compete? I mean right now SWTOR is nothing but a bunch of people that rushed to 50 ganking and farming newbs in PVP with absolutely no chance to even put up a fight back. All of these punks already have full champion gear from FARMING NEWBS. While the rest of the galaxy will have to endure endless punishment farming Champ gear against 50s when the bracket comes in. Basically, anyone 50 farming newbs right now I consider a low-life cheater. They're exploiting a seriously flawed system to gain a huge advantage. Bioware should rollback everyone onces the bracket goes in the V40, and pull the champion gear off them. They certainly didn't earn it, and everyone else that buys the game is at a tremendous disadvantage. Rift pvp is trash, will SW make the same mistakes? Myself and 3 sons canceled Rift due to the hideous PVP, and now the pvp servers are GHOST TOWNS.. All of them are 'low' pop, which means less than 500 people even playing on them!

I agree that most 50's I see that rushed to 50, aren't very good at PVP. The fact is, a significant number of them rely on their level/gear/skill advantage to compete. When my Sorc was level 15 I destroyed a 50 (Champ geared) Sage that is in my Repub side guild. I always knew she was bad, and a smack talker that just rushed to 50 to stomp newbs, but this entirely proved my point. 1v1 she can't stand against anyone that is on a level playing field. Pathetic. I'm glad for the 50's bracket, but also think they need to just pull expertise right out, so the game is based on skill not some special grinded out stat. (that they got from farming newbs)

Warzone queues went from within 1 minute of me clicking the button, to well over 5-10 minutes after clicking it. Then when I enter them, it's SOLID FIFTIES! What this shows is, all of the sub-50's have simply stopped PVPing until this mess of a pvp game is fixed. Can you blame them? Now I inspect the other team after entering a WZ, and if its more than a couple 50's I simply leave it immediately. Why wait to be farmed? Why feed them expertise gear? Really bad design decisions.

There should be NO special stat for 50 pvp, it makes no sense. In every old pvp mmo that's ever came out they didn't need special stats, it was about your build, and skill. That's enough, only bad's require special stats that put them at an extreme advantage. Nobody else does. Trion made a GIANT MISTAKE with Valor, and they admit it! They tried to remove it, then they tried to add it to PVE gear, then they decided 'screw it' and tossed the same valor on ALL pvp gear! Essentially they realize any special stat people can 'grind out' in PVP places a tremendous imbalance into the game that isn't easily fixed. I foresee a huge problem with the 50's bracket when new 50's enter it and become 'food' for people that have high expertise they got from GRINDING LOW LEVELS, while the new 50's won't have this luxury. They will be slaughtered. Therefore, choose your solution; 1) Expertise needs to be removed. 2) Expertise needs to be added to lower level pvp gear. 3) Entry-Level 50's PVP gear needs to be added that has expertise, and is purchasable with Warzone Coms prior to reaching 50. Take your pick, one of the three has to happen or the noob farming won't stop with the 50's bracket. If someone needs their own special stat to compete in pvp then they can just give up pvping. There is little logic in these 'special' stats, and they only serve to cause more imbalances.

Resolve = Broken Nuff said.

Simple answer: Expertise has to go. It ruined Rift in a BIG WAY.. Green 50's are going to get smashed, and it's going to create a new set of problems. I cannot believe developers are silly enough to keep adding a 'special' stat in for 50's pvp.. Don't they learn? Trion greatly regrets the addition of Valor into their game and has tried to remove it, but it's too late. You know, old mmo's didn't need 'special' stats to cater to BAD pvpers that need special things to compete. When will companies learn????

Anyone else notice that Sub-50's have completely stopped queing up for PVP? It's funny, 90% of all warzones are solid 50's now, farming lowbies for valor. I think globally, sub-50s just essentially gave up on PVP in SWTOR, and probably cancelled because of it! Now my only concern is how bad 50 bracket will be for NEW 50's coming into the scene? They should remove expertise completely to balance that out OR provide full expertise gear purchasable by folks that turn 50 so they don't go in at a severe disadvantage. Come on BW think this crap through! Whoever is doing your pvp needs a pinkslip.

