Lol. Really? Ok, let's try this then. Kiting is just as subject to the whims of the environment. Corridors? Pillars? That little bump in the ground that your character gets stuck on just as the jugg comes bearing down on you? All screws kiting just as much as it screws LOS. Doing me a favor? Heh. Lean out? Sure you can't at greater than 4m - but try 'leaning out' to hardcast a tracer with a jugg pillar dancing you. But it's okay - his channels self root him too. Oh wait. Dance around that pillar, and that jugg will hit you with every ability in his rotation. Now you're not even bothering to argue about the new mechanics - you're just making an appeal to the 'ranged merc dps is better than melee' argument, which is patently nonsense, as ranked season after ranked season has demonstrated. Now you're trying to have your cake and eat it. The point isn't to LOS for the entire fight. It's to LOS during critical moments. Like every good melee player does, right now. If you're arguing that LOS favours the merc (just... lol), then I suggest you go watch some tourny vids. Because... seriously. If I want to kill a jugg, I'll take a wide open field every. single. time.

Ohhh I see. You're just trolling. No problem. Lulz. You funny.

You can LOS ranged. You can't LOS melee. Resource generation can be problematic I grant you, particularly for the jugg - and we've already discussed how Vig/Veng has it's own unique problems, which aren't specific to mercs, but rather any healing class. I've come across more people now who are learning to deal with the shield and reflect. Maras and sins particularly, but also a Jugg or two now. Just not veng, because veng has (more) problems 1v1ing heals. And as I've mentioned elsewhere, I'm not totally convinced that guardian/jugg defences are working correctly right now.

I'm not sure why people keep quoting that video when it's a *prime* example of a nerf that should never have happened, driven by whiners who refused, point blank, to learn how to play. The moment people realised they had an interrupt on their hotbar, mercs became fishfood. That mercs were *also* nerfed meant they were exiled to the PvP wastelands until 2.x (at least - many didn't consider them viable until 4.x).

Wondered if you had any thoughts on this.

Yeah I usually find the problem is with fighting multiple people. If I go to an offnode, gank someone on the way, and then manage to 1v2 people at the node, I'll often only get credit for the one I ganked. If I had to guess, I'd say there's some interaction between the people you're fighting that's flagging them as non-solos, as well as buffs and heals on yourself.

I really wish we had the pop to support that. There are any number of cool features that could added to PvP if only we had more players participating. Regardless, I do think that experience aside, there is a minimum standard of 'class ability' people should attain before they queue ranked. My own take would be to add something akin to WoW's single player 'proving grounds' for each spec with bronze, silver and gold levels that people could pass (in any spec they choose) before queuing ranked for the first time on a character. http://wow.gamepedia.com/Proving_Grounds

Are you suggesting the number of posts/threads about a class being 'OP' isn't necessarily a reflection of reality?

Even in 4.x, the prime reason for focusing *any* class first was how quickly they would die, not how big a threat they presented. Winning ranked is essentially about killing 1 person before the other team. Once it's 4v3, the fat lady starts clearing her throat to sing. But yeah, mercs weren't top DPS in ranked for 4.x by any stretch of the imagination. Highly competitive in regs to be sure, but that's a different ballgame.

Personally I think the guard from a 'real' tank should be allowed to overwrite the guard from a fake one.

As a slight aside, are you able to 1v1 *decent* dps operatives? Because not being funny, while I agree you might not have the tools to kill good merc dps now (as veng/vigi), I'm pretty sure you can't do it with operatives either (as evidenced by every dueling tourny ever). That's pretty much the strength of a healing DPS class over a zero-burst DPS class. A model that mercs were to an extent previously excluded from, because merc self heals sucked arse (we were usually outhealed by Juggs heh).

Hrm. Times when there have been more posts than this about one class? Let me think. Merc tracer spam. 1.0. Operative stunlock made me unsub. Smash monkeys. PT dongcleave. Sorc Bubblestun. Merc electronet. Sorc heals. That's just off the top of my head. Many of those were back in the day when we had forum mods even at weekends though, and they locked/deleted threads all the time. Now they tend to leave things alone unless someone posts threats or wipes their arse with the TOS. Which is for the better - but it tends to make people think complaints have gotten worse. Most of the threads and posts here are by <20 individuals.

