Wake up and smell the coffee... these are the people that dictate everything with regard to MMOs. At least the OPs linked report talked about things other than share dividends, investment enticements and pwoffit... things that make a game good or bad from a player's perspective. Notice the lack of this kind of player empathy from LA/EA/BW. How sad it is that with so much money spent, so much talent available, and a global IP to die for... we are now where we are.

The point is the game isn't worth 50 cents a day whether you can afford it or not. Surely, if you can't afford a game, you don't buy it and then baulk at the subscription cost. If you're unsure, you play the trial and then make a decision whether to economise elsewhere in your life in order to continue your sub. If the game was of sufficient quality to attract and keep those that could afford it... and attract and keep those who couldn't afford it... we'd have a viable game, whatever the payment model.

Absolutely, totally, utterly... spot on. The last couple of days have seen the suits out doing the rounds spinning their decision and missing this point... but for me, showing their true colours and true concerns. I've not heard or seen from a single LA/EA/BW employee expressing any love or passion for the game. Telling.

I unsubbed the day before F2P was announced. I was not given the feedback option 'I don't like the subscription model but if the game was F2P I would stay.' It's a personal value judgement... but for me, if a game is not good enough for me to subscribe to, it STILL not good enough even if free. I would hazard a guess that this is true for most rational people. As an aside, we know that two million people were (and probably still are) willing to pay for this game up front AND pay a subscription fee. Most likely, had the game delivered for these people, then the vast bulk of them wouldn't have left. One other thing we know... that these two million people did not need the game to be 'free' for them to decide to play... and pay. There was (and is) nothing wrong with the subscription model but, as the studio originally said, a subscription-based game must be of a high quality and offer more content to justify the model.

The problem here, in gameplayer terms, is NOT one of subscription numbers (except in terms of longevity). Subscriber number problems are causing the suits to wobble, sure... profit is their prime concern... but players are leaving and have left this game for a number of reasons that are simply not being addressed. The model is being introduced in the hope of improving profitability, not making the game itself better for the players... and the poor state of the game IS the reason for players leaving. In other words... 'saving' a crap game by shifting to F2P isn't saving anything of value, from a gamer's perspective. If other games offer a better experience, they'll continue to drop ToR in the future, as they evidently have in the past and present. What model this game has is NOT the reason for such subscriber losses, despite the PR statement to the contrary.

Both of those games have acres more content and developed game systems than ToR. They are both far more polished, in MMO terms. They offer more in just about every way... primarily in that they are far less a SOLO game than this one. Perhaps, after four years of released content patches and expansions, this game may be able to offer as much and have the draw of LotRO and DDO... but at present that is demonstrably NOT the case.

I'm afraid I don't agree with these points.... and would suggest that you think a little further. Firstly, at present your subscription gives you access to everything in-game. All content, all items, every single designed pixel. In the forthcoming F2P model, it will not. You will need to spend more real money to purchase Cartel Coin bundles to gain access to store items. Secondly, there are many reasons so many players unsubscribed and the given reason (40% not liking the subscription model) is a PR spin that offers smoke and mirrors to cover a) the factors determining the reasoning of the other 60% and b) the reason why the 40% didn't think the game worth subscribing to in the first place. The core problems in the game are not being addressed and the true reason for a shift to the hybrid model have not been stated. The 'unsubscription wall' that has existed for previous ex-players still remains. So... those players that are still going through the 'happy and satisfied' phase may continue to subscribe until they hit the wall, and there will be an influx of returning/new players that will go the F2P route and play until they hit the wall, too. The second group will, if all goes well, enjoy replenishment... but as nothing has been done to combat the core problems the game has - those things that actually cause people to unsubscribe - player numbers will continue to decline over time. In the meanwhile, EA/Bioware will milk as much revenue from ALL players, whether subscribers or F2Pers, until the carousel grinds to a halt. This, by the way, is the true reason for their hybrid model... only a severely niave person could believe they have done this for the benefit of the playerbase.

