Vaylin - CM Companion

[fishpeople]

Ok I've seen this thread popping up forever now and I'm not gonna read the past ten pages, but I have to ask, how do you get a dead character as a companion?

 

Are we going to the hyperrealistic robot/toy territory that was masked to look like Vaylin? (you creep )

 

Or a force ghost that cant actually interact with the physical world almost at all? And can't even stay visible for more than a little while? That sound's like an unreliable companion.

 

Or did someone on Zakuul kidnap that face-changer doctor on Nar Shadda and cut Vaylin's face on some random NPCs face?

 

Lol, I'm all for giving Lana some plastic surgery after she and Theron chopped of my characters Lekku so they could stuff me into that's knights armor.

 

Lore-wise, I don't think it would need to be complicated, just say some vendor guy cloned her and or anyone else players have wanted as companions.

[gamephil]

I'm pretty sure the poster was joking to some extent. But, every time this thread pops up someone asks that question. Very often, the exact same people. And they get an answer. The fact that they choose not to accept it, over and over again, but keep asking it says, well, honestly I don't know what.

 

There are so many ways Vaylin specifically could come back it's not even entertaining any longer having to explain them again, and most of the other characters people talk about returning this way could almost as easily if the writers chose for them to. But this thread isn't asking for any of that, anyway, it's ONLY asking for a non-story companion. Some people just want to be able to have her hanging around for whatever reason, some people would like to headcanon a story that is less outright disgusting than the one they gave us (that would be me). So, if some explanation isn't going to be offered because her story is "told and done", and no one is asking for anything more than a method that, like the console on Odesson, brings back a character out of story, why is the question even being asked?

Edited July 20, 2018 by gamephil

[gamephil]

Ok I've seen this thread popping up forever now and I'm not gonna read the past ten pages, but I have to ask, how do you get a dead character as a companion?

 

Are we going to the hyperrealistic robot/toy territory that was masked to look like Vaylin? (you creep )

 

Or a force ghost that cant actually interact with the physical world almost at all? And can't even stay visible for more than a little while? That sound's like an unreliable companion.

 

Or did someone on Zakuul kidnap that face-changer doctor on Nar Shadda and cut Vaylin's face on some random NPCs face?

 

Requested to post from @black_vinil: (edited because I copied too much from the post that wasn't for this response)

 

In that case, by this logic, let's ban the possibility of using the magic terminal on Odessen, when players want to bring back the characters who died in the story-for example, Koth, Senya, Torian\Vette, Kalyo, SCORPIO, etc. after all, They are already dead (some, but still), it is also unrealistic too.

 

They no longer take part in the plot, as they may be dead, they will not affect lore.

 

The same thing with Vaylin-only bonus companion for those who want, and that buys her, so what's the problem?

 

…

 

So let's do it, shall we?

Edited July 20, 2018 by gamephil

[fishpeople]

…

 

Not a bad idea. Depending on the character I would be willing to put down some money for them.

[Paulsutherland]

Ok I've seen this thread popping up forever now and I'm not gonna read the past ten pages, but I have to ask, how do you get a dead character as a companion?

 

Are we going to the hyperrealistic robot/toy territory that was masked to look like Vaylin? (you creep )

 

Or a force ghost that cant actually interact with the physical world almost at all? And can't even stay visible for more than a little while? That sound's like an unreliable companion.

 

Or did someone on Zakuul kidnap that face-changer doctor on Nar Shadda and cut Vaylin's face on some random NPCs face?

 

Can't be any worse than getting dead companions back from the magical console on Odessen. I'm all for Vaylin having a stunt double though.

[Kiesu]

Requested to post from @black_vinil: (edited because I copied too much from the post that wasn't for this response)

 

In that case, by this logic, let's ban the possibility of using the magic terminal on Odessen, when players want to bring back the characters who died in the story-for example, Koth, Senya, Torian\Vette, Kalyo, SCORPIO, etc. after all, They are already dead (some, but still), it is also unrealistic too.

 

They no longer take part in the plot, as they may be dead, they will not affect lore.

