TrekkerVGER Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Sure, I'll throw my two cents in. Yes, I rather disliked the expansions. I disliked that KOTFE completely invalidated everything my characters had accomplished. I despised the forced solo aspect (my brother and I play together). I hate the grey sludge fallacy they consistently shoved in my face. I especially hated the one-story-fits-all despite class or even faction. I mean, really? Visions in the Dark as a Smuggler just felt like a farce. At the end of the Nathema conspiracy arc, I actually jumped out of my chair chanting "Yes, yes!" I resubscribed only because I heard Bioware was going back to Republic vs Empire stories. If I never have to hear "Outlander" or "Commander" again, I'll be pleased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casirabit Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Hate is a word I don't use as it brings negative feelings. I liked the expansions but there were things I think they could have done better. I also don't have a problem returning to the empire/republic provided they do the story right. But for me this constant bickering between who "dislikes" or "likes" the expansion is a waste of time. Some like it and don't need people making snide comments because they do. Some don't and they deserve the same respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightblazer Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 I didn't hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThrakhathSpawn Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 So many issues, so much that wasn't done right. But the over arching issue for me is a combination of inconsistent ignorant writing, and a break in story telling form. A major flaw in story telling form, is they destroyed your "family", both other players in the game by going solo advanced instances, but also by punting off all companions, and making all your characters "disappear". I have not done KOTET, KOTFE gave me a big case of the "I don't care where this story goes". Rather than listing the huge list I did not like, I'll instead list the two story parts I did like. I liked going through the under city with Senya, up until meeting with the Heralds. I like Profit and Plunder aside from the scenes featuring Vaylin and Arkan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albeva Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 (edited) I liked the story or artistic side of it. Was well crafted, cinematic story. I know some story / lore purist have different take on characters, but personally I enjoyed that aspect of the expansions. What I absolutely detest is the format by which it was delivered. The mini instanced story chapters that turned an MMO game into single player on-rails experience. No easy grouping up, no spontaneous group invites, very little replay value, no exploration. Every zone feels empty and filled only with NPCs that is in such a contrast to the rest of the game. In addition I don't want to have 50+ companions or followers, too many bloot alliance alerts for me to care even in the slightest anymore. Disregard of MMO content, no new ops, abomination that was (and still is) Galactic Command, dumbification and streamlining of content. Leveling and original class stories are now a joke, no sense of progression from lower to upper level zones, removal of numerous mechanics from story mode operations, even flashpoints dumbed down to the point they can be soloed, loss of micro management (companions, class specific stats). legacy bound datacrons, every companion now just different voice & skin - no unique abilities or roles. Blah. Quite frankly no wonder people left in droves. Everyone always says they want quick & easy rewards, but by catering that BW has in fact lost players. Yeah I hope that with 6.0 they will reconsider some of their past decisions. Not every change has been bad, but frankly there seem more bad ones in the last 2 expansions than good ones. Edited October 22, 2018 by albeva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quraswren Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Hate is much to strong a word for it but I disliked the majority of KOTFE or KOTET and what came after them. Might have been 2 or 3 chapters that were decent but the rest were so bad I could only pull myself to run through it twice in total. Once Rep. and once Emp. Two and done given how terrible the wronging was combined with how bad the majority of the chapter designs were even down to how the mobs spawned. Just terrible. I hope soemthing better is coming but sadly the same people who did KOTFE or KOTET and the content after those are also the ones doing this back to Emp. vs Rep and I expect it to be just as terrible story writing given rumors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiesu Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) How many mirror threads are we gonna have just to spite the "other side" Well, I already replied with distaste to the "did not hate" thread, despite disliking it more than liking it so, gotta contribute here too. "Hate" is too strong word, I had mixed feelings. This should have been a single-player game instead of an MMO expansion. There was nothing to do with friends, it all has solo emphasis written all over it. Atleast vanilla you had to do FPs, WZ, heroics or exploration quests with people, or had the option to... ET/FE was like "pff who has friends anyway! Remove all of it!!" /facepalm Like, literally all of it, they give so much XP for just Vanilla grouping even there is pointless since you're max lv just by doing class story and nothing else ever. jeez Story bit was good fun... for like one run... but one size did not fit all, at all, in this expansion. I'd rather I could skip it and have some unknown entity be the Outlander, and have my characters start from where Ziost left off next story bit with no affiliation to alliance... Edited October 23, 2018 by Kiesu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith-Viscera Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Loved it for Force users, Hated it for Range users. They should of made a different story line for Range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falensawino Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Locking Dailies/Weeklies planets behind story was really inconvenient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LudhaninRolgge Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 I hate it. The story is at best bad fan-fiction of random sci-fi. I never felt I was playing a SWTOR game during KotFE and KotET. On top of that, we had no real content for 2 years so there's that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KendraP Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Count me amongst the haters. Ruined story for me, character was