TL;DR F2P Will not stop the rot. So... subs to ToR are now "well above" half a million, from two million plus at launch. That's a massive drop and has to be the true motivation behind their F2P model, rather than... "The subscription-only model presented a major barrier for a lot of people who wanted to become part of The Old Republic universe" (Bioware GM)... which is pure PR spin. F2P will keep the game ticking over for a while, I'm sure... but Bioware/EA are not small companies interested in games that simply tick over. Here's the thing... if, within a paltry six months or so, subs can drop by almost three quarters... there HAS to be another reason, apart from players not liking the subscription model, as we are told. In my opinion... people bought the game and subscribed and played until they got a character to level 50 or so and then left... because there is simply no depth to the game and it's simply not an MMO. It's another iteration of KOTOR which (and I'm not knocking the game here) is not the type of game you play for months and months, let alone years. There is a dearth of ground-based content and, as has been said so many times before... nothing worth mentioning in space, which is itself pretty crazy considering the IP and what could have been done. Games can survive the switch to F2P... and even release 'free' content and paid-for expansions. Some studios can even turn the customer-haemorrhage around to a certain degree and maintain a viable, profitable product. DCUO and LotRO are examples. I just don't think Bioware, and to a much greater extent, EA, are those studios. They spent big, aimed big, and only big margins will do. If these studios had intended to design a F2P game... if their investors and shareholders had wanted the profit-level of a F2P game... then that is what would have been released. As for the actual manner in which they intend to implement F2P, it emulates other models... there's nothing new here... though at least subscribers will get access to content denied to the F2P crowd... which coincidentally makes a total lie of the PR spin quote posted above. None of the stuff proposed will be enough to stop the game being withdrawn at some point. It's inevitable. I'm sure that Lucasarts doesn't give two hoots for EA/Bioware but they sure as hell know that their baby is worth a fortune... they will continue (and are continuing) to release games based on their franchise, irrespective of such games detrimental effect on EA/Bioware's profit with ToR. We will see another Star Wars MMO, in time... after this one goes belly-up. I'll just give a couple or four examples of why F2P will not be enough... Common MMO concepts that were included have been implemented badly, primarily (imo) the Trinity class system which, as implemented in ToR has led to crippling limitations in terms of both flashpoint/warzone/operations design and overall player choice. F2P will not change this. The manner in which the companion system was implemented utterly ruined immersion for those players who wanted to become immersed in the Star Wars environment. It's impossible to miss the fact that there are multiple Qyzens and Vettes running around and completely crazy that this ludicrous aspect got through concept, through design, through testing, and out into release. Even in the films/series the various astromechs had different numbers. F2P will not change this, either. The LFG tool is no more than a rush-to-gear tool that acts to the detriment of the (spacebarspacebar) story and content and, ultimately, to the staying power of players. Contrary to what you'd expect, it promotes and facilitates nothing that adds to the MMOness of the game. Without the need for guilds or friends... it simply hammers home the last nail in the coffin and ensures this remains a solo game with a brief PuG element to polish off stats. Story... this was the unique-selling-point of an overall game design that with regard to all other MMO game aspects offered absolutely nothing new. The storyline is great first time around... but when you stop and think about it, it's pretty insulating in implementation and does not promote multiplayerness at all. Other players get in the way of the presented story and you become isolated by it. Unless you ignore it, of course... which many players (particularly in groups) do. F2P will not change this. The first two things alone - implementation of a redesigned and fit-for-purpose trinity and companion mechanic - would take a massive design effort to correct/enhance and one that, I suspect, Bioware/EA have neither heart nor pocket for. Not that for one minute do I think they (and many players) believe they even need to. There's more... there really is (unfortunately)... and adding more dailies (which the new end-game-content planet will ultimately involve) or 10 more ship-rail-space-combat 'encounters' or a mass of paid-for monkey-lizards, thrones or dancing jawas will not stop the rot. It's not all about numbers or profit... this is an entertainment product, so it's about quality of experience, too... which if implemented well, can lead to customer retention. I guess that most people (like me) really enjoyed dipping their toes into the game but the game is no more than an expensive paddling pool. It's a nice paddling pool, for sure... but few people will paddle here for lengthy periods as there are lots of other nice paddling pools out there and even more on the horizon. With so much spent on design in terms of money, effort and time... not to mention that this is STAR WARS for one and BIOWARE for two... I at least expected a stream... perhaps even a river. Somewhere to get really moist. And yes... I have unsubscribed. I've enjoyed the game for the time I've played it, despite the flaws... and I know that there is no such thing as an eternal MMO... but given the IP and the studio, I had expected to be here for longer. I just sincerely believe that F2P fixes nothing. It's been introduced to stop the rats leaving the sinking ship by offering them cheese on the top deck... but it ignores the holes that are letting in the water in the first place. If you read all of this waffle... thanks :-)