 

The same thing with Vaylin-only bonus companion for those who want, and that buys her, so what's the problem?

 

…

 

So let's do it, shall we?

Lol. Well that was my first time posting, usually I just roll my ever at "revive x character because waifu/husbando". But feel free to dig trough the pages.

 

Yeah magic terminal is magic. But they were still our past companions, rather than random npc. Vaylin never even gets accompanying ability bar, like Acina, and she isn't a companion or magic terminal summon either, so why should Vaylin?

 

We have never gotten an "illogical" new companion. Vaylin would be the first. Hence my cynical tone on what kind of "contract" would a dead person get. Those were my first thoughts

Remember when everyone was furiously posting about Darth Marr companion immediately after his death? Nothing happened to that thought either :|

[Paulsutherland]

Lol. Well that was my first time posting, usually I just roll my ever at "revive x character because waifu/husbando". But feel free to dig trough the pages.

 

Yeah magic terminal is magic. But they were still our past companions, rather than random npc. Vaylin never even gets accompanying ability bar, like Acina, and she isn't a companion or magic terminal summon either, so why should Vaylin?

 

We have never gotten an "illogical" new companion. Vaylin would be the first. Hence my cynical tone on what kind of "contract" would a dead person get. Those were my first thoughts

Remember when everyone was furiously posting about Darth Marr companion immediately after his death? Nothing happened to that thought either :|

 

Lol I don't think that's come up in here (correct me if I'm wrong)

 

Throw Acina and Marr onto the console too! I would like to have them both active without having to play the chapters again.

 

Vaylin? Why not? She was wih the player, if briefly during the final fight

 

Well there is that droid thing from the Nathema flashpoint, but I suppose that depends on how you look at it. I think some of the droid and pet companions are weird for certain characters.

 

Not sure what you mean by 'contract' ?[ (Tired - sorry) ... I guess it would again come down to how the individual player looks at it?

 

I didn't really pay attention to the forums back then, so I have no idea. I've got Darth Marr as a companion on a few of my Sith characters I have no intention of ever completing KOTFE/ET on. So I'm happy there I suppose I would use Vaylin in a similar fashion to Marr.

[Kiesu]

Lol I don't think that's come up in here (correct me if I'm wrong)

 

Throw Acina and Marr onto the console too! I would like to have them both active without having to play the chapters again.

 

Vaylin? Why not? She was wih the player, if briefly during the final fight

 

Well there is that droid thing from the Nathema flashpoint, but I suppose that depends on how you look at it. I think some of the droid and pet companions are weird for certain characters.

 

Not sure what you mean by 'contract' ?[ (Tired - sorry) ... I guess it would again come down to how the individual player looks at it?

 

I didn't really pay attention to the forums back then, so I have no idea. I've got Darth Marr as a companion on a few of my Sith characters I have no intention of ever completing KOTFE/ET on. So I'm happy there I suppose I would use Vaylin in a similar fashion to Marr.

Oh jesus, I'm not sure if you're trolling or not.

 

red

 

I'm pretty sure the poster was joking to some extent. But, every time this thread pops up someone asks that question. Very often, the exact same people. And they get an answer. The fact that they choose not to accept it, over and over again, but keep asking it says, well, honestly I don't know what.

 

 

No. Acina is having a life of their own in the empire (unless she ded), and Marr is ded. So, again, they ded, there is no logical reason for them to... revive. magically.

 

How is that droid weird? Droids are re-programmable. Animals are trainable. Dead people are not, unless they zombies on a leash. Is that what we're looking for?

 

A contract. You know, the consumable item that gives you the companion called "contract". Like Treek's one is "Mercenary Contract"? If you're looking for CC companion shouldn't you know how the items are called?

 

Well, there was. And nothing became of those demands either

I'm fine with anyone cheating the system to get some rando companion from unfinished chapter. But I'm not fine with officially reviving dead characters to break the lore.

Edited July 20, 2018 by Kiesu

[fishpeople]

How would it break lore? Just say it's a clone which can be purchased from some clone vendor or whatever from the fleet. Then technically she'll be both dead and 'alive' for those who like her character (depending on your view of clones.) Or you have that machine on Belsavis sell these copies as that thing can create life as it see's fit.