Nonsense, 70%+ of everyone I see in WZ's right now are 50's.. A bracket will fix the issue, because right now nobody under 40 is dumb enough to even queue up! So really, it's a win -win situation adding a 50's only bracket, and needs to happen immediately.

Level 50 bracket will solve all of the major issues. Trust me. Right now 50's are knowingly FARMING low levels, and it's pathetic. When I go into a warzone it's always level 50's following me around for that 'easy kill', they are essentially padding up their numbers by abusing an extremely flawed game system. Get the 50s out, as quick as possible. I have canceled my account, and will not renew unless I see a 50-only bracket BEFORE the free 30 days is over! After that? Too late.

Good this means consumable exploiters will QQ.. Too bad! Now put in the 50-only Bracket, and the people farming lowbies will have a lot of QQ now. I always hate people that exploit flawed early-release aspects like this, and would support them having at least a fraction of their valor rolled back as a result. Everyone should be rolled back to 40 valor with the release of 1.1.

Whatever it's called, it has ruined each of these games. Valor has effectively destroyed PVP in Rift, so bad, they had to give the same valor to ALL levels of pvp gear to try and offset the tremendous imbalances. Even this didn't fix it, so now they are evaluating removal of valor, or adding valor to ALL gear (even PVE gear). Any sort of 'stat' like this is a hideous ideal for endgame pvp.

Log in to fleet on my server, empire side is very nearly at capacity. Republic side? 10-20 people standing around. I rerolled Empire simply because I want to be around a lot of people. Also, most of the republics are newbs that don't pvp on a pvp server, so if you want to lose - you roll with repubs.. I lose 90% of the warzones on repub side, and win 90% on the empire side. Which side is more condusive to leveling, and farming gear? Take a guess. At least on the imp side I can be in Warzones with LEGIONS of level 50's, vs ... 10 50's on the Repub side? Give me a break. Bioware blew it.

So.... Wheres the brackets? All I am seeing now in WZ's are well geared 50's with a smattering of level 10-40's, since most people gave up Warzones due to the faceroll happening from the 50s. You are rapidly losing customers the longer you delay the 50 bracket.

I assure you, the MAJORITY of people are 50 in Warzones. Today it was waves and waves of endless 50's in every Warzone I queued for.. Pathetic that they didn't see this coming, and have a patch to deal with it ASAP.

I support this, it has to be done IMMEDIATELY! Most of my guild is refusing to queue up for Warzones now because they are filled with 50s. 9 Warzones today so far, and 7 of them were SOLID 50s on the otherside! I know of at least 12 friends that cancelled already over this. It's destroyed the game. How could they NOT see this coming?!?!?! Whoever put in PVP like this should be taken out back and beat with a stick.

So... Where's the bracket??? 9 Warzones today, and 7 of them were nearly ALL 50's on the Empire Side. Weren't even close, and most people simply left them after the first wipefest. Espcially since the game balance is hideous, and operatives 2 shot everyone. Better fix this, I know over a dozen guildies canceled because of this nonsense. Hotfix it.. Tonight.

So is it confirmed brackets will arrive tonight? They need to hotfix a bracket in pretty quickly I think, tonight is good. In 2 weeks is NOT GOOD. Time is short, pvp is frustrating with these geared up 50's steamrolling. It makes no sense.

You can make 2 groups then queue up at the same time, 90% of the time you'll be in the same Warzone. I know, I was in a guild that did this regularly. I dont' want to rush to 50, I want to enjoy the game. There is literally no point in rushing through the content like the ADD kids that are already 50 and valor 60+. They didn't play the game, they rushed to 50 so they could own lowbies in warzones and farm out comms as quick as possible on the gravy train. It's all nonsense, the bracket needs to go in as quickly as possible - before the official patch. I recommend everyone cancel, then enter this as a reason. They'll get the message.