It's been mentioned numerous times in countless threads detailing each and every benefit the Imperial faction has over the Republic but I heard something new tonight. Taris is the 3rd planet Republic characters travel to. Every Republic player I know hates it with a passion due to it's large size and the fact we don't get a speeder at that level. The amount of time it takes to travel from place to place is mind numbing and I don't blame them. As a matter of fact most people skip it entirely and strictly PVP during those levels. Tonight I learned that when the Imperials get to their 3nd planet, Nar Shadaa, they get little speeders that spawn on the ground to cut down on travel time. Having never played an Imperial alt this was the first time I've heard of this. Why the bias towards Imperials and when will we get temporary speeders on Taris? edit: mispoke meant to say 3rd planet as Taris is ours as well.

This. If a healer knows how to use their cleanse button they can kite a Mara/Sent around for a long time.

The reason I ask is because you argue as if this is all your personal experience and I can tell you 100% if you're mostly in Rakata you're not doing anywhere near this type of DPS in PVP. What streams are you watching? First off you aren't getting 5 ticks of Weaken Mind, you're getting 1 in your theoretical 5 seconds of 15k. Secondly I don't think you understand how much our damage gets mitigated at higher levels. I dueled a friend who is a level 50 Sentinel to get these numbers. Medium Armor, full Battle Master. -TKT- Tick 400-800 with it. If I don't get a crit thats 1600 damage vs your guaranteed 3k. -FIB- 1100-2400 -TKW-1100-2100 -MC- 500-1000 initial, 200 tick. Your numbers seem to be when you're attacking a brand new 50 fresh out of the 10-49 bracket. If that's the case then TKT will tick for 1500, FIB will crit for 3800, TKW will crit for 4500 and MC will do about 4k damage. That's not my argument though. I'm talking about rated warzones, best of the best. While we're talking about your massive damage numbers make sure to reply to this thread http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=389850 and let them know you're doing more damage with 2 dots and 3 gcd's than his entire arsenal combined. The silly part is that you care about what someone defines as burst. You'd rather argue with me about that than support what I've been saying and judging by your recent post regarding Disturbance, you do. The reason I don't consider our DoTs "Burst" damage is because one of them ticks once every 4 seconds and another that ticks for 200-300 5 times over 6 seconds. It's not burst. If we had a dot ticking for 800 every second for 4 seconds I would say okay you're right. We don't though. But you're right it is beside the point. The point is our burst damage is low in comparison and it's only getting worse in 1.2. I've said this all along. Those are the facts.

Dude you keep throwing out these numbers that aren't real. You aren't going to crit every tick of TKT followed by a crit FIB and a crit TKW while MC crits in the background. It will never work like that unless you have 100% crit in your PVE gear. If we could actually do 15k damage in 5 seconds I wouldn't be here typing this message to you. Once again I've never said that we have no burst. I've said we have lower burst than every other class and this nerf hurts our burst damage badly. For the third time, what gear set are you using?

You didn't answer my question as to what type of gear you use.. I'm going to assume by your first sentence that you don't PVP. In other words you're throwing down these massive numbers in Rakata gear? There's one major flaw in your argument and by you not PVP'ing you're oblivious to it. You used the word UNMITIGATED. Everything we cast except FIB and MC is mitigated heavily by armor. You're living in a fairy tale world of theoretical numbers where every opponent is naked. You can't just come on here and add up tool tip numbers to justify your claims because in real, high level, battlemaster PVP it isn't like that at all.

What type of gear are you in? I've been PVP'ing heavily since beta and I've never taken someone from 15k to 0 health in 4 GCD. Is this something you can do every time you use the psychic projection exploit? Must say that's pretty impressive, no wonder you think Sages are OP.

Take your complaints to WoWWiki and other legitimate websites that define burst and dot damage. It's also impressive that you can EASILY take someone from 15k to 0 health in 5 seconds or less. You're a better Sage than I am sir. My full set of Battlemaster gear must be defective.