[Paulsutherland]

Oh jesus, I'm not sure if you're trolling or not.

 

red

 

 

 

 

No. Acina is having a life of their own in the empire (unless she ded), and Marr is ded. So, again, they ded, there is no logical reason for them to... revive. magically.

 

How is that droid weird? Droids are re-programmable. Animals are trainable. Dead people are not, unless they zombies on a leash. Is that what we're looking for?

 

A contract. You know, the consumable item that gives you the companion called "contract". Like Treek's one is "Mercenary Contract"? If you're looking for CC companion shouldn't you know how the items are called?

 

Well, there was. And nothing became of those demands either

I'm fine with anyone cheating the system to get some rando companion from unfinished chapter. But I'm not fine with officially reviving dead characters to break the lore.

 

I'm not sure who Phil is referring to, so I'll leave that for him to answer.

 

Which would be no more illogical than the 'magical' Odessen computer resurrecting the dead.

 

Well ... you've got cloning. Star Wars is pretty big on that. Ask Jango Fett or Mako.

 

Oh, the name of the token? Name it after the character in question? I.E. Vaylin Clone Authorization Token?

 

Again I wasn't around then, so no idea, but I'm good with just bailing on the chapter to keep Darth Marr around

 

Which you can do already with the Odessen console, and no one would be forcing you to buy said companion from the CM so I'm not sure what the problem would be.

[gamephil]

How would it break lore? Just say it's a clone which can be purchased from some clone vendor or whatever from the fleet. Then technically she'll be both dead and 'alive' for those who like her character (depending on your view of clones.) Or you have that machine on Belsavis sell these copies as that thing can create life as it see's fit.

 

Some people just think that even seeing someone else walking around with someone that they just can't think of a way to have alive, even if it has no impact on them, even if there is no official story for how it could happen, even if others might be perfectly satisfied with their own headcanon of why that character is there, is just going to break the game for them. For example, if the leader of the Alliance and the leader of the Empire work together on a project, just to use one of the examples here, that seems perfectly reasonable to me. But for some, it's just a step too far, it's just too unreasonable, and since they can't see it, they don't want anyone else to be able to have her around, either.

 

I mean, all these other characters that officially can be dead or alive don't break the game for me if I killed them and I see someone else with them. I see no difference between this request, logically, and that: for another's story, maybe Vaylin is dead. I would like my characters to have another story than the official one, which I find thoroughly objectionable. So I have her around while for most people she is dead, just like if 99% of people killed, say, Koth, but I didn't. I see no difference other than the lack of an official storyline, which, honestly, most of the characters who can die haven't had, anyway.

 

They don't have a story that breaks the lore, I have the companion so that I can pretend for myself that the lore is actually anything REMOTELY good in her case, and others that like it as it stands don't have to if they don't want to. And Bioware gets money. I see wins all around. The only reason not to is if it wouldn't be profitable (or less profitable than a project of similar difficulty), which is something I don't have the data to judge.

Edited July 21, 2018 by gamephil

[fishpeople]

Some people just think that even seeing someone else walking around with someone that they just can't think of a way to have alive, even if it has no impact on them, even if there is no official story for how it could happen, even if others might be perfectly satisfied with their own headcanon of why that character is there, is just going to break the game for them. For example, if the leader of the Alliance and the leader of the Empire work together on a project, just to use one of the examples here, that seems perfectly reasonable to me. But for some, it's just a step too far, it's just too unreasonable, and since they can't see it, they don't want anyone else to be able to have her around, either.

 

I mean, all these other characters that officially can be dead or alive don't break the game for me if I killed them and I see someone else with them. I see no difference between this request, logically, and that: for another's story, maybe Vaylin is dead. I would like my characters to have another story than the official one, which I find thoroughly objectionable. So I have her around while for most people she is dead, just like if 99% of people killed, say, Koth, but I didn't. I see no difference other than the lack of an official storyline, which, honestly, most of the characters who can die haven't had, anyway.

