GameTwine Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Yea seriously healers OP at current Was fighting a commando who was shielding up/healing/damaging and I just looked dumbfounded. If I had known SWTOR was going old school healer and not WoW healer I'd rolled one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_shades Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Yea seriously healers OP at current Was fighting a commando who was shielding up/healing/damaging and I just looked dumbfounded. If I had known SWTOR was going old school healer and not WoW healer I'd rolled one. Well then stop generalizing and saying healers, when you mean commando, and specify what exactly is OP about him. You sure he wasn't just better, or have you had same experiences with every commando you have met? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_shades Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 After I have read thru the entire thread, I have come to one conclusion. There needs to be a level 40+ bracket. A big problem with PvP war-zones is that you can literally lose games by having 3-4 low levels on your team. They can just as good as their abilities/skill tree will allow them, but they aren't at the same potential as a full level 50. Sage/Sith Inquisitor's is a nasty package. Especially sith inquisitors who have a big multiplier effect. There is a severe problem with PvP in general if you can take one or two classes, pile 8 of them on a team for a token player or two and rofl stomp. That is a distinct problem. Now if a higher level bracket is established, these problems will significantly be reduced because of the introduction of players who should know their class at the late stage of the game. Whether or not SI or Sages need a beat stick over the head will become evident there. Too many low levels getting in the way of war zones to make an accurate analysis if something is OP or not. As far as my concern is - bioware needs to implement a bracket and they need to do it soon. It should have been implemented upon launch, it shouldn't be hard to do since it's merely a IF THEN statement determining if a player is equal or higher to level 40. Best post in this thread. I'd say another bracket just for 50s though because the gear they get seems to be more than the advertized 10%. And yes sages can do mean things to lower levels, but at equal level 45+ we take a beating on a regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scelerant Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 For some reason I don't see what the big deal is with sorcs/sages. If I think based on who had the best kill/death ratio in just about every game I played there is usually a bounty hunter or trooper who's on top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratoforce Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Hahahaha. Commandos do NOT have the toolbox that Sages/sorcerers do. Sorry, but that is a flat out lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baskynn Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 It's funny how most people defending the sages have sages/inq as their avatar. i'm calling bias on that, seeing as they're probably inq sages and don't wanna be nerfed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokai Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I mentioned both. This is a team game but even when playing with team work there are occasions where 1 on 1's DO HAPPEN. Thus it is still an important consideration when contemplating overall balance. Fact is, at least imo, that sorc/sage has it's proverbial cake and eats it too by excelling at team play while still being strong in a 1 on 1. And if you ever played an mmo you'd know developers do not balance with 1 vs 1 in mind... are classes in mmos just decimate in small scale pvp, and always will and always have. Mention WoW as an example the rogue class will ANNILATE pretty much anyone in 1 vs 1 situations save very select few classes however in a team setting, they do not fair quite so well, and tend to struggle alot more to do there job. My point is and remains can not mention 1 vs 1 in a team based pvp game, where entire setting is focused around groups. PvP healers HAVE to be able to fight more one person and not die instantly is BY design! We have to be able to stand up and keep team healed or ourselves during focus fire events. In this game healers also rely on tanks a bit more and is my big point... Alot goes into pvp... and gathering all data and facts alot to consider... do they have gaurd on them? are you taunted? who do you have as back up? do you have a healer? Is sage/Sorc strong? yes no doubt about it they are EXTREAMLY verstile... but are not unkillable god like beings... in fact go even futher and say they are NOTHING compared to a well played aoe healing BH... a good melee can shut a sage down by simply standing on them and spamming interupts because we have ABSOLUTELY no way to heal if we cant cast/channel. Untill are premades... and competitive pvp matches no way we can determine who is strong and who is weak yet because PUGs are dumb... plain and simple. Personally think core of problem is that sage/sorcs use same stats to heal as do damage making it to easy to hybrid damage deal/heal but thats just my opinion and sure competitive players will in future figure out all kinks in system. get to 50 get gear wait for premades to be able to be made then develop and opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyrat Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I am not sure how they balance out at 50, but what I find funny is that I just finished reading a thread that stated that they were pathetically weak a few minutes ago. I was considering rerolling. Now the only thing I know is that I can't make a judgement based on these threads. One player says OP the next says UP. Meh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_shades Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) Hahahaha. Commandos do NOT have the toolbox that Sages/sorcerers do. Sorry, but that is a flat out lie. Can commandos not do their healing on the run though? That is their big advantage. In pvp being able to perform abilities on the run is huge. Not saying that makes one better than the other, just a trade off. Also heavy armor, although I don't know exactly how helpfull that is, you have to be less squishy. I may play one next so will get a good comparison. Edited December 29, 2011 by Sgt_shades Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazelmax Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I find them extremely hard to kill because they have the CC abilities that last a pretty long time and with no real way to get out of these CC's you can have you and another teammate killed by just the one guy. The abilities should just have a damage reduction because their ranged attacks definitely are pretty over powered. Wasting through 1/3rd of my health in a single attack, and i Play a Sith marauder, with about 12k health in the PvP zones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_shades Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I find them extremely hard to kill because they have the CC abilities that last a pretty