Where did I ever say we have NO burst? Maybe you should actually read the thread. The only thing I've ever said is that our burst is "going to be severely lacking come 1.2."

Pyrotech spec Powertechs and Rage Spec Juggs are easily getting 500-700k in a VS, the Powertech is single target. Very good Marauder's and Gunslingers can out DPS us. How is our 500-700k AoE damage overpowered? On to your disturbance suggestion, I have no problem with it. I've even advocated swapping Turbulence and TK wave and leave everything else as is. Earlier in this thread I said that the nerf to POM/TK Wave would extremely hurt our burst damage and you stated something along the lines of .. "I'm constantly amazed at people who want to push one or two buttons and get ZOMG BURST DAMAGE!!!" Just thought you should know.

PVE or PVP?

Right now I'm not concerned with what the Devs think. I'm concerned with what you think. We completely understand that this nerf will have a 2% effect on you in PVE land. We understand you hypothesize that this will have a minimal effect on PVP'ers. We understand you feel we need to reroll to another class. Please reply with the reason 13/28 is OP.

Balance is definitely viable in 1v1 PVP situations but in group play I don't think it comes close to Hybrid's burst or AoE damage. It's obvious you do not PVP so as someone who obviously forms his opinions based off forum posts how exactly is 13/28 overpowered? It is the only PVP option because it is the only spec that combines mobility with decent burst damage. In PVP burst damage is the only type of damage that puts pressure on on an opponent. You keep saying we are overpowered but as a VR 80 Sage on a PVP server I don't feel that way at all. I can name 4-5 specs that can easily solo us 1v1. I can name 4-5 specs that easily put up the same DPS numbers in any given warzone. I can name 4-5 PVP specs that burst harder than us and I can name 2-3 specs that easily put up the same types of AOE numbers that we do. How are we overpowered?

Don't even argue with him. He's trolling.. dude doesn't even PVP.

Ever since beta I've said they should replace Pebble Throw with the animation you're talking about

Yes I'm referring to Rage in 1.2. This entire thread is about 1.2. I see 500/100 Marauders every time I face a decent team in a Voidstar or a long game in a Alderaan. I absolutely think a well played/geared Marauder/Sentinel is #1a-b shared with Pyrotech-Powertech/Assault Spec-Vanguard in high level competitive PVP. Level up to 50, gear out as best you can and then come back and we'll compare notes. You're going to have a blast in the 10-49 bracket.

Just out of curiosity.. which of our AOE's has a chance to knock people down? When 1.2 hits Focus Spec Marauder's will have it even better than Focus Spec Guardian's in terms of AOE capabilities. You know the one that aoe crits people for 7k? Why should we have to throw them away? Your pure dps class gets everything mentioned above except an 8 second stun and the worst knockback in the game. We get a pull, you get a leap. Oh yeah and you can go invisible every 45 seconds! Must be nice to have all of that survivability as a pure DPS class. I've seen Marauder's get over 500k damage and 150k healing in voidstars before. What's overpowered? Marauder's are currently top 2 with Pyrotech's in PVP right now and neither one of you is getting nerfed. Marauder's are actually getting buffed. Why should I not be upset?

If you've read the thread my original question was what role are we going to play in a rated warzone where "Burst is King" and "DoTs can be healed through". These are two phrases constantly repeated and it is a 100% fact. I also don't believe that we have zero burst. I do believe that we currently have the lowest burst of any class and in 1.2 this will bring us even further down the ladder. Without a desirable 31 point spec this nerf shouldn't go through. Hey maybe you're right, maybe this isn't the class for me. I signed up to be a DPS Sage, not a Utility Sage.

