Doing something against other players

[DanielAstrol]

What do I mean? Objective thieves and other players who butts into someone elses fight, because they're always in a "hurry". Would it be possible to make other players unable to attack a mob while another is fighting it? However if players are in a group, this restriction isn't active.

 

When I told the specific player to please mind his or her business, and not rudely, usually I get two types of reply.

1. The silent treatment
2. "STFU you idiot blablabla"

 

This is sort of a rant, but still, I can't be the only one bothered by this.

[Hrafnhildur]

5 minutes ago, DanielAstrol said:

What do I mean? Objective thieves and other players who butts into someone elses fight, because they're always in a "hurry". Would it be possible to make other players unable to attack a mob while another is fighting it? However if players are in a group, this restriction isn't active.

 

When I told the specific player to please mind his or her business, and not rudely, usually I get two types of reply.

1. The silent treatment
2. "STFU you idiot blablabla"

 

This is sort of a rant, but still, I can't be the only one bothered by this.

This happened to me a lot of times during the Bounty Hunt event - someone came and killed the mob I was trying to capture. OK, I let it go, no big deal, but still it is a bit annoying. Trying to communicate with the other players did not had any positive results, I got only insults and mockery because : 

- they are in a hurry and I kill to slow - well wait your turn, pal, Rome wasn't build in one day! 

- I use an unpopular companion - my choice, I don't have to follow the trends if I don't want to

- they inspected me and I don't have the ideal stats and that makes them want to help me - have I asked for help? have you seen me posting LFM for X mission? no? then why do you offer unasked for help? 

and so on. 

 

[Darcmoon]

13 hours ago, DanielAstrol said:

What do I mean? Objective thieves and other players who butts into someone elses fight, because they're always in a "hurry". Would it be possible to make other players unable to attack a mob while another is fighting it? However if players are in a group, this restriction isn't active.

As long as BW has shared mobs then this isn’t possible.  They just introduced it in 7.0 and it’s doubtful they’ll change it before 8.0, if they ever do.   Even before shared mobs, they didn’t have what you are asking for and, me personally, am not for it since I’ve jumped in to help someone else who is close to dead or pulled to large of a group before. 

[DWho]

13 hours ago, Hrafnhildur said:

This happened to me a lot of times during the Bounty Hunt event...

 

There are a few events and objectives where "helping" is actually detrimental (best to know what the result of your joining is before jumping in since its not always positive). What they should do is make anyone entering the combat area not be able to use any of the clickable objectives until after the fight is over, giving the person who started the fight to get the objective at least some chance of getting what they were fighting for. When an NPC needs to drop an item to complete the questline, I have seen people help out, and the person who started the fight not getting the drop. It doesn't happen consistently so there is a bug somewhere or it is using the "killing" blow to determine who gets the drop. Face Merchants was this way on the PTS (pre-7.0) and I have encountered situations where you get drops from the mob but not the required item, but the other person who joined in does get the needed item.

If you ask someone not to "help" and they keep jumping in, that is a reportable offense. Just make sure you have evidence that you asked them when you submit the report.

[Darcmoon]

5 minutes ago, DWho said:

 

If you ask someone not to "help" and they keep jumping in, that is a reportable offense. Just make sure you have evidence that you asked them when you submit the report.

That probably isn’t true.  Most of the mobs are shared drops now. I won’t say there aren’t possibly a few bugs but them jumping in when they need the mob also is an encouraged action since 7.0. Asking them not to help and then reporting them will probably get the report ignored since that is how they want the game to go. As for the mob/s not dropping the quest item for the one who engaged first, that is no different than how it is normally.  Person A takes 15 mobs to get the item and person B takes one.   I’ve seen that happen in groups before.   It generates the loot per person. 

[DWho]

12 minutes ago, Darcmoon said:

That probably isn’t true.  Most of the mobs are shared drops now. I won’t say there aren’t possibly a few bugs but them jumping in when they need the mob also is an encouraged action since 7.0. Asking them not to help and then reporting them will probably get the report ignored since that is how they want the game to go. As for the mob/s not dropping the quest item for the one who engaged first, that is no different than how it is normally.  Person A takes 15 mobs to get the item and person B takes one.   I’ve seen that happen in groups before.   It generates the loot per person. 

It's pretty much a textbook example of harassment

[Darcmoon]

21 minutes ago, DWho said:

It's pretty much a textbook example of harassment

Except that because of the change to mobs dropping items/quest items, it is exactly how BW is saying to play the game. 