completely off, everything. And i can do "alliance" type stories, my favorite expansion was SoR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkrebellord Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 I love the chapter all 1 to 25 of them great to be able to do something different instead of boring old story lines of republic verus imperial like we had for 4 years. My only gripe with the chapters KOTFE and KOTET was you did not get option to do it in groups of 2, 3 4, 5 , 6, 7 and 8 man or solo. Am not a fan the current focus just upon operations which take long to organise and most of the people who go in them wont support the group they just want you for concern parts and rush through it wonder why they die. Also not a fan of drop gear being bind to character especially when its useless to your character setup IE dropping Enhancement that has defence or Absorption in it for DPS class that relie upon critical, power and Alacrity, Love the Nathem flashpoint for the end of the traitor storyline. Like to see a storyline where your companions die then you recruit newer ones or for the droids upgrade versions with better chat lines and more romance type roles. Character class need to under go over hall to match the new era of conflict like example class becoming older looking in appearance finding out you have new abilities or weapons you can call upon. Example Sith Sorcerer Force lightning changes to Fork charge lightning where your lightning can come from the air then reverse to come out of the ground in fork striking the twice multiple enemies in mid range of 20 metres causing burning sensation and making the enemy skeleton appear. Jedi Knight learning they can project there damage internally into the enemy at a distance drawing the energy out of them making them weaking as they move closer. Trooper discovering they can equipe blaster that has a lazer beam on it able to blind or slice downing there foes. Tank able to force choke 3 opponents to within inch of there live while welding a light saber in twirl that rips through a group of 20 enemies at a time. Smuggler able to weld any weapon they pick up that surprise any enemies within the range of 10 metre causing serve element damage. Operative being able to change there appearance to make it look someone else while firing off tremor along the ground that causes leg damage to there opponents as examples. Medics being able to lift 5 injured characters out of harms way while healing them back to near health while causing damage to opponents that knock or stuns them for 10 secs at a time slows them down long enough for the group to reengage in combat. These abilities can not be used in PVP warzone but in flashpoints, operations and storyline or class line. Also like to see more influence for companions. Better companion story lines with ability to use them on concern mission like to rescue you from danger mission where you are the companion coming to your master aid and helping them to safety or where you operate your companion on recon mission to discover what the enemy is up to in concern storylines. Also class characters should be able to die within the storyline but pass on there abilities to new uprising class that you mould into your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 (edited) Chapters 1 & 2 of KotFE are the only ones that I truly enjoyed. The thing why I loved them so much is that we were still tied to our original faction when we played them, we were still a leader within the Empire or Republic. After Chapter 3 that element disappears and to me that is also the moment that my enjoyment of the story evaporates. It is my belief that we should have received the choice to return to our original faction in Chapter 9 of KotFE. The choice to stay on Odessen and found the Alliance should have of course been there for those who like that narrative, but the story team crippled both KotFE and KotET by not including an option to return to either the Empire or Republic and rally that faction against Zakuul. So my opinion on KotFE and KotET often comes down to this: so much wasted potential, in various aspects of the story. Edited October 24, 2018 by Ylliarus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grania Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 Chapters 1 & 2 of KotFE are the only ones that I truly enjoyed. The thing why I loved them so much is that we were still tied to our original faction when we played them, we were still a leader within the Empire or Republic. After Chapter 3 that element disappears and to me that is also the moment that my enjoyment of the story evaporates. It is my believe that we should have received the choice to return to our original faction in Chapter 9 of KotFE. The choice to stay on Odessen and found the Alliance should have of course been there for those who like that narrative, but the story team crippled both KotFE and KotET by not including an option to return to either the Empire or Republic and rally that faction against Zakuul. So my opinion on KotFE and KotET often comes down to this: so much wasted potential, in various aspects of the story. Yeah. I remember feeling kind of thrilled by it all at first, but as the story progressed I started feeling really off balance and out of sorts and it just got worse, never better. The experience of kotfe was depressing to me. Even now, going to Odessen to turn in boxes gives me a feeling of dread and unease. At the end of Nathema, was it? When I finally got to tell Lana that I didn't want to Alliance anymore - it felt like such a relief. I'm..free? I'm FREE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 Yeah. I remember feeling kind of thrilled by it all at first, but as the story progressed I started feeling really off balance and out of sorts and it just got worse, never better. The experience of kotfe was depressing to me. Even now, going to Odessen to turn in boxes gives me a feeling of dread and unease. At the end of Nathema, was it? When I finally got to tell Lana that I didn't want to Alliance anymore - it felt like such a relief. I'm..free? I'm FREE! Yeah I echo your sentiment. Especially when the devs were showcasing chapter 1 in livestreams I was super excited and when playing through that chapter for the first time, I was just so damn thrilled. But the closer we came to chapter 9 the more I recognised we'd not return to our original faction. It really took away a huge part of my enjoyment of the story as it literally ruined my experience of my main toons, so much so I eventually felt myself forced to delete them and reroll new characters, playing only the class stories and RotHC and SoR on them. I loved Nathema, especially because we saw the gorgeous and beautiful destruction of the Eternal Fleet which was just a horrible plot device if you ask me. It was WAY too overpowered up until the point