 

They don't have a story that breaks the lore, I have the companion so that I can pretend for myself that the lore is actually anything REMOTELY good in her case, and others that like it as it stands don't have to if they don't want to. And Bioware gets money. I see wins all around. The only reason not to is if it wouldn't be profitable (or less profitable than a project of similar difficulty), which is something I don't have the data to judge.

 

Oh yeah, I'm well aware of this. I had Arcann out awhile back and some guy sent me a few pms about Arcann being a bad choice, blah blah blah. I've even seen a few discussions in fleet chat with people attacking one another over their favorite companions.

 

I agree, it's never bothered me. Most of the time when I'm in an area with other people with companions out I'm not really paying enough attention to note who they've got.

 

It would be like Marr and Acina in tht respect, except we're paying them for these characters as a companions. I don't think it would break any lore, just say she's a clone created by whoever who has been conditioned to obey the Outlander.

 

Edit: wording on the last part could have been better but I think you get the general idea.

[Kiesu]

How would it break lore? Just say it's a clone which can be purchased from some clone vendor or whatever from the fleet. Then technically she'll be both dead and 'alive' for those who like her character (depending on your view of clones.) Or you have that machine on Belsavis sell these copies as that thing can create life as it see's fit.

IMO it's better to keep dead characters dead. We already have one immortal villain character in this universe and in this game, and that is enough.

 

We've all encountered this phenomena in various media. Character is presumed dead, then- TA DA!- by some miraculous feat/magic/loophole/bending of time and space the character turns out to be alive.

 

I never liked the whole "just kidding, he aint actually dead" trope in fiction. It feels like cheating, and removes the impact value from the story.

Not to say that every character revival ever written is cheating and should never be used- when handled well it can be a great way to connect with readers emotions during aftermath. But if you arent careful, character revivals can cheapen the death within the story, which usually ends up being the case.

 

When character revival trick is overdone, people start to expect it. Future character deaths become less meaningful. because players begin to anticipate that chances are, the character will be revived later on. When death becomes a concept that the player doesn't view as permanent state of character- it doesnt mean anything, and the whole impact of any future death scene is immediately reduced.

 

Even if the revival isnt overdone, it's very easy for a character to start feeling invincible. After all, they cant die. This is an issue many player characters are suffering from, they think they can do anything, because in videogame logic the player character is ultimately immortal for the sake of the player. This is why books in general have better stories overall, because the main character is not protected by plotarmor. You'll fear what will become of the main character in a book when met with overwhelming odds against their survival, because they might actually die, get crippled, be left traumatized and so on. If the player character is met with such conditions in a vidogame scene, chances are 99% of the time they'll come out of it without a scratch, because the story must go on and all that loot cant go to waste, right? You can see the difficulties of videogame writing right there.

 

But like I said, even though i enjoyed Vaylin a lot myself, revivals are something you have to be very careful with. You dont want to make your players feel cheated, and start expecting that any character at any time can be revived if they just yell enough about it.

 

There really is no reason for anyone to start cloning Vaylin in the universe of Star Wars.

[fishpeople]

I don't think you understand. This isn't a request for additional story for Vaylin, it's for her character to be made available to the player through a purchase from the cartel market.

[gamephil]

I don't think you understand. This isn't a request for additional story for Vaylin, it's for her character to be made available to the player through a purchase from the cartel market.

 

I begin to suspect that it is understood but not cared about. I mean, it's the title of the thread, it's in the introductory post, and it's been explained more than once, and it just doesn't seem to matter at all.

[Paulsutherland]

Okay ... I'll try to explain it simpler and with a picture!

 

Picture! (Art by Fleeting-Sanity)

 

Cartel Market + Vaylin Companion = Profit & fun! <Repeat for character 'X' 'Y' & 'Z'>

Edited July 21, 2018 by Paulsutherland

[gamephil]

Okay ... I'll try to explain it with simpler and with a picture!

 

Picture! (Art by Fleeting-Sanity)

 

Cartel Market + Vaylin Companion = Profit & fun! <Repeat for character 'X' 'Y' & 'Z'>

 

I picture is worth a thousand words, which is a good thing because a thousand words is the minimum I usually spew out.

