OlBuzzard
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Posts posted by OlBuzzard
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1 hour ago, casirabit said:
I live in South Carolina, and we rarely get snow but before that I lived in South Texas and it has only snowed a few times in centuries so if they were going to do something that is happening in the real-world timeline, that would still be a problem, as not every location in the US gets snow in the winter.
Exactly. I have lived in several locations in the US. Only two of them get snow every season. Some seasons a lot LESS than others. I would imagine folks that live in the NE part of the US (ie around the Great Lakes areas) would see snow a LOT more than I ever would.
In the end: (As it has already been pointed out) ... this is a MMO) ... Not every activity is going to be our favorite. Additionally, this is just a game. Either we can enjoy it and have fun ... or choose not to! If the affects were given an option ... then that should take care of some of the issues (if not most). The fact that XYZ number of percales are required to purchase items is one of the main reasons people participate at a higher level. IMO ... (please note that) ... IMO it has nothing to do with grief. Some people understand that .. and others never will (simply because they hate the overall event and want it gone or restricted to such a small out of the way place they don't even have to see it). And still others ... well they like to hammer just about anything they don't like or want into oblivion until everyone else is sick of the discussion.
[/shrugs]
Oh well ... I've said my peace. IMO the whole thing was just meant to be about having fun. And for whatever it's worth if everything was left as it is (from a mechanics point of view) ... and reduced to only a few weeks out of the year as a Life Day celebration I'm personally OK with that too! The "option for special effects off switch" (for lack of a better term) ... I'm OK with that too. In the end the development team will make their own decision.
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58 minutes ago, TziganeNZ said:
If a game were to be developed and released where the seasons match those for where I live, I'd probably play it in a heartbeat (so long as it wasn't mandatory PVP). Games do, however, seem to be solely Northern Hemisphere-centric. Right now, it's the middle of summer for me and other APAC players. Where I live, it doesn't snow at any time during the year - ever. I'm in my mid-50s and have never touched snow.
Or better yet, a game where there are NO seasons that attempt to match or tie up with what's happening in the real world timeline. That would be a whole lot less jarring, for sure.
Sometimes understanding cross-cultural ideas can be a bit challenging. Me ... personally ... my first encounters date back to my early days at UNM ... I had an engineering prof from Austria (IIRC) ... a business prof from Australia and my Calculous professor from China (I'm trying to remember how to spell his name correctly ... but that was 1971 and I've forgotten a few things along the way phonetically it would be spelled Gao but I know for a certainty that is not correct). Something really interesting about that man ... even though he was the head of the entire Math Dept. at UNM ... he always had time to work with students individually. I remember that as though it were yesterday. (Yeah ... I was one of those who struggled with that class).
I have friends literally scattered all over the world to this day: Nairobi, Kenya; Athens, Greece; London, England; Two in Wales (they've recently moved ... don't remember exactly where) ... A good friend of mine (in his early 20's) just went to visit his parents in Argentina for a couple of months.
I'm certain that all to often we take some of the simple things in this life for granted entirely too much!
BTW... I do hope my somewhat odd way of doing things isn't too much of a royal pain (Us old folks can do that from time to time without thinking about it!)
And yes ... I said all of that to say this: reaching across those kinds of boundaries can make us a whole lot of friends that we would never have made otherwise.
... Best of luck to ya!
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Keep it simple people! DON'T overthink it ...
** Lifeday ... wintertime celebration (of sorts).
** With the wintertime celebration comes the idea of a lighthearted time of fun. And (for some of us "younger" folks) ... yeah that would include a good old fashion lighthearted snowball fight. I personally thought the snowball cannon was a nice touch. It still brings a smile to my face.
** POSSIBLE changes: Disable throughout certain times of the year (to co-inside with winter months ... I'm sure it's always wintertime somewhere!!!) 😜** Additional POSSIBLE change: the ability (optional) to "remove" (for lack of a better term) ... said "snowball" visual affect for those that just don't want to participate in said fun and festivities.
And yes ... I totally get that. Just as some of us REALLY don't like certain areas of SWTOR ... Some folks just don't like well ... anything outside of their own preferences.
BTW... @Jdast .... "beachfront estate" on Tatooine works even better !! 😉
EDIT: In order to make things more "realistic" on ohhhh ... say Tatooine (since we're already there) ... Should the snowball be changed to Banta poodooo just to fit loaction better! (Probably not ... BUT what the heck ... why not it makes sense that way! RIGHT??? NO?? )
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1 hour ago, Nee-Elder said:
Same reason i read yours.
For this helpful thing known as: CONTEXT
First off: it's not just "snoball or two" . It's the CONSTANT barrage repeatedly 24/7 that the players are complaining about.
Secondly: Other than me making an empty suggestion about NPCs only, no one in this thread is calling for snoballs to be "forbidden" . The OP & many other players were asking simply to have an OPTION (method) by which they could avoid being harassed for 4 weeks with snoballs. Like an item to make them immune to snoballs, so they wouldn't have to keep clicking off the buff icon & effects.
