you're complaining about not being able to kill 2 people working together who are both specced for survivability and support. feeling a bit entitled?

if one of those 3 sorcs was a healer they'd win by a landslide and everyone knows it. this is actually an AMAZINGLY balanced mmo which is the only reason sorc stands out so much and why these threads exist. They will and should continue to exist until the issues are addressed. it's why these forums are here. Everyone here who has done any decent amount of pvp has seen healing sorcerers use their combination of knockbacks, bubbles, stuns, and speed combined with their plethora of solid heals to survive onslaughts that a healing mercenary or operative would never be able to escape. Personally I don't even really care about their dps specs. I see gunslingers and troopers top charts almost as often as sages (though ive only seen 515k once or twice done by a sage). Anyone who says sorcs drop quickly has never seen a skilled one heal in bm gear (which it seems like quite a few imps have gotten by now.. its almost as if they can actually go to ilum or something wierd but thats a whole other can of broken "winning as intended" worms)

do you even really need to bubble the fire? I sprint through it on my new shadow without any problems. if you increase the fire damage then tanks who need to carry the ball over that fire at a snails pace get the shaft.

haha I don't want a sage nerf... I want a sawbones buff!

Merc's are also extremely shallow on the mobility/utility side of things. they're stupid and slow and if you los their missile they will either have to move (they wont) and lose dps or switch targets. A sorc won't mind if you los him, his dots are still hitting you, he can possibly get you around a corner with an aoe, or if hes really determined he can force speed after you burning an omg30sec-cd

candice that's pretty sweet that the class you wanted to play from the start just happened to be the best. Personally I wanted to heal too only I wanted to wear a cowboy hat instead of a pope-hat so thats what I'm doing and believe me and I love the class and the flavor and the nut-kicks and the little robot hots. I heal my pocket tank and together we win games but it's utterly impossible for me to look at a sage and not be jealous of both their numbers AND their tools/utility. What happens when rated warzones come out? If things don't shift at least a little bit, there will be absolutely no reason for a group to take me over a second sage. And I do mean second because let's face it you'll have to have at least one to be competitive.

the other day i saw a sage do over 500k damage in a republic v republic huttball. I've never seen another class do that. I also regularly see sages do over 450k healing. Then there are the hybrids that do 300k damage and 150k healing. I'm a decently geared sawbones and I'm very happy when I break 300k heals. and if raw numbers aren't enough, you're right that the amount of utility they have is absurd. The fact that a sage can force speed through a fire trap and then rescue the ball carrier through that same trap... well all i can say is it looks like a lot of fun. It really is as if they designed consulars first, were determined to make them really awsome, and then got over to scoundrels and were like "wait a second... well if we give them the same stuff it'll just seem silly.. soo.. uuh.. they get..stealth? flashbang? screw it i tired myself out making sage awsome scoundrels will have to be content with funnier dialogue"

Um so one thing i heard a long while back was that bioware actually hired a lot of talent from mythic to help design the pvp. These are the guys that developed the warhammer mmo and, before that, Dark ages of camelot. Both of these games were heavily centered around pvp so uuh yea I have a feeling a few of them do a little pvp themselves. if someone could please correct me if I'm totally off and have my facts/devs mixed up but I think this is the case.

Congrats OP! I've played a decent number of 50 wzs and while it's always great fun to see the imps go down, its even MORE fun when you do it with a group of 8 players and not a single one of them is in the same guild versus an imp crew that has at least 1 premade. I don't think I've had it as bad as you though. I rarely see 8 guildies together. It's usually 4 and 4 or 4 + pugs. It's been especially fun lately as more and more republic players are getting their champ gear finished and are starting to work on BM gear. I've played in complete pugs where every single person is decently geared and if we don't win we at the very least give them a hell of a fight. ps at least on my sever, the imps always leave when they lose. its hillarious pps I just assumed your a pub, if your not then you're on the wierdest server ever

Ok so assuming you aren't full of **** (and I imagine you are) when you say "It only pops when 8 people get the invite" then the game should notice that 2 people didn't accept the invite and tak on another 1-3 minutes of lobby time to wait for 2 more people. Especially in the 50 bracket. We're patient! I promise! Any level 50 would rather wait another 5 minutes than try to defend a voidstar with 6 people. It's an automatic loss. Even if you fill up 3 minutes later, they're probably planting on the second door when those 2 reinforcements load into the "i died room"

Also in my head this *IS* a mini-leap. a mini-leap that is only usable to go up in elevation. I just don't forsee them giving us a sprint cuz uh they gave that to someone already we missed it.

