wow, this is what modders have done with freespace 2 now! WTB this treatment for DAoC!!!!!

I did two: I'm just pointing out it did not age well. In addition the server synch issue that were a hug issue for mele are not fixed in 2011 which is ridiculous. Don't get me wrong, there were a lot of very good ideas wrapped into that game but people tend to overlook some of its serious issues which games made within 1-3 years of it did not have and which were never fixed. 2001 isn't really an excuse for how terrible the engine really was. In terms of engines freespace 2 by volition from 1999 still hold up today. It was not an MMO but it did support 32v32 in 1999 while looking....like.... Its so well built it still scales on modern hardware

Omg, DAoC.....I remember that game being pretty sick back in the day. I wonder if people still play it; lets see if there are and ......Oh.....Hm....looks like nostalgia clouded my vision. Mele is less awsome than I remember it being and more "billy jean is not my lover" if you get my drift. 3:28 if you don't.

Statements are just opinions unless backed with examples

Kuari: I'm not really talking about gunslingers: I feel your pain. You are forced into being immobile as a slinger and due to the fact that you can't turn in cover: you need autoface until they change cover. Basically gunslinger needs a revamp in pvp to be less dependent on cover. I am talking about the other ranged classes as the representation is low for slingers.

Moot point: mele has instant abilities and don't need it. Remove it for both. You know one of the biggest reasons Square Enix's FF mmo failed? no ability to jump

Your logical fallacy is showing: Your playing a game were people with energy swords are fighting people with high powered energy weapons. To say that jumping around is ridiculous when a Jedi/Sith launches 30 feet strait up and 30 yards laterally and sticks a light saber in your chest. You know whats also ridiculous: basketball. All that jumping around like cracked out bunnies trying to rebound a ball; the game is about teamwork, coordination and reacting to what the other team is doing; not hopping around like a cracked out bunny. Jumping provides a competitive advantage. I'm a caster; I jump around like a cracked out bunny because it can provide a competitive advantage. If someone charges you mid jump your momentum will give you a little bit more of a gap. Don't act like mele are the only people who jump. Watch my vid: count the jumps. 2:20 I run through some casts, abuse!!!!! http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=163905

Then it can be enabled: because I definitely autoface as a slinger. I see my resolve bar go white, rakka medpack, GG mele!

So standing still trying to target a missile while spinning (without even moving your feet; terrible animation) while someone is swinging a lightsaber at your face that is realism for you. In every single mmo made to date (this is a plus for all of them) being in mele range as a ranged cast is a "get the hell out of there" moment and not a "lets keep casting moment". If you sit in mele range and cast, you deserve to die; this is by a caster for casters.

Oh no he is running away from me so I can't attack him ABUSE!!!! How is that any different from running through or past someone trying to cast at you? The silly thing is that I could run right next to (not even through) you character and achieve the same effect. Here's a challenge; the only point I hear for autoface is that your mad because getting run through interrupts your casts. Can you argue your point without that example? Say if the casting was similar to rift; where you don't actually turn but that cast will go off anyway? "Why bother with interrupts if you can just run through your enemy casters? How does that promote skill based PVP?" More options always create more skill, that is a basic tenant of mmos.

Here come the trolls: "Post swtor videos if you want to back up claims of being good in this game." I'm working on one right now; it takes a lot of effort and footage to make a good pvp video. However; swtor is a game inspired specifically by the EQ/Wow nexus with almost 90% of the elements being similar if not the same (resolve/DR, Trinket/Ability CC break, 1.5 sec GCD in both games). To state that a game that sets the industry standard (WoW) that was inspired by a previous industry standard (Everquest) that inspired the game you currently play (Swtor) has no bearing on skill in said game is insanity. Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. "sorry, couldn't get through the first 16 seconds (i'm not 12)" Real mature post, get back under the bridge.

/Translation: you didn't read any of my post, I play a caster. In addition you also fail at even describing the situation: mele does not jump/ just to avoid los, they do it to disrupt it. Fail troll is fail!

"but pushing his interrupt button is SOOOOOOOOO hard. all i hear from the OP is whaaaaaaaa, i actually have to press my interrupt button to get an interrupt. /cry" Until you actually read peoples posts don't bother posting in there forums: I am not a mele player, I have posted that several times. In fact I will hedge on the fact that I am a far better ranged player than you will ever hope to be. Here's my evidence, lets see yours. http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=163905

I'm going to throw down the gauntlet right here: If you are angry about mele running through you and would like to get your casts off in mele range: then a system that allows you to finish a cast through a run through is what you want. However, once again: if you are a victim of a run through its your fault 100% and mele should stomp you in mele range if you sit there. If you want to keep the autoface because you like the immunity it gives you to back stabs and the ease with which it allows chaincasting in mele range you are "abusing" just as bad as anyone using the time honored tradition of the run through. In addition, once again: if you are a victim of a run through its your fault 100%

"thanks to an mmo-wide i.q. drop." And your arguing for a mechanic that lowers the skill required to play a casting class; your a strange breed. "Fake casting" and "juking" are just cheap tactics that use lag to interrupt your opponents without using your interrupt abilities." How about not casting in mele range? Or, god forbid: using your interrupt when the cast is late in the bar instead of just jumping on cast immediately. If you get juked by fake casting or mele run running around you, you deserve it.

I start the thread talking about the many different negative effects autoface has on pvp: and all you can focus on is how mad mele running through you makes you. I tried to be civil but now I'm gonna break this out: if mele is so close to you that he can run through your hitbox and your trying to get a damage spell off that is not instant/channeled you strait up deserve to die; end of story. http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=163905 Do you see me at any point casting on someone in mele range? How much time do I generally spend in mele range getting beat on?