You & the other 2 fans seem to have some major problem with that ^ and it's making u guys very very upset at even the notion that somehow certain players might have a different definition of "fun" than you 3 do. Gasp the horror!
Here i'll sum up the thread for you since reading is so hard:
- Group A doesn't like getting pelted with digital snoballs + derogatory snoffffflaykes
- Group B really likes doing it to people cuz reasons
- Group A wishes for an item to repel such an annoyance, while still allow Group B to have their fun/rewards
- Group B freaks out and starts shaming Group A for simply wanting to be left alone in peace
- Group A mostly leaves the thread since what's the point of trying to interact with Group B
- Group B becomes vocal minority and fuels their own hubris
- Group C ( Coders ) watches and never changes anything regardless
Annnnddd /thread.
Annnnd ...
frankly some of us were just trying to find some common ground that MOST MIGHT agree on! (there is no such thing as EVERYONE agreeing!)
** Yes this is w/o question a MMO ... and we have to accept the fact that not everyone will see things the way we do. I will be the first to admit that my approach is not always the best. BUT I do often find out where and why some of the issues are there in the first place. AND (on occasion) we might even stumble across an answer that might just work! 😲
** Unfortunately, some folks are here to just argue their point regardless of (fill in the blank) ... Wouldn't matter. they are ALWAYS right (regardless). [/facepalm]
** As for OP ... I can appreciate the fact that sometimes there are some minor things that should be considered for changes. AND NO I am not suggesting to remove this part from SWTOR completely. BUT it could easily be argued that (at least the effects) of the snowball fest might be disabled or a provision made where it would not be necessary to click on the ikon and have it removed. That is assuming that: Group C ( Coders ) watches and never changes anything regardless does not apply and the team agrees to make any changes in the first place.
As for me personally: I honestly enjoyed it (in the past). Right now the game overall is losing a LOT more than just a few moments of what some of see as simple lighthearted fun. NO it is NOT being juvenile (regardless of what some might think). As for the location inside of the space station ... seriously ... just lighten up! I mean it really. Get over it! Someone is wound up waaaaay to tight! Believe me I know ... I USE to be like that! It's just not worth it!
OP: If for some reason that a SIMPLE fix can be found where the effects of the snowball thing can be handled much like the Rakghoul vaccine ... I'm good with that! The Lifeday event continues (maybe even gets a few things added to update it and make it more worthwhile) ... and the "snowflakes" that some find troublesome goes away for those that hate it!
BTW... it should be noted that all of my characters keep a Rakghoul plague vaccine on them at all times to be used as needed.
And how to I expect folks to respond to this??
Same as always! Are you kidding me???
👎
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1 minute ago, Darkestmonty said:
Players that want to RP can do so in personal strongholds. People aren't invading random strongholds to hit RPers with snowballs.
Players have been throwing snowballs at NPC's, mobs, and even in PvP for over a decade to earn parcels. Disabling the use of snowballs anywhere in the game for an event that has been going on for over a decade to cater a very minor amount of RPers seems absurd.
Good!
Precisely the reaction I was expecting !!!!
NO! This time you are flat wrong!
I intentionally left out specifics... such as locations that would seem appropriate. And IMO .. there are places where this sort of fun would be inappropriate. In the middle of the latest story is one! But it is also obvious that you are not interested in asking questions that might find an appropriate solution.
Public places SUCH as the stations ... (Republic and Empire alike) ... The same designated area for the Hutt Feast ... Maybe even a couple of new areas (such as on HOTH) ... might be more appropriate. Change sometimes can be good! This would NOT stop or otherwise inhibit the Life Day snowball fun.
BTW... it should be noted that until this year .. I have participated in the Life Day celebrations as much as possible. So much so that I have several hundred parcels left over!
😉
The simple fact is that sometimes ... changes can be good!
It should be noted ... that since there seems to be very little real progress or genuine need for this discussion any more ... I think I'll just OPT OUT for a bit!
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30 minutes ago, TziganeNZ said:
We already have the ability to show/not show various nameplates as our personal preference on what we want to see on our own monitors, so it's not a huge leap to think that perhaps a similar "show player mounts" toggle could also be incorporated? Similarly, one that toggles whatever the wording for snowflakes or sparkle bombs or whatever else you don't necessarily want to see could also be done in a similar way.
I'm no dev, so no idea if this is viable or not, but it seems a little odd considering we already have this for nameplates in our preferences.
While I don't pretend to be that well versed in technobabble stuff ... programming ... etc...
I would imagine that the best solution would be something on the order of a vaccine .. or temporary injected implant to simply ward off the effects of the dreaded snowball attacks!
(In other words, this seems to keep the solution as simple as possible).