[Kiesu]

I understand that you are looking for a CM companion. What I don't understand is with what logic is a dead character becoming a CM companion. I haven't reveived any plausible explanations yet. We haven't gotten any Illogical new companions even as moneygrab companions. So why whould vaylin be the one to break that rule?

 

All the replies you guys are giving me are "we just want X and dont care how".

If that's your unexplained stance to the end... ok, suit yourself. I just strongly disagree with it.

And this comes from someone who likes Vaylin. I just don't like messing with the lore.

[fishpeople]

Well it could be fun for people to have their favorite characters stomping around with them on their quests. Vaylin doesn't have to be the first, she's just the subject for this thread. There are plenty of other characters people may want to play around with Revan? Malgus? Valss?

[gamephil]

Well it could be fun for people to have their favorite characters stomping around with them on their quests. Vaylin doesn't have to be the first, she's just the subject for this thread. There are plenty of other characters people may want to play around with Revan? Malgus? Valss?

 

Eh, I fear if she's not first, or at least in the first lot, she won't be done at all. The odds are already low as it is. But, we'll see. I think those three are much more likely to get such a treatment and characters like Vaylin and Watcher 2 will never be seen.

Edited July 21, 2018 by gamephil

[fishpeople]

Eh, I fear if she's not first, or at least in the first lot, she won't be done at all. The odds are already low as it is. But, we'll see. I think those three are much more likely to get such a treatment and characters like Vaylin and Watcher 2 will never be seen.

 

I just picked those three at random. There was a podcast interview by Vulkk awhile back I watched recently in which they said they were glad Vaylin was popular though was unlikely to return through story. They also joked about making her a force ghost companion. Granted that's not what's being asked for here but it's something, right?

[gamephil]

I just picked those three at random. There was a podcast interview by Vulkk awhile back I watched recently in which they said they were glad Vaylin was popular though was unlikely to return through story. They also joked about making her a force ghost companion. Granted that's not what's being asked for here but it's something, right?

 

Yeah, I figured that they were random from you, but I have seen two of them mentioned as possibilities for some kind of return already multiple times (along with Watcher 2, admittedly, just not as often).

 

I've always said that a ghost would be fine for my needs, if done well enough, because what I really wanted was a less disturbing ending. It would have to be really good, though, if it was an end rather than having her souped up Force ghost blasting things for us because we freed her and she's just that powerful. But a non-story companion seems easier and longer lasting at the same time while hopefully making money.

Edited July 22, 2018 by gamephil

[fishpeople]

Yeah, I figured that they were random from you, but I have seen two of them mentioned as possibilities for some kind of return already multiple times (along with Watcher 2, admittedly, just not as often).

 

I've always said that a ghost would be fine for my needs, if done well enough, because what I really wanted was a less disturbing ending. It would have to be really good, though, if it was an end rather than having her souped up Force ghost blasting things for us because we freed her and she's just that powerful. But a non-story companion seems easier and longer lasting at the same time while hopefully making money.

 

Yeah, it's a shame with what they did to Watcher Two. Bringing her back just to kill her off. She was a good character, I would purchase her too as a companion.

 

A ghost would be cool but I think I would just rather purchase her as a companion directly from the market than wait for a story return.

[gamephil]

A ghost would be cool but I think I would just rather purchase her as a companion directly from the market than wait for a story return.

 

Me, too. The ghost idea, if done well, would just satisfy my wishes for the character. But given the choice between a story continuation where she's a ghost and being able to purchase her as a companion, I'll take the companion every time, think it would be easier to do, and would pay for it.

Edited July 22, 2018 by gamephil

[Paulsutherland]

Me, too. The ghost idea, if done well, would just satisfy my wishes for the character. But given the choice between a story continuation where she's a ghost and being able to purchase her as a companion, I'll take the companion every time, think it would be easier to do, and would pay for it.

 

After Nathema ... any returning character could be killed off within minutes of their return, so I think given the choice I would play it safe with the cartel market too.