long time and with no real way to get out of these CC's you can have you and another teammate killed by just the one guy. The abilities should just have a damage reduction because their ranged attacks definitely are pretty over powered. Wasting through 1/3rd of my health in a single attack, and i Play a Sith marauder, with about 12k health in the PvP zones. You talking Sages or commandos? Sage have some CC, but 4sec stun isnt long. Sure if its 2 on 1, jsut as any 2 vs 1 combo, you'll get owned. Healing specced Sage's damage is pretty weak. Although their AE can do some damage if ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraKOF Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I find them extremely hard to kill because they have the CC abilities that last a pretty long time and with no real way to get out of these CC's you can have you and another teammate killed by just the one guy. The abilities should just have a damage reduction because their ranged attacks definitely are pretty over powered. Wasting through 1/3rd of my health in a single attack, and i Play a Sith marauder, with about 12k health in the PvP zones. Same problem i'm finding on my Marauder when we finally do close the gap we get CC'ed while they heal up or we are pretty much dead before we get a fourth hit out, and they say we are the DPS class . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrechor Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 It's funny how most people defending the sages have sages/inq as their avatar. i'm calling bias on that, seeing as they're probably inq sages and don't wanna be nerfed. I know, I'ts surely a coincidence though m8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Hahahaha. Commandos do NOT have the toolbox that Sages/sorcerers do. Sorry, but that is a flat out lie. That's probably something to do with the fact that commandos do 3x the damage. Do you know how balance works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratoforce Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 That's probably something to do with the fact that commandos do 3x the damage. Do you know how balance works? We don't do 3x the damage either. It is called AoEing people on objectives. My mortar rounds in full PvP gear crits for maybe 1.5k~ at level 50. My heals only crit for 2.2k-2.5k. And Commandos 'on the move' heal has a 20 second cooldown, and a 2 minute cooldown and heal less than the fast heal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rademach Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I'm not sure about everything in the post, but I have to agree that they need a nerf. I've spent the evening running into players running around in pairs just ganking people. I know its a pvp server, but the thing that put me over the edge was running into a pair of sorcerers and being taken from 100 to 0 in chain ccs. It's far from balanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 We don't do 3x the damage either. It is called AoEing people on objectives. My mortar rounds in full PvP gear crits for maybe 1.5k~ at level 50. My heals only crit for 2.2k-2.5k. And Commandos 'on the move' heal has a 20 second cooldown, and a 2 minute cooldown and heal less than the fast heal. Uhhh? Hey I played a Mercenary in beta. Mercenaries do at LEAST 2x the single target damage of a sorc/sage. Much more burst too. On my Mercenary I cannot even begin to tell you how many times I killed someone from 70-80% to 0 in 2 gcds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratoforce Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Uhhh? Hey I played a Mercenary in beta. Mercenaries do at LEAST 2x the single target damage of a sorc/sage. Much more burst too. On my Mercenary I cannot even begin to tell you how many times I killed someone from 70-80% to 0 in 2 gcds. And? Mercenary isn't Commando. This also isn't Beta. Mercenaries that are healing spec do no damage to me in warzones just as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 And? Mercenary isn't Commando. Do not post ever again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KorwinOfAmber Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I play sorc and honestly just facepalm at people whining about Sorc, level brackets, expertise - whatever. Sorc is far from OP and theres really nothing preventing you from doing good in warzones on any class, but your own lack of skill. Decided to take a break with Sorc and roll BH to test it. First ever warzone after dinged lvl 10 and got advanced class, first ever pvp fight as BH. Total play time with a class about a hour. http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/8504/screenshot2011122819191.jpg All i can say is, that people coming on forums whining about classes are just generally lack ability to learn their classes and play. And weather the classes would get nerfed or buffed - it does not matter. You will still die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herculieas Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 The only people who want the Sorc/Sage nerfed are the ones who have no idea what their mechanics are, and so they can't counter them and make outlandish claims about OP they are. I'd be seriously disappointed in Bioware if the Sage/Sorc got a nerfed. It's the most balanced class ATM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_Waltfeld Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 The only people who want the Sorc/Sage nerfed are the ones who have no idea what their mechanics are, and so they can't counter them and make outlandish claims about OP they are. I'd be seriously disappointed in Bioware if the Sage/Sorc got a nerfed. It's the most balanced class ATM. By all means, make a guide for each republic class on how to kill inquisitors. I'm all ears if you got ways. the only way I know how is to use my cryo grenade and try to grav round them to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratoforce Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Do not post ever again. I'll post as much as I want. Just cause something is a mirror class, doesn't mean one class isn't overlooked, or something on the opposite class isn't doing higher damage. Mercenary always did more damage than commando in beta. It is completely different in release. So you don't talk. Sorcerers/Sages got tons of utility, TONS more than Commandos/Mercenaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herculieas Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 By all means, make a guide for each republic class on how to kill inquisitors. I'm all ears if you got ways. the only way I know how is to use my cryo grenade and try to grav round them to death.Well, they have no burst. Their damage is all sustained. Kill 'em quick, honestly. And you should have your interrupt binded to a key you can tap quick. Save your CC for when they try to sprint away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caeliux Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 So you don't talk. Sorcerers/Sages got tons of utility, TONS more than Commandos/Mercenaries. Don't ever think you need to post again, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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