There are also a couple of observations that IMO are somewhat equally accurate:
** The snowball fun from Life Day does not inhibit, disrupt or otherwise take away from a players skill or stats. The effect is simply there (it's a visual display only.** There are a number of equally annoying things found in game. (Well to some people these are annoying). Inappropriate dress codes for players: (for example) slave girl outfits on Hoth for the ladies (please do not derail the entire discussion over this one either) ... [/facepalm]. People using the largest most annoying mount possible to cover up NPC points of interest (that other players need access to). WEAPONS tuning (frankly I'm not sure where some of those items were dreamed up ... but those ideas need to be sent back to the drawing board!)
** There ARE areas of forced participation (see the GS series) IF you want to get all of the rewards. Frankly some of us gladly OPT OUT ... and no longer give one royal-rippity-ruha about the GS series anymore. Yes ... I'm one of them!
All in all there are a number of things that can be annoying! Some of those things can be a lot more easily addressed than others.
The snowball thing is one that could be more easily solved (up to a point). And IF it turns out that it's an "EASY" fix then I would support it. Please note ... YES I did all cap the word "EASY" for a clear reason. What is easy to us, may (or may NOT) be easy for the team.
OH!! Something that some of us may be overlooking ... IMO the snowball thing should be disabled in the rest of the game areas ... period! There are a number of folks that do enjoy RP while in game. And though I'm not one of them .... I do respect their approach to SWTOR.
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7 hours ago, TziganeNZ said:
Yes, that is correct. Right-clicking will indeed remove the effect, yet others have admitted in this thread that they do not respect the other player's choice not to have the effect on their character.
The Rakghoul Plague is another annoying one, but you do have the option to disengage with it by buying and using a vaccine. Be nice to have the same option for the Life Day effect annoyance.
In all the MMOs I've played, I've only very occasionally taken part in any of the seasonal events as I find them jarring. This is, of course, my own choice, and I've absolutely no problem with the events themselves.
Please believe me when I tell you ... I totally understand.
Hmmm ...
[/scratches head]
maybe not a vaccine ...
GOT it!
How about a small transponder! Even if you get hit ... zero results actually shows up!
It just kind of strikes me funny a bit though! At my age you'd think I'd be the one opposed to the event! (You know ... us old folks can be a bit testy sometimes)
BTW... @Nee-Elder ... If I didn't find SOMETHING to fuss about (every now and then) he'd think my account had been hijacked or something!
😉
(Edit: ... BTW ... I actually won't care what was used... as long as a reasonable solution was reached. Something like the snowball thing is supposed to simply be fun. A good break from the rest of the game! IMO ... nothing more ... nothing less!)
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17 minutes ago, Darkestmonty said:
The issue is simple.
Is it worth spending developer time to disable snow sparkles for players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable festive decorations for players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable emotes on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable party bomb on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable cartel market outfits on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable cartel market weapons on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable cartel market tunings on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable cartel market flairs on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Is it worth spending developer time to disable cartel market pets on players who do not like to see them?
Next...
Do you see where this is going? If the developers cater to every sensitivity for players, the devs will be spending their whole time changing every aspect of SWTOR into a toggle which honestly won't do anything to generate revenue or retain players.
We already have people demanding mounts be disabled on fleet because the sound is harassing them and they assure us everyone agrees with this potential ban on mounts on fleet.
If snow sparkles is ruining your game experience, the Life Day event may be something you want to skip.
On the other hand ... that door swings both ways!
You could have just given the development team a good reason to discontinue the Life Day experience altogether! It would save a lot of time and resources needed elsewhere!
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32 minutes ago, TziganeNZ said:
Ah, the condescension is strong with this one!
Snowball throwing isn't normal person-to-person interaction in a MMO (and I've played enough of them to know - this game certainly isn't my first). It is only for a specific, time-limited event - but that doesn't mean that those of us who dislike the effect it has on the person who has no choice in being a participant (the target) should be the ones to hide away when we just want to play our game, however we wish to (and how those of us with subs pay for). Equally, those who throw the snowballs should also stop expecting everything to be about them and their personal wishes/comfort, and show some respect to people who immediately click the effect off, indicating that the effect is unwelcome.
As I, and many others in this thread have said, I have no wish to have the event or the snowballs removed - if people find it fun, good for them, and may they enjoy every one! All I would like is an opt-out option for the visual effect. It would not impact others' gameplay or experience, so I fail to understand why there is this vitriol towards those for whom this effect is annoying.
It's also weird having snowballs in the middle of summer...../shrug
I did confirm that the affect can be removed by right clicking the "affect" listed near you character !
As for making it an easier step ...
Hmmm
Frankly it's not nearly as bad as the Rakgoul Plague (I find it 100 times more annoying) ... having the option to "disable" the snowball affects ... I could live with that.
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1 hour ago, Nee-Elder said:
lol obviously.
But MMOs aren't designed for harassment.
All some players ( in this thread and in-game ) are suggesting is a simple method by which to OPT-OUT of 'snowball' EFFECTS.