haha..ha... "scoundrel grabs the ball..." I dunno about the huttball's on your server, but on davik's estate people tend to hit the ball carrier with missiles and lightning and lightsabers. That scoundrel's gonna pop d-screen and pray that he gets the chance to pass before he drops. You really think he'll make it all the way to the pit? A scoundrel couldn't get the ball from mid to a line if huttball was flat and had no traps. Thats why they invented tanks. Besides a guardian or vanguard tank can already do exactly this by charging at an enemy who just spawned (and if a ball carrier is in the pit, he and his team probably killed a couple people to get him there). One reason huttball pvp is so great is because at the early levels it establishes rules, and then at later levels (obviously this would be a lvl 50 or higher skill, as i said before im thinking expantions) it gives you lots of tools to break those rules in certain circumstances. Early on you learn to never run through fire. Later on you learn that sometimes u gotta pop a cd and run through that fire to do your job gosh darnit. A sage can speed himself through a fire trap, and rescue a friendly ball carrier past another one. As a scoundrel ive found my best use is to hold down the middle with a tank so we can get neutral balls. I'm utterly useless on those damn catwalks. "teleport" is also a strong word. It would obviously have a 1.5-2 second animation attached to it. A larger issue, because I love to criticise myself, would come from a stealthed scoundrel running into the pit, grappling up, restealthing and waiting for a pass. Even keeping that in mind, when I look at the stupid amounts of utility a sage possesses, I still don't think it seems that rediculous. put it on a >1min cd and make it unusable for 10 seconds after stealth or have it put you in combat so you can't restealth immediately after and it already loses some of its cheese factor. "scoundrel grabs the ball" is still makin me chuckle.

We're sticks in the mud! We need a means of making a quick getaway, even if its only in wierd situations. My perspective comes from scoundrel healing. I just feel completely out-utility'd by sages in almost every way. They can rescue allies, knock-back enemies, and force speed through fire traps. I can... stealth? oh I can kick guys in the nuts and run away. Sweet. Obviously, I propose a grappling hook. A quick mobility blink-type skill that will teleport (obviously with a slick animation) us up a ledge that is within, say, 15-20 meters. Instead of a storm/charge that is used on enemies, or the friendly jump of the guardian, or force speed hax, just give us something that lets us get out of the pit in huttball, or let us skip a ramp and just grapple up a ledge. If it's only usable to go upwards in elevation, it wouldn't take the fun/uniqueness away from force speed or charge. It fits with the flavor of both classes. What's more star warsy than swinging from ropes? They're both all about gadgets and tools, so why not give them one that has some practical and flashy utility. Give smugglers/operatives a bat-hook! It would have literally zero application in voidstar and minimal use in alderaan, but we just really need some love in huttball. ps. I realise this kind of thing wouldn't ever happen until an expansion, I just want to get the idea out there.

Have you ever watched a bunch of 10 year old kids play soccer? At its best, a peewee soccer game is a mob of 10 kids all surrounding the ball as it slowly moves from one end of the field to the other. At its worst, half of the kids are wandering around picking dandelions or their noses. This is exactly the level of huttball we are currently seeing/participating in. The best "teamwork" consists of a group of players all surrounding the ball, hopefully with a couple tanks and healers mixed in, slowly walking the ball to the goal. At its worst you see single players dueling each other (picking their noses) in random corners of the map, contributing absolutely nothing to their team. Just like you wouldn't judge the entire sport of soccer based on how a group of 3rd graders play it, you should not judge Huttball based on how you and your inexperienced noobish teamates play it. It's quite obvious that high-level huttball will evolve to be less and less about gathering your entire team together for one long slow push to the goal. That is not coordination. That is not teamwork. Huttball is a game about creating space, controlling key locations, and quickly moving and passing the ball. Considering the map layout, the movement debuff and waiting for fire traps, it might take 3 minutes to run the ball from the middle to a goal line. If your team is already set up on the catwalks and at the goal line, you could potentially pass the ball 3 times and score in less than 30 seconds. Getting frustrated that you keep getting cc'd on top of a fire trap as you run the ball? Pass it. If there's nobody on your team in a good forward position to pass to, it's just because you're playing with the gamer equivalents of 3rd graders. Don't worry though! We'll all grow up eventually. Edit: It will also be interesting to see if Empire ends up dominating this warzone. After all, if there are more empire players on each server, and huttball is the only same-faction warzone, then the que system will often be forced to match imps against each other in a huttball match or not give them anything at all. If they play more huttball, will they eventually get better at it? time will tell.