To be fair, I don't think he was complaining about it so much as pointing out how people are misinterpreting its impact. Yes, I think the new skanktanking meta has changed things up quite a lot, and people are absolutely 'missing' what's going on. But I also think that's a good thing heheh. Amid accusations of BW 'dumbing down' PvP, it's nice to have a few things which people actually need to think more about now. And of course that goes for more than just 'guarding'.

Now I'm almost certain you've never played ranked.

The 'any sin/PT/jugg' can tank mechanic certainly makes it much harder to take down more people - but it also has it's workarounds. The dps doing the guarding is a LOT squishier than a real tank, so 'tunnel the (fake) tank' works, especially if you can catch them both in AOE together. People need to get away from the 'always hit the healer' strat to an extent.

Not really the same thing. Don't get me wrong, I play my vig guardian a LOT, and I know that unremitting is pretty much mandatory. But it's not even in the same league as thrill of the hunt. First of all it is in the masterful tier, not legendary, and second the lack of it doesn't change an entire class mechanic to 'root yourself every 8 seconds'. That's actually one of the reasons ravage was changed. Try reducing everyone's legendary utility picks by one and see how that works out.

I'd be a lot less defensive about that one utility point, if mercs weren't railroaded into their utility picks and actually had more than 1 'free' in the top tier to do with as they liked. Right now thrill of the hunt is (and has always been) mandatory for arsenal mercs. Meaning they only get 1 to play with, so of course they're going to pick the DCD. Blazing bolts on the move is a fundamental part of the class now. There is no option. I warned about this very problem before we even knew how powerful Trauma Regs would be. Of course mercs and mandos have to pick it, because they've been dying for better defenses for *years*. The only way it might not be picked is if you either make it *utterly worthless*, or bake thrill of the hunt into the class, something I've been arguing for a while.

I wouldn't be completely opposed to this, IF an adjustment happens. My main priority is keeping them from being target number 1 in 4s, the defense against which your suggestion would preserve.

The maximum the shield can heal is 75% of health (assuming a tunnel and full stacks). That's a lot, and not to be scoffed at, but not 130k.

Yes, I've tested. I main merc/mando. It only works against direct single target damage, as I've stated. I've also been killed through the reflect window by AOE, dots, reflects (when I'm derping and not paying attention) etc. Apologies, there has been a LOT of conflation here on the forums between the shieldheal, and the reflectheal - and I automatically assumed you were talking about the latter. My mistake. But I'm glad you're recognizing the biggest challenge is for a Jugg, not a Mara. On my sentinel, I'd pause the fight with camo/cc if I wasn't confident that I could burst the merc down during his shield (remembering that it doesn't heal until the end). On my Vig/Veng Jugg guard, there is pretty much no way I could burst through in that time (given we don't actually have any burst). But I'd also be in a MUCH better place come the reflect. On a sidenote, playing my guardian I'm starting to wonder if there isn't something wrong with our base armor/defences in PvP since 5.0 as I seem a LOT squishier than I was (more even that my sent). But that's the case against all the classes - snipers, sins etc, not just mercs.

Merc reflect doesn't work on anything that isn't DIRECT single target damage. Ie. It doesn't touch reflect damage, damage shields, dots, aoe, environmental, etc etc etc.

You'd best limit that to juggs/guards, because speaking from experience, it is *trivial* to maintain AOE through the reflect window as a combat sentinel/marauder (and of course watchman dots count too).

Literally none eh Arvengis?

Don't get me wrong. I get mildly annoyed when I see some FOTM reroll too. But I also recognise they're garbage, and can be taken out with the rest of the trash. Do that enough times and they'll stop playing the class soon enough. I have enough screenshots of warzones filled with 4 or more mercs being outperformed by pretty much everyone else. That crap has a limited shelf life.

Nobody (decent) was calling for nerfs on merc last season. The (FEW) mercs who are now, are doing so out of some misguided attempt to keep their class 'niche'. You know the sort - they *hate* seeing other people playing it, and think bringing it back to *****ville will allow them to retain their spot as a rare zoo exhibit.