Sort of like an add-ignore for that specific partical effect.
That way, the griefer gamers can still have their umm "earnest" Life Day fun, while letting other less juvenile SWTOR people go about their own version of fun uninterupted ( by having to right-click constantly the icons off bar ) .
What's so wrong with that?
p.s. If anyone thinks repeatedly hurling digital balls of a widely known derogatory word on the interwebs ( rhymes with slowcakes ) which i'm not even allowed to type on these forums without getting *warning* is somehow now considered to be legit "MMO social interaction" , then i would suggest online-obsessed Humans truly have become beyond the point of no return.
BAH !!! HUMBUG !!!!
😉
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IMO ... it's all a part of the overall SWTOR Life Day FUN!
The celebrated day is not for everyone (cf. Ebenezer Scrooge).
BTW... IIRC there use to be an icon included in the individual affects that you can right click on and the snowflake effects go away. It's been a while since I've bothered to log in .... but I'm certain someone can verify that!
It should be noted that for those who hate this sort of camaraderie ... I kind of feel sorry for ya! To me (personally) life is entirely too short to not take a brake and just have some fun! And ... yes in my younger years (age 60 or so) ... I still engaged those who were much younger than I in a snowball fight from time to time!
😜
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8 hours ago, AFadedMemory said:
Will does not equal always.
The only person who can know with 100% certainty what someone's intentions were, is the person who preformed the action. I know there are people who sell credits. I know there is a need to make such exchanges look legitimate, I know that the previous GTN could provide such a benefit using any sellable item.
I made no guarantees. Based on observing how the old and new system worked I hypothesized that laundering credits is now harder (that is a fact) thus less people will be involved in the process. (that is what's up for debate.)
I also hypothesized the lower prices on the GTN (fact) is due to the recent change.(debatable item) reason behind hypothesize:
-Higher prices could sometimes sell when a lower price exists at the same time (old rule)
-Higher prices can not sell when a lower price exists at the same time (New Rule)
Because higher prices can't sell there appears to be a greater urgency to sell at lowest prices then what previously existed.
I'm not the one who generated the idea. I'm not the one enforcing the idea. The new system actually upsets me when I'm selling items. However I like buying at lower prices more then any complaint I have. I also see the potential to combat game damaging behavior.
This statement is not true. I will acknowledge that there is room for debate on how long the changes last, how much of the drop is influenced by the change, and how many items are effected. (the effect/result will not be the same in every instance of time or varying item being observed. high competitive items will see the greatest effects while low competitive item will see less effect)
If the change caused more damage then they intended it to prevent I will say it's bad. not enough time has passed to see that yet.
It's also important to note that the goal is more complex then stopping credit sellers/scammers. If that was BS's only goal they would disable credit exchanging of any kind. That would most likely kill the game, and if it didn't they would see and increase in security key accounts for cc and the sellers would just trade cartel items for a discounted real world price.( they would probably try to trade other items for money as well) BS would then be forced to either get rid of CC gain on security keys or disable item trading. Again that would most likely kill the game.
NO!
Most of this is YOUR opinion and not proven fact!
BTW... for the record pricing has nothing (or at least very little) to do with what the RL criminal mind will limit itself to do (in this case circumventing whatever is necessary) in order to sell or distribute credits illegally. Your idea only works when people utilize the GTN exclusively for whatever means that suits their needs.
Final note: attempting to take apart
EVERY line
by every line
BY every line
That I post and make sure that everyone else sees just how wrong that ANYONE is ... that isn't working!
You view is still ... simply your view. (and one based on your personal bias).
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3 hours ago, Nee-Elder said:
Some very vocal forum users "hate" it, yes. But you're also over-presuming your own personal experience speaks for the "majority" of X amount of players. Furthermore, you're also forgetting the harsh but true fact: Insatiable players like you aren't for whom KOTET/KOTFE was created.
Heck, once EA caved almost immediately and went Free-To-Pay ( Cartel Market cash grab reskins x infinity ) most of the entire SWTOR stockpile of story-content isn't even geared ( pun intended ) toward players like you. Nor toward loyal 2011 beta "sandbox SWG" type $ubscribers like me for that matter; save for a few paltry crumbs of non-themepark exception.
Check my post-history and you'll see i'm VERY critical of BioWare/Broadsword for many many years about many many many topics.
But feel free to call me a KOTET/KOTFE "defender" , since imho as far as true expansions go, it def. delivered actual significant story content. ( which is more than i can say for whatever you wanna call what we've been getting these past few years )
The 1st time i played it ( as Jedi Sage ) having no spoilers at all other than the amazing trailer from 'Blur Studios' , i thought it was EPIC Star Wars content and i loved every single minute of it. So much that i've not only repeated ALL chapters again 7 more times on 7 different characters , but also finished it on master-mode. ( solo'd except for 2 impossibly overtuned boss fights ) . And i'm currently on my 9th run of it again, this time on my Smuggler.