[Jdast]

34 minutes ago, DWho said:

It's pretty much a textbook example of harassment

DWho and OP,

Bioware expressly changed the rules to allow 'shared tagging of mobs' with 7.0 because people were annoyed about respawn timers. It is, by definition, not harassment. Moreover, I have "whisper" turned off on all my characters so I wouldn't get the notification that you were annoyed. And, forgive me for being blunt: I wouldn't care, particularly since I have often saved lives of someone close to dying. 

As for someone swooping in like a vulture and clicking on an objective / quest item before you, there is a very a simple and obvious solution: Your companion should be strong enough to survive a few seconds solo while you click on the objective. I always do this because, yes, it is annoying -- but also easily preventable.

Bottom line: Shared tagging is one of the best things to happen in this game given lengthy respawn timers so I strongly disagree with you and OP. In a populated world, which by definiton a MMORPG is, you don't "own" and have "exclusive rights" to a mob or a clickable objective / quest item.

Dasty

Edited February 8, 2023 by Jdast
Stupid typos!

[DWho]

20 minutes ago, Jdast said:

DWho and OP,

Bioware expressly changed the rules to allow 'shared tagging of mobs' with 7.0 because people were annoyed about respawn timers. It is, by definition, not harassment. Moreover, I have "whisper" turned off on all my characters so I wouldn't get the notification that you were annoyed. And, forgive me for being blunt: I wouldn't care, particularly since I have often saved lives of someone close to dying. 

As for someone swooping in like a vulture and clicking on an objective / quest item before you, there is a very a simple and obvious solution: Your companion should be strong enough to survive a few seconds solo while you click on the objective. I always do this because, yes, it is annoying -- but also easily preventable.

Bottom line: Shared tagging is one of the best things to happen in this game given lengthy respawn timers so I am completely disagree with you and OP. In a populated world, which by definiton a MMORPG is, you don't "own" and have "exclusive rights" to a mob or a clickable objective / quest item.

Dasty

The example given was the Bounty Hunter event. Jumping in causes the player who started the fight to have to begin the quest all over again (which is why I said you should know what the impact is before jumping in) if they are trying to capture instead of kill. I am not talking about the Kill X NPC missions or the Rampages (the shared tagging is fine for those). So I disagree with both you and Darcmoon on shared tagging being a positive for that mission (it's clearly a negative).

Perhaps they could turn of shared tagging for mobs off that type. A simple fix for the objects would be to give them instant respawn but block you from clicking on the same one more than once per "old" respawn. It is a shared enviroment and you should consider it to be the same as in real life. Would you push someone out of the way to get what you want, probably not. You should treat the game the same way. Object ninja-ing is more than annoying it is flat out rude (though there is little you can do about it which is why it continues to go on.

Edited February 8, 2023 by DWho

[OlBuzzard]

47 minutes ago, Jdast said:

DWho and OP,

Bioware expressly changed the rules to allow 'shared tagging of mobs' with 7.0 because people were annoyed about respawn timers. It is, by definition, not harassment. Moreover, I have "whisper" turned off on all my characters so I wouldn't get the notification that you were annoyed. And, forgive me for being blunt: I wouldn't care, particularly since I have often saved lives of someone close to dying. 

As for someone swooping in like a vulture and clicking on an objective / quest item before you, there is a very a simple and obvious solution: Your companion should be strong enough to survive a few seconds solo while you click on the objective. I always do this because, yes, it is annoying -- but also easily preventable.

Bottom line: Shared tagging is one of the best things to happen in this game given lengthy respawn timers so I strongly disagree with you and OP. In a populated world, which by definiton a MMORPG is, you don't "own" and have "exclusive rights" to a mob or a clickable objective / quest item.

Dasty

This works up to a point.  However, since the advent of companions that don't heal worth ... much ...  I've been repeatedly on the leading edge of doing the work (and at times dyeing off in the process) while some total jerk (that's the upgraded polite name) ..  tags the target and lets me take the blunt of the attack.  This is especially true on Manaan Heroics as well as the latest area that dropped in 7.2

There is no rule or anything that will ever stop it!

That attitude is not the fault of the development team.  Unfortunately, I don't know of anything that can be done about it.  Personally ... I just do my own thing and keep on truckin'!  Otherwise, I'd get really upset and tell that bunch just exactly what I think about it...  (NOT GOOD EITHER) ...

Sooo , I just walk away in style!!!

😉

(I'm reasonably sure you get the point )

[Darcmoon]

39 minutes ago, DWho said:

The example given was the Bounty Hunter event. Jumping in causes the player who started the fight to have to begin the quest all over again (which is why I said you should know what the impact is before jumping in) if they are trying to capture instead of kill. I am not talking about the Kill X NPC missions or the Rampages (the shared tagging is fine for those). So I disagree with both you and Darcmoon on shared tagging being a positive for that mission (it's clearly a negative).

