First non-Human on Dark Council: Lord Kallig or Darth Karrid

[Ylliarus]

So I have been re-reading the "Annihilation" novel, which I can greatly recommend, and I have realised something that I hadn't before: the book happens after Malgus, so logically that means that Darth Imperius/Occlus/Nox is on the Dark Council. However, not only are they nowhere to be seen which kind of makes sense I guess, but there is a fuss about letting Darth Karrid on the Dark Council because she was an alien. Now, this makes me wonder, was Lord Kallig the first non-Human on the Dark Council or was it Darth Karrid?

 

If it was Lord Kallig this would mean that their "canonical" race on SWTOR is an alien one. This would make a lot of sense as an alien Inquisitor gets a lot of unique dialogue throughout their story.

However, if it was Darth Karrid, then that implies that Lord Kallig was canonically a Human or Sith Pureblood, which would kind of make an alien Sith Inquisitor feel weird. But then again, Darth Nox is the canonical version of the Inq and we still can go for Imperius or Occlus.

 

Still, I do wonder what the canonical answer is, was Kallig the first or Karrid?

Edited June 15, 2017 by Ylliarus

[SteveTheCynic]

None of the above. It's all Legends.

 

And no, Nox isn't the canonical Inq. You can make an equally strong case that the canonical version is Darth Imperius, since Captain Fora on Darth Marr's flagship greets insta-60 Inqs as Darth Imperius at the beginning of KotFE Chapter I.

 

For anything where the player can choose (e.g. the species and sex of a particular class, or the light/dark leanings, or whatever), there is in effect NO canonical version, even if the broad-strokes stories of SWTOR were treated as canonical, which they aren't.

Edited June 15, 2017 by SteveTheCynic

[Ylliarus]

None of the above. It's all Legends.

 

Hence why I wrote "canon", as in, the SWTOR canon the fact that SWTOR, sadly, is Legends I am painfully well aware off. I meant it in the canon of the game, not the overall SW universe.

 

As to the canonical Inq, I do go along with what Wookiepedia says. There Darth Nox, aka Dark Side playthrough, is the game's canon. But I agree, it could be argued Imperius is the canonical name due to the level 60 token thingy.

Edited June 15, 2017 by Ylliarus

[SteveTheCynic]

Hence why I wrote "canon", as in, the SWTOR canon the fact that SWTOR, sadly, is Legends I am painfully well aware off. I meant it in the canon of the game, not the overall SW universe.

 

As to the canonical Inq, I do go along with what Wookiepedia says. There Darth Nox, aka Dark Side playthrough, is the game's canon. But I agree, it could be argued Imperius is the canonical name due to the level 60 token thingy.

There's a case to be made that what Wookieepedia says is no more than that: what Wookieepedia says. Even Wookieepedia kinda says that, with the disclaimer that what they are saying reflects option X in-game.

 

On the question of "canon" versus "legends", my remark *was* meant to be interpreted as firmly tongue in cheek...

 

On a more serious note...

 

I think this whole question of the "definitive" version of a choice-laden in-game story is, in essence, meaningless. There *isn't* a definitive version. It's definitive that the Republic Chancellor is Dorian Janarus at the beginning of Chapter Three of the class stories, and Leontyne Saresh at the end (all the stories that say anything at all about the Chancellor agree on this), but there is no one definitive ("canon") path between the two points.

[cool-dude]

So I have been re-reading the "Annihilation" novel, which I can greatly recommend, and I have realised something that I hadn't before: the book happens after Malgus, so logically that means that Darth Imperius/Occlus/Nox is on the Dark Council. However, not only are they nowhere to be seen which kind of makes sense I guess, but there is a fuss about letting Darth Karrid on the Dark Council because she was an alien. Now, this makes me wonder, was Lord Kallig the first non-Human on the Dark Council or was it Darth Karrid?

 

If it was Lord Kallig this would mean that their "canonical" race on SWTOR is an alien one. This would make a lot of sense as an alien Inquisitor gets a lot of unique dialogue throughout their story.

However, if it was Darth Karrid, then that implies that Lord Kallig was canonically a Human or Sith Pureblood, which would kind of make an alien Sith Inquisitor feel weird. But then again, Darth Nox is the canonical version of the Inq and we still can go for Imperius or Occlus.

 

You also have the fact that alien races, Zabrak specifically, get special dialogue in the inq story.

Still, I do wonder what the canonical answer is, was Kallig the first or Karrid?

 

Kalig has to be an alien considering he came from outside Sith space to learn the ways of the darkside, and was treated like a leper by Tulak Horde until he beat Tulaks top general in a duel. Also, considering you start the kotfe expansion as darth imperiouis, i'd say the light-side inquisitor is canon to Bioware. A good guy born more powerful than any force-user around them, and who happens to of been raised in Sith space, as well as belong to a once powerful Sith family, makes for a more interesting story. DS inq is sort of one dimensional.

Edited June 15, 2017 by cool-dude

[SteveTheCynic]

Kalig has to be an alien considering he came from outside Sith space to learn the ways of the darkside, and was treated like a leper by Tulak Horde until he beat Tulaks top general in a duel. Also, considering you start the kotfe expansion as darth imperiouis, i'd say the light-side inquisitor is canon to Bioware. A good guy born more powerful than any force-user around them, and who happens to of been raised in Sith space, as well as belong to a once powerful Sith family, makes for a more interesting story. DS inq is sort of one dimensional.

By 'in-game" standards, "alien" means "neither human nor (in the Empire) PBS with a special exception, perhaps, for cyborgs who are just damaged humans". It doesn't mean "not from round here"(1). A Rattataki, for example, is "alien filth" as far as Major Bessiker's son