That's a debatable hypothetical of course, with zero chance of ever being conclusive.
Plus, i would argue the following utterly ridiculous changes/decisions were wayyyyyy more "harmful" ...
- getting rid of 'skill trees'
- ignoring GSF
- practically obliterating Crafting
- the so called combat "pruning"
- changing how gearing works over & over & over again so much that now people think gearing = "content"
- removing DvL super-bosses & systems , whilst making some empty "promise" it would come back but yet it still hasn't
- eradicating 'Ranked' PVP completely ( instead of just doing the Ranked/Regs merge )
- allowing the "economy" to get so bad ( until recent drastic GTN + Taxes )
- refusal to PERMA-ban cheaters, dupers, win-traders, etc.
-
total obsession with all things Cartel Market ( instead of more balance between transient profit$ vs. MMO longterm player driven items like schematics & mini-games ( like Sabacc!
)
.... Need i go on?
i respect your list & efforts , but you're just as opinionated/jaded as anyone else is around here.
In other words: easy with the whole condescending "teachable moment" schtick lol we all have our various ( and vocal ) points-of-view.
Divided? Perhaps. But nevertheless equal.
Both very fair points ^ yep.
And i hear ya on the whole non-Force-user aspect. Obviously, it would've been much better had BioWare the time/money/interest in writing additional story tracks for Smuggler/BH/Operative/Trooper , relating to Valkorian/Arcann/Vaylin *powers* .
Also a fair point ^ , although i'm not exactly sure how they (BioWare and/or Broadsword ) could've gotten around that situation.
Other than introducing another super duper even more dangerous and original "galactic threat" ?*
i dunno ... i'd have to ponder a bit more about it.
*Maybe lock your character in a room with Fleet genchat politics bots + DK toxic trolls?
One players "waaaaaaaaaay too long" is another player's EPIC JOURNEY!
But anyways, see above my earlier reply about "replayability" . I do hear ya though , cuz again i've done it almost 9 times now on 9 diff toons ...but that's over the past 8 YEARS. ( i always need a break between characters before i jump right into my next complete story progression catch-up-to-current )
Not true , since you're again forgetting about all the NEW players who come into this game without any bitterness nor knowledge of forums.
They just wanna play Star Wars and so when they get to KOTET/KOTFE for their 1st time ( usually as Force users ) they tend to enjoy it that 1st time thru.
Therefore, from EA's eyes, it's still technically repeatable content. ( especially since if you wanna skip it , it costs you both in money$$$ and in character development/choices being done for you ) .
First, your OPINION isn't "fact" , no matter how well you articulate it. ( And btw, i really enjoyed reading your arguments & points within this post today )
Secondly, i sorta get what you're saying but i also don't believe ALL of the storylines since year 2015 ( KOTET/KOTFE ) have been totally "lackluster" . The problem imo was with EA in general and certain subsequent fundamental core game choices made by BioWare. Not necessarily caused by that ^ story expansion. More so caused by unfortunate & misguided code decisions to try "fixing what ain't broken" ...continuously.
YUP!
There are a hand full of folks still around that still hate KotFE / ET .
IMO the real disaster behind it was the way all of the companions were done away with all at once. Gone! POOF! Then there was the mechanics behind it (the gearing system was horrible). I like a lot of the story behind it. I REALLY like the idea that it was repeatable and I could go back and try parts of it at a harder setting. I kind of wish we could do some of the newer areas like that today (but that will never happen).
AND you are ALSO correct on the areas that have been a LOT more harmful to the game than what we went through with KotFE / ET. That list (though not complete) is pretty much right on! I would also very STRONGLY agree that if the RIGHT people inside of EA cared as much for the game development as they did the CM and their cash grab mentality SWTOR would be in a LOT better shape today!
Overall ... I really think highly of your post! I wish I could give you a PLUS 10 on the reaction thing!
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On 12/20/2023 at 12:52 AM, AFadedMemory said:
I agree that no name is a good way to prevent credit selling on the gtn, but Force Cheap Sale is a stronger deterrent. Put the two together and you have a really strong deterrent.
As for cheap sale help laundering, no it makes it harder. If someone was able to keep an items price at 100,000 it would still take 10,000 transaction to reach a billion. 10 transactions to 1 million. (If it was a million it would take 1,000 transactions to reach a billion.)
As someone said previously, using a quote from a dev, bs monitor the gtn. We can’t see names but they can. If a player sells a non demand item for billions that’s strange behavior. If some person is buying a specific item multiple time and it happens to be from the same person, that’s strange behavior.
force cheap sell also greatly impacts the price in the downward direction so it’s not just being used as a credit laundering deterrent.
Freedom to choice a price has not been taken away, sure it’s harder to buy or sell at the price you want, but can still be accomplished. The main purpose of the gtn is still being accomplished.
Perhaps from your standpoint of view. BUT not entirely true! The simple fact is that you are bent on your philosophical position and you refuse to see anything else.