As the default augment slot level for craft-crit items w/slot is MK1... then they have the same value as a non-crit item w/o augment slot... and the item may as well not have a slot in the first place. If an item doesn't have a slot OR it has a MK1 slot you'll still need a MK6 kit, whatever... in order to upgrade the slot and use a 22 augment (say). Which then makes a total farce of the Legacy Perk that gives you a total of 3% chance of an augmented result while crafting and costs a total of 350k credits per character for the privilege. Pointless. Also... there's no way to tell on the GTN what the MK? level of an augment slot is... so no point in upgrading the default slot to MK6 yourself before a sale in order to (legitimately) charge more. Pointless. Couple this with the pre/post-1.3 augment slot fiasco-ette which wouldn't have been an issue at all had they not tried to add a tier of 'complexity' (AKA grind/moneysink) to the process by using different-tiered MK? kits. Messed-up thinking. Why not make the default MK? state of a craft-critted augment item MK6. It's not rocket-science.

I'd go along with these points. As a Seer, I've found the vast bulk of PuGs here to be no fun whatsoever and the LFG tool hasn't improved the experience for me over the past couple of days. I've now developed an attitude and opinion which, though based on experience, will sour any such groups for me in the future. The reasons are numerous but I suppose the main one is insanespeed... where the mentality is get them done asap, grab the loot and out. Zipbangnext! As a consequence there's no real concern but manic DpSfesting... great for the buttonspamming DpS classes but a royal pain for healer and (also from experience) a tank. Sure, the manicness can up the reaction-fuelled ante but after a while this is not fun. So no amount of bribery will get me into a PuG anymore, nor make me use the LFG tool. Doing content with guildmembers or friends is an infinitely more rewarding game experience... at least for me... and for that I need no bribe.

One size fits all augment crafting kits? No. No. No. It doesn't take a rocket-scientist to see why not. The only positive thing that 'might' happen is that custom, non-augment gear may become a viable commodity again... Speaking of why nots... why not (instead) introduce fresh gear designs... and add gear schematics that guarantee an augment slot but require crit items.

Thanks for those replies... I shall head into the undergrowth with a large bat and start whacking heads.

Is there any stat-difference between level 39 orange (for example) w/augment and level 50 w/augment if they have the same armour/mod/enhancement/augment slotted? I'm a newly-minted level 50 Sage that's not enamoured of the Zeyd-Cloth set and have heard whispers in the undergrowth about gear with a lower level requirement gifting poorer stats than higher. I don't want to waste money ripping slots apart just to find out, either. Thanks in advance for any answers!

Sounds like you've been having the same sort of forum day I have... I spent two distressing hours convinced the Twi'lek Hoods / Clipping Lekku thread was about some arcane circumcision ritual. Not that I'd admit it. Oops.

Holy crap! Literally! After reading the section on fainting and death, I have upgraded my insurance policy. Better to be safe. Wouldn't want my loved ones to be denied a payout in the event of any poopsquat-related death I may suffer. I realise this thread has been somewhat dragged nether-region-wards so will attempt to adjust and compensate... Has anyone else noticed that the Kneeling Plague Taun Tauns are insisting on aninnynonny... anonnyninny... anigglyscratching... anonymity? I have an Orokeet, called Orokeet... a Crimson and a Pale Rakling (guess what they're called)... but a Taun Taun that evidently only speaks Blue Bar... 'cos that's all it's willing to display. Could this be down to the fact that the Kneely-related damage they're doing is so system-wide that the Containment Officers (who are conspicuous by their absinthe, I have to say) are under orders to euthanise the entire species? The plot thickens.