it became unbelievable. I was dancing in my chair when I saw that scene where all those ships went boom, really, it was one of the happiest moments I experienced while playing this game! It's funny, because I prefer playing through the class stories and all the base game missions and content (all of the missions, even the Exploration ones) time and time again instead of replaying the KotFE and KotET chapters. Really, I can't get enough of the class stories and planetary arcs and the side missions, it's all amazing and epic! But playing KotFE and KotET again? Blegh, no thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishpeople Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 (edited) Do you think Bioware will recover from the state they've put themselves into? whatever action they take it will likely annoy one group of fans. That said whatever happens I suspect will be drowned out by the dislike towards the new gear grind. Edited October 24, 2018 by fishpeople Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 Do you think Bioware will recover from the state they've put themselves into? whatever action they take it will likely annoy one group of fans. That said whatever happens I suspect will be drowned out by the dislike towards the new gear grind. Well, Bioware could have avoided their current predicament if they had handled KotFE and KotET differently. The story simply didn't work as a continuation of the main SWTOR storyline and players didn't appreciate that. It's why KotFE and KotET got so much criticism and the amount of subs fell afterwards. Or at least, I believe it's one of the reasons, as there were more reasons why the amount of subs went down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishpeople Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 Well, Bioware could have avoided their current predicament if they had handled KotFE and KotET differently. The story simply didn't work as a continuation of the main SWTOR storyline and players didn't appreciate that. It's why KotFE and KotET got so much criticism and the amount of subs fell afterwards. Or at least, I believe it's one of the reasons, as there were more reasons why the amount of subs went down. I think the introduction of the CXP and RNG grinds remain the main culprit for killing a lot of subscriptions. Story may have played a role too but not on the same scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 (edited) I think the introduction of the CXP and RNG grinds remain the main culprit for killing a lot of subscriptions. Story may have played a role too but not on the same scale. No true, you're right, it may not have been the main factor, but I believe it has had a significant impact nonetheless. A lot of players I used to play with left SWTOR because of the direction the story took and generally there seemed to be a negative attitude about it across the media. Edited October 24, 2018 by Ylliarus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KendraP Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 4.0 was the beginning of the downfall for me. I spent 3 expansions as a solo/story player. The story with 4.0 was so bad I couldn't bring myself to repeat it on multiple characters. I became a raider and started PvPing instead, and now they've effectively killed my fun there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishpeople Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 No true, you're right, it may not have been the main factor, but I believe it has had a significant impact nonetheless. A lot of players I used to play with left SWTOR because of the direction the story took and generally there seemed to be a negative attitude about it across the media. I don't remember much back from when kotfe was first introduced. I do remember one of my guild mates telling me the chapters didn't live up to the hype created from the trailer though. He thought we were going to end up in a three way war with the Sith, Republic and the Eternal Empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 I don't remember much back from when kotfe was first introduced. I do remember one of my guild mates telling me the chapters didn't live up to the hype created from the trailer though. He thought we were going to end up in a three way war with the Sith, Republic and the Eternal Empire. That would have been a great story though. I would have loved to have a three-way war between those three factions with new classes being introduced for the Eternal Empire, like a Knight of Zakuul and Scion of Zakuul, to mirror Jedi Knight/Sith Warrior and Jedi Consular/Sith Inquisitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishpeople Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 That would have been a great story though. I would have loved to have a three-way war between those three factions with new classes being introduced for the Eternal Empire, like a Knight of Zakuul and Scion of Zakuul, to mirror Jedi Knight/Sith Warrior and Jedi Consular/Sith Inquisitor. That would have been a good way in my opinion to introduce a third faction that could rival the Republic & Empire. Granted they probably would have likely been a beast to fund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 That would have been a good way in my opinion to introduce a third faction that could rival the Republic & Empire. Granted they probably would have likely been a beast to fund. True, but the investment would have been worth it because I bet it would have drawn more players in/back. They really could have made an intriguing and exciting storyline that would have entailed the war between these three factions, a bit like in ESO we also have a three faction war. But no, instead we got a poorly recycled KOTOR 3 that was way too forced to fit into the narrative of the game and ruins everything it preceded. Such a pity and such wasted potential... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishpeople Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 True, but the investment would have been worth it because I bet it would have drawn more players in/back. They really could have made an intriguing and exciting storyline that would have entailed the war between these three factions, a bit like in ESO we also have a three faction war. But no, instead we got a poorly recycled KOTOR 3 that was way too forced to fit into the narrative of the game and ruins everything it preceded. Such a pity and such wasted potential... Yeah, it would have been a great way to introduce the Zakuulan lore. Even if the Zakuulan characters shared the same story. I didn't mind kotfe, it wasn't until kotet/fa I started to notice all the wasted potential with this plot. Even the data-mined stuff for 5.10 isn't that encouraging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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