(Not being argumentative ... that's just how it is).
** People will purchase the cheaper prices regardless.
** You have absolutely NO proof that the higher prices were the basis for laundering credits.
** Forced purchase to one line item is no guarantee of anything that you are assuming.** You WANT to force people to buy a certain way ... then new system works that way sooo ... that's the way you like it!
The new GTN does fix several things that have been mentioned and I like most of what has been done! The forced cheaper purchase only does NOT force prices down. You obviously assume it does. BUT in the end you are still relying on what people are wanting and are willing to pay for what is being sold. ( I still refuse to pay some of the prices being posted today).
😲
Leave the GTN as it is save for one item: forced purchase of cheapest price only.
STOPPING the influx of credits at the source (primarily credit sellers) will cut off the biggest part of the problem. AND (when it comes right down to it) ... CREDITS can become even more useless when items can be earned actually playing the game (meaning that stuff can be gained through decent drops ... not from JUST the CM.)
If you want to strike another hard blow to credit scammers just make most of the gear we need (as well as other key fun items such as decos) BOP and that will hurt the scammers even more!
Any ways ...
I know you'll never agree!
Soooo I rather suspect this will be my last post. Besides you and I both know that the team is not going to change the GTN any time soon. It is what it is!
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36 minutes ago, denavin said:
I like the new system.
I like not having to wade through a hundred pages of the same item.
I like only having 20 or so pages of one item per line.
I could care less who the seller is.
I ALWAYS bought the LOWEST priced items even if it was only 1 credit lower. I never bought the higher price.
All I hear here is "I can't sell or buy credits any more because nobody can see my name"
Keep the new system, it works just fine.
Agreed on all points save one: purchasing ONLY the cheapest one available. Even then, I would agree up to a point ... BUT there are times when it is also appropriate to not be forced to do so (as I've already explained).
It should be noted that I ALSO mentioned (more than once) that I hated digging through page after page, after page, after page ... of one line item (usually by the same person) AND often times just a quantity of one!!! That was REALLY annoying!
Only a minor tweak respectfully requested to the new system!
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Undercutting prices (and guaranteeing that is the only item to be purchased... ) guarantees the location of any item to be scammed!
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I personally think I've read enough of all of this. And (though not solicited) I will add this:
The elimination of "names" of the sellers is perhaps the single most important item to help prevent selling scams. Pricing restrictions in selling not so much.
WHY?
The absence of names is obvious. BUT what is not so obvious is the pricing game. Claiming that the higher prices set up scams is a joke! If anything, it has the opposite effect. Credit sellers (scammers) are not that concerned over a few lost credits when looking at the greater scheme of things. In fact, selling at the cheapest price almost guarantees that someone who is supposed to be assisting in the so-called laundering of credits will know EXACTLY where and WHEN to find a particular item for sale.
"Just look for my [insert item] at approximately 100K less than anyone else... "It was also proven that in some cases (under the old system) that some F2P people were using it as a personal storage for items that they did not have room for or needed storing .... sooo they priced it just ridiculously high. And before "someone" jumps my case and tell everyone that this is a lie and can't be proved ... IMO there is a LOT more support for this "theory" than the "scammer theory".
The bottom line is that the elimination of names almost guarantees that in order for something on the GTN to be easily found and identified said item MUST be at the top of the list. That makes it easy and convenient to locate. Just look for the cheapest price. Need a few more credits... no problem. We'll just sell you a few more!
IMO the elimination of names is a must to continue. Forcing sales to be restricted to ONLY the first few or cheapest item ... no so much.
Overall leave the new system in tact .. just make a few tweaks.
BTW.. it should be noted that my personal contempt for credit sellers cannot be expressed properly without taking a HUGE risk being permanently banned from the SWTOR forums. (so yeah .. if you're a scammer or credit seller ... let me show you to the nearest air lock).
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I'm guessing I must have pulled a Han Solo : Well, I must've hit pretty close to the mark to get 'em all riled up like that!
😜
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7 hours ago, Darkestmonty said:
This is the scam of selling dyes for 3 billion each.
Notice the Unit Price spacing? That odd spacing was used to pull another scam making the unit price look cheaper than it was and thanks to the GTN not arranging unit prices properly the first click, people probably got caught by that scam as well. This was mostly used on expensive resources where people look at unit price more often.
But since you never fell for either of those scams... it never happened to anyone right?
Selling lowest price first eliminates those scams as well as using the GTN to launder credits from credit buyers.
Question: respectfully asking.
If you are able to see this and identify it as a scam ... shouldn't others? Maybe even someone from the dev team? AND if so? Could this not be stopped by an appropriate means other than subjecting the rest of the community to unnecessary (perhaps even) unfair sales practices???
I'm just asking! Frankly I'm looking at solutions that will clean up issues that hurt all of us!
EDIT: I can see the point in removing names! I'm OK with that!