I already said in a previous post that the cast getting off is only half of the problem: it would be a decent compromise if the cast just went off rift style: its the facing that is the major problem currently. Not to say I wouldn't like to see you have to finish the cast facing your target. If a mele is that close to you, you generally should be getting out of range and not trying to cast in 1 foot range. Keep in mind my I am primarily a ranged player through my mmo career: not some mele QQing. "And yes autoface should stay until/if they implement collision detection, running through someone to make them turn is retarded end of!!!" Collision detection will never happen: give me a major mmo with collision detection. I don't understand why people are defending autoface: if mele is so close you need autoface to cast then mele just are not dangerous enough.

Here is a challenge: If you support autoface post a video of your pvp skills with a ranged class. If you would like to see mine: watch the second video I linked on my OP (first post, first page) From my experience in terms of searching for players to form a solid pvp guild; all the good ranged I know are for the removal of autoface from casted skills. It stays for channeled spells because channeled skills are a different mechanic than casted skills (lower dps, higher time-on-target demand). They reason they want it removed: it creates better mechanics in pvp and give the player more to do (and showcases skill on both sides). I have a serious problem with people calling mele classes who run through you bad: if they interrupt your cast are they bad? What if they are trying to backstab you? Whats "good" about you pirouetting in place npc like while casting? A player pissing you off does not make them bad, and in a lot of cases means they are doing it right. "You have to understand these wow pvprs have been brain washed into mouse turning, no one could possibly win if they cant mouse turn." Do you play a shooter with only the keyboard to aim? Mouse turning is the use of the mouse and keyboard to turn and allows a much higher range of motion than keyboard alone. I never give people crap about it: but I do encourage them to learn it.

You could not have missed his point more: reread his post. In addition: facing your target as a caster in regards to getting the cast off is not all of the issue. Autoface has a brutal effect on classes the depend on backstab. In competition level mmo pvp (wow is the only example, get over it) rogues like woundman and reckful are getting off backstabs on people who are not stunned. This is not possible vs a chain casting target in the current gamestate. Autofacing is not pve only...where did you get that idea?

Its not a wow thing: its an every single other major mmo in existence (to my knowledge). Try this as an experiment with a friend: take a sniper/gunslinger and pit them against a equally geared mele class (for this example use no stuns, they cannot be interrupted in cover anyway) in mele range. I'll take the sniper vs anything (maybe pyrotech can get em).

You realize that no mmo (including the vaunted DAOC) is perfect and that swtor was in large part inspired by wow. What pvp credentials should I post? Anyone who watches me play can see that I know what I am talking about. If you never had an issue, you should have no problem with it removed, end of story. Its a major problem for shadows/assassins due to their need to back stab not being achievable.

Credentials (before I get trolled too hard). Played mele through 2 Wow expansions successfully (Dk and rogue didn't do much arena made videos). If you watch you can see I have a upper echelon grasp of the mechanics of a mele class http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=184375 Cut my teeth on warlock through 3 expansions with an average of 2.4k rating rival titles in wizcleave and non wizcleave seasons. http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=163905 I don't take myself seriously and know what its like to be OP (I always admit OPness in my own class) http://www.warcraftmovies.com/pv.php?lid=714289&movie_id=157327 Back to the issue at hand: Autoface has been standard on channeled spells since as long as I remember (7 years or so), but autoface on casted spells/abilities I have never even seen before. Having autoface for casted spells (plus the fact that you cannot lock out spell trees, just individual spells) is a very bad combination. This takes away one of namesakes of a mele class in an mmo: you don't want to engage them in mele range as a caster, kiting and opening distance is what skill as a caster is all about. My favorite example is if you white-bar my gunslinger: GG bro I'll shoot you even if your in my hitbox and I have higher dps, more defense as I spin rapidly firing off casted nukes. This will increase the game's skillcap with minimal repercussions (people will adapt) and give mele less excuse to QQ. (I play: Sage, Scoundrel, Gunslinger)

I for one think that the design of ilum discourages organisation and encourages zerging; but that is a matter for another day. We need more of the underdog faction on the planet, and we need it to at least feel semi competitive. 3 ways to alleviate the problem the way I see it: Decide the points in even side capped battles every hour while leaving it open but static in between (the tol barad solution). This is very effective because it rewards the well coordinated underdog. If you don't like that: Bolster mechanics to the side with lower population instep with the population imbalance (the wintergrasp solution). This is less effective than the above solution, but allows everyone to be in the zone at all times. If you don't like that: Hinder the overpopulated side with npcs spawning in lockstep with the ratio of overpopulation (the aion solution) If you don't like that: You dislike competitive pvp and prefer to roll with the zerg. If the former statement is not true of you, please put forth your ideas for fixing endgame pvp.

I totally understand nerfing the opener. The nerf to acid blade is just.....strange because our out of stealth damage is frankly terrible. Nerf the opener, buff our non-opener damage. Current problem is that our dmg ramps down from our opener; weaken the opener and people with have less to complain about. Hell, bioware could remove the opener and give us something akin to the assassin's as long as we can do decent out of stealth dmg; stealth, open, stealth is derpy.

I already said I was ok with a the portion of the nerfs that generate the most frustration with player, doing that much dmg i=in an opener is silly. That said, its consumables that are making Op/scoun truly nasty. I don't necessarily agree with the whole of the OP's point; but you, nor anyone so far, has proved him wrong.