Perhaps they could turn off shared tagging for mobs off that type. A simple fix for the objects would be to give them instant respawn but block you from clicking on the same one more than once per "old" respawn. It is a shared enviroment and you should consider it to be the same as in real life. Would you push someone out of the way to get what you want, probably not. You should treat the game the same way. Object ninja-ing is more than annoying it is flat out rude (though there is little you can do about it which is why it continues to go on.

The OP didn’t use the Bounty Hunter Event as an example and they were the one I originally replied to.  When I replied to you, it was about it being a reportable offense.  Even taking the Bounty Hunter event in to account they probably wouldn’t agree it is a reportable offense since 99% of the quests it works as intended.  Even before 7.0, people would jump in on fights because they wanted the respawn to happen sooner, to help, because they went to attack and someone else tagged the mob before they got there, etc.  

[DWho]

33 minutes ago, Darcmoon said:

Even before 7.0, people would jump in on fights because they wanted the respawn to happen sooner, to help, because they went to attack and someone else tagged the mob before they got there, etc.  

So this makes it alright. They did it before so it's OK to do it now. Personally I don't see a difference. It was reportable before and it is reportable now in my opinion. Virtually all of the players jumping in know exactly what is going to happen and it is their selfishness that causes the problem (as you stated, they want to start their quest and don't care that they have broken someone else's). Instead of waiting their turn, they'd rather ruin someone else's ability to complete the quest (they are once per day aren't they or is it once per week). At least if you die doing that quest, you don't have to wait until the next day to try again (nothing wrong with helping someone about to die, though it's unlikely you'll actually be successful unless you are healing them).

I think you are giving people the benefit of the doubt (that they really want to help) when that is mostly unjustified. It is all about selfishness. I am fine with most of the way shared tagging works (for the general kill X NPC quests) but it should be modified when dealing with mobs that have required drops/outcomes to complete an objective. People complain all the time about how there is no challenge in the game, but when someone wants to add challenge by using a "weaker" character, it is somehow alright for some super overpowered player to come in and blow away the mob because he is "helping". 

Another mission that comes to mind where "shared tagging" is a negative is the Alderaan quest where you are supposed to capture a killik joiner. That doesn't work out so well when someone trying to get X kills jumps in and slaughters everything in sight (this wasn't a problem pre-7.0 because no one jumped in because they got nothing out of it).

Overall Shared Tagging is fine. It just needs a few tweaks to take care of the abuses that have developed

[Darcmoon]

8 minutes ago, DWho said:

So this makes it alright. They did it before so it's OK to do it now. Personally I don't see a difference. It was reportable before and it is reportable now in my opinion. Virtually all of the players jumping in know exactly what is going to happen and it is their selfishness that causes the problem (as you stated, they want to start their quest and don't care that they have broken someone else's). Instead of waiting their turn, they'd rather ruin someone else's ability to complete the quest (they are once per day aren't they or is it once per week). At least if you die doing that quest, you don't have to wait until the next day to try again (nothing wrong with helping someone about to die, though it's unlikely you'll actually be successful unless you are healing them).

I think you are giving people the benefit of the doubt (that they really want to help) when that is mostly unjustified. It is all about selfishness. I am fine with most of the way shared tagging works (for the general kill X NPC quests) but it should be modified when dealing with mobs that have required drops/outcomes to complete an objective. People complain all the time about how there is no challenge in the game, but when someone wants to add challenge by using a "weaker" character, it is somehow alright for some super overpowered player to come in and blow away the mob because he is "helping". 

Another mission that comes to mind where "shared tagging" is a negative is the Alderaan quest where you are supposed to capture a killik joiner. That doesn't work out so well when someone trying to get X kills jumps in and slaughters everything in sight (this wasn't a problem pre-7.0 because no one jumped in because they got nothing out of it).

Overall Shared Tagging is fine. It just needs a few tweaks to take care of the abuses that have developed

Can you still report it?  Yes. Will BW do anything about it? No.  Because they changed how the mobs work so they have basically (and I use basically since they haven’t said it straight out) said that isn’t a reportable offense at this point.  I’m not saying you have to like it.   You are also assigning motives to why someone jumps in just as much as I am.  Where I’m giving them the benefit of the doubt, you are assigning selfish intent.  You are just as likely to be right as I am.  Part of the reason the put in mob sharing was for the mobs that have required drops and/or outcomes.  They wanted to funnel everyone into the same areas each week and make them share mobs. That was their intent.