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7 hours ago, AFadedMemory said:
Undercut:
- Offer goods or services at a lower price than a competitor
- To weaken, damage, or cause the failure of something
Based on these definitions, an undercut of 1 credit is a proper undercut. I don't think being undercut is a good thing though. I don't like placing an item on the gtn only to find it not sold because someone is selling one at a lower price. it doesn't really matter if the difference is 1 or 100,000 credits a failed sale is a failed sale. If I'm going to be honest, it upsets more when I'm undercut by large margins. Because now my item is worth a large margin less.
As I mentioned earlier all the items are the same in a single listing. Not being able to choose what listing you get to buy, I assume is what you meant, is most definitely happening.
To say one margin of undercutting is good and one margin of undercutting is bad doesn't really make sense. If BS intentions were to prevent undercutting/cutting in line the easiest solution would be to have a queue of sale. i.e. the items would sell in the order they were listed. I think most of us would agree that that's a bad idea. If you really don't support undercutting you can request to buy said item for the undercut price in Trade Chat or wait for someone else to buy said item.
Going back to BS's intentions, I feel like the goals they have for the GTN are more realistically accomplished with force cheapest sale. Once again, I don't know this for sure because 1.) BS hasn't stated the overall objective for the GTN, and 2.) I don't have the needed data to compare. I would imagine however, once time pass BS will change how the GTN works if it's not working the way they hoped or intended. I for one believe that they are not likely to undo the changes.
Regardless of intentions: the lack of choice is hurting the overall scope of everything else that was done correctly in the GTN.
** If someone wants to undercut prices that's cool! That is their choice! And it should also be the choice of those spending their credits as to accept the price (as it is) or no!
** It should also be noted that very seldom does ANYONE demand to pay the HIGHER price. IMO there's no real discussion there! To me personally a lot of it depends on the item I'm looking at. It ALSO depends on how much of a cheaper price it is. One or two credits difference to me personally NOPE! If someone wants to get my attention it will be a significantly cheaper price. Now THAT to me is someone wanting to SELL and beat the other person at the game. THAT is the person I want to do business with. One credit (especially with this new system) ... I'm not that impressed and could care less! And YES I really have (in the past when we had the option) would frequently bypass the one person flooding the market with their ONE credit cheaper price and buy from someone else!
Competition is good! Cleaning up the pages and pages of the same item (offered by the same person one item at a time) was also VERY good! A couple of tweaks to the system and things will be fine.
I would STRONGLY recommend making the changes!
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2 hours ago, Lord_Janosch said:
That's for me (from a casual sellers perspective) the only bad thing about the new GTN, which from my POV needs to change. Make it so that the fee is only paid i you sell or if you cancel your offer/change the price to undercut. So I have the option to wait till my offer expires and I pay nothing (execpt time), or I pay the fee and relist to undercut.
The whole point of the GTN is for the convenience of posting items for sale by other players. Those items are not just there to look at (window shopping). IMO when the transactions are completed .. then ALL of the associated fees are collected NOT beforehand. If the items expire and NO transactions have taken place .. then .. well that's it. Nothing else happens! You get all of your stuff back (including the deposit) and IF you so desire ... repost it and try again!
(Keep it simple)
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17 minutes ago, AFadedMemory said:
I get that. What I'm trying to say is the function BS is trying to accomplish now is most likely different/more restrictive then it originally was. For example say someone wants to sit on something other then the ground. A log and a metal char fit that function. Now say someone wants to sit on something other then the ground and rest their back on a sold object. the log, generally speaking, doesn't fits this function. Which function is better? Hard to say. There are times an places where one is preferred over the other.
Now as for the current function BS wants the GTN to accomplish. I don't know. Here is a guess:
A system with low data/storage requirement, allows players to sell items and buy without being in the same place. Addresses common scams, increases item variety, strongly deters credit laundering, and keep prices low.
If this is the goal/function I would argued that the new GTN can accomplish this better then the old one. Can I prove it, no. I don't have the old GTN statistics, and the new one hasn't been out long enough to generate a long term pattern.
Once again I don't know what BS's goal is, and I won't unless they share that information. Only time will till if BS's changes will cripple the game or help it.
The changes are not significant enough to cause me to play other games, and I would like to believe most people like other aspects of the game well enough to keep playing.
Hey .. trust me this is all good.
Sometimes in order to get to the heart of the matter it's necessary to take things apart ... find out what makes it tick ... then put it back together again.
It's not enough to simply tear stuff down! Good grief ... ANYBODY can tear stuff down. BUT ... finding out how to FIX it when it's all said and done ... that to me is another matter altogether different!
Right now it definitely appears that a part of the GTN needs a bit of tweaking. That does not mean tear down and start over. IMO there's a way to fix this.
BTW... thanks for taking the time out of your schedule to hash this out with the old man! Much appreciated!
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@AFadedMemory ...