No, my definition does not involve one ability. It just doesn't include dots. Let's end this.. Rank the classess from 1-8 in terms of Burst Capability. Surely judging by your attitude and tone Sages must be pretty high up on the list right? This was sarcasm. the Full 31 point talent in balance isn't as good as a 1.5 second TK throw. You also didn't answer my question, What spec are you going to play when they fix the Psychic Projection exploit? Once again I don't criticize anyone for their gameplay. I criticize them for using exploits to defend their position. The fact you use them and then tell us how great the class is that's what irks me and I'll criticize you for it. I have no doubt they want you to stop but with the changes to conveyance it's obvious they don't know how to. I do abide by a code of honor. If you don't I won't judge you. Good luck in life.

Once again, my defnition of burst is solid. Yours needs work. By your definintion stacking 5 dots that crit for 100 over 20 seconds, then coordinating those dots with a DD that crits for 1k would be considered burst because it was "peak damage over normal levels" ***? First of all it does matter if something is broken or not because it is taking attention away from our true 31 abilities and in my opinion they need to be more desirable. People are talking of a 1.12.28 spec. Is 31 point balance SO bad that they need to spec for a shorter duration TK throw? Give me a break. How you could even begin to compare a skill with the tool tip that says "On your next telekinetic throw" with a skill that says "Any force damaging attack with an activation" is beyond me. If BW didn't want this happening they could have easily given us the Shadow POM. It only affects Mind Crush. Thirdly.. by your logic you would advise every Scoundrel to exploit the Double Shoot First bug just because it's at their disposal? Again... ***? I'm not in the business of presenting my stuff as fact. That's your job as full time forum poster. I'm posting my opinion and have never stated other wise. Sadly more people agree with my opinion of the 31 point TK spec than they agree with yours.

I'm constantly amazed at people who exploit broken mechanics and then come on to the internet and boast about it. So what you're saying is I need to exploit PP? Okay LOL. I don't want to have to rely on that because one day they figure out how to fix it and we'll be back to square one. I'd prefer they make our 31 point trees desirable now. Two things have been said in numerous threads throughout the course of this MMO. We have low burst compared to other classes and Telekenetics isn't viable in PVP. Suddenly when our trees get nerfed people seem to think otherwise. Boggles the mind it does. Boomer! SoonerJBD!

No, it's you who doesn't understand the concept of burst (Burst damage is a term used to describe dealing high amounts of damage in a very short period of time). My definition of burst certainly doesn't involve anything with letters D, O, T, or S. Visit this thread. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=381770. As you can see by the title he's a veteran in the balance spec. He clearly states multiple times that his burst is lower than 13/28 hybrid. It's time you go set him straight and let him know that he does in fact have the same amount of burst.

I'm assuming that it's providing 3.5-4.5k extra burst because it is. It's our second hardest hitting instant cast spell. Just because Mind Crush or Weaken Mind do more damage than Telekinetic Wave doesn't make it burst. I'm starting to believe you're arguing just to argue. And with that revelation I'm done. Have fun in Rated. I'll look you up and see how you're doing.

What's a faulty assumption? To take a skill not for the AOE DPS but for the fact that is contributes good burst and can be cast on the run? I don't consider a 3 second channel burst. I'm sorry. The fact that this class will need to rely on a broken mechanic for burst proves my point.

It might be easy to interrupt someone you're 1 v 1 with but when someone comes backside and slams you for 6k it's not easy. Also when the masses of Marauders start specing for this you'll never be able to interrupt it. His agreement was to my original point concerning rated warzones. I'm not sure what numbers padding in a Voidstar has to do with anything. I don't trait TK wave for the AOE or the numbers it gets me in a Voidstar. I trait it for that extra burst to take down the healer. Burst is King and we're going to be severely lacking come 1.2. You act as if this nerf suddenly makes our other specs viable. There's a reason people were using 13/28, our full trees suck. More bad variation = bad.

I asked this question a few weeks back and it's even more obvious now. Whose spot can we take in a Team Rated WZ? The ONLY thing we bring to the table is Rescue. And to the person saying we have the best AE skill in the game, you've never had a Focus Spec jug hit your whole team for 6-7k before.