Hmmm! I trying to think of the best way to point something out without one of my usual (and somewhat verbose and often boring) explanations.
Form, fit and function. A hallmark of production quality. If the "new item" fails in one of these areas then there is an obvious oversight somewhere. That usually indicates the necessity to review and recall or perhaps at least fine tune something that is creating the issue.
One of the old problems: line after line, after line, after line ... (and sometimes just a quantity of ONE). MAN that was ANNOYING! The solution of conidiation was (and still is) EXCELLENT!
The QOL issue: If you don't like the new system sell individually. This is both awkward and time consuming. By definition of the existence of the GTN in the first place it should be a place of open commerce. Or at the least that is a generalized and somewhat simplified definition. As it now stands a part of that is now broken. Not only does it take away a part of the choice of the one spending the credits ... BUT it also creates a loss of credits to those who just got undercut since there is now no longer a refund of credits for the items not sold. By that I mean ... If anyone posts an item to sell (pay the required deposit) then 30 seconds later they are undercut by even so much as one credit there's an increased probability that their item will not sell. The deposit is gone regardless of what other choices are made. That would irritate me personally. Reposting is one thing! OK ... all that takes is time. I get that part. BUT now an additional deposit on a relisting that could just as easily evaporate without selling one item?
***UGH***
The consolidation thing is great. It was needed and that part works!!
Purchase only the cheapest item: Sorry! I'm still not convinced this is the right thing to do! Telling others to go outside of the GTN in order to sell their stuff as a result of this ... NO! The QOL aspect of the GTN just evaporated.
Nonrefundable deposit on items not sold (canceled or simply not sold): NO ... Just simply NO!
(rats ... STILL too long winded)
Sorry!
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38 minutes ago, AFadedMemory said:
The items are all the same. what they don't "get to choose" is the price, which technically is not true. They can ask to buy an Item for a higher, or lower, price in trade chat.
I'm pretty sure the answer to this is no.
Respectfully:
** The necessity for asking (or selling outside of the GTN) in order to "make things work" sort of defeats the purpose of the GTN and (in fact) also is a clear indication that the current system is unquestionably falling short of a QOL point of application for the trade center.
** This in turn pretty much defeats a part of the GTN in that it should be providing a better environment for players to buy / sell / trade.
** While I personally would frequently look at simply the cheapest price (on just about any item) ... I can make a better choice when I'm able to review ALL of the information: How long an item has been posted at its current price; How MANY are available at that price (by that I mean ... did someone just dump a large quantity flooding the market at just one credit cheaper forcing others to buy theirs first??? Frankly I've been known to deliberately pay the higher price to irritate the one flooding the market at a one credit cheaper price!)
** I also realize that some folks want to simply find a way to "corner" the market. That was under the old system. Whales (I really don't like that term, but the youngsters use it ... and most everyone knows what it means) ... ANYHOW ... WHALES don't worry about a few credits for one second! They just keep posting multiple times at whatever (one credit cheaper price) is needed to insure their sales. (IMO that is controlling the market to some degree).
** And frankly ... for me PERSONALLY (that means a lot of folks will disagree with the old man) ... I just hate the idea of NOT having a choice regarding purchasing from ONLY the lowest price. Yeah ... I get the whole drive down the market idea. BUT in the long run it will drive people AWAY from the GTN altogether. I don't have an updated 7.4 version of my crystal ball just yet and frankly I have YET to order it (yes there is a subtle message there too) ... So, I can't tell anyone exactly what the total outcome will be.
BTW: it should be noted that this will not 100% insure happiness to everyone. I'm also convinced that regardless of what the team does they will be fried to a golden crisp regardless.
Lastly: Nonrefundable deposits on canceled or expired sales??? WHAT??? EXCUSE ME??
NO! Just simply ... NO!
(BTW... this is not a rant. So don't take it that way!)
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Where are we going, and how did we get here?
in General Discussion
Posted
On this we agree 100%.
Additionally: IMO SWTOR has been following a downward spiral even in their story telling. I have my own personal thoughts on how and why ... but since I can only speculate as to the answers to both of those ... it's not worth posting (and I won't).
Also: IMO, even the GS series is totally lackluster both in objectives and rewards.
For these two primary reasons I have un-subbed. I'm not suggesting that this will be my last post ... but (unless there is a total turnaround in SWTOR) ... I'm done. There is not hate, no bitterness ... only disappointment that it has come to this and I find it necessary to part company.
Sooo much of what SWTOR could have and SHOULD have been will now only be a sad reminder of what actually happened. The events just prior to the 10th anniversary debacle and everything since is a reflection of a greater issue at the heart of this game. It is not my place to try to fix it. But I do feel that at least some sort of commentary on the matter is at least appropriate (Although I'm VERY certain it will go on the "ignore that" list like most everything else we've said.)
To that end: Best of luck to those that remain here. To those in the development team that might actually care (even though you may not be able to speak out publicly) ... take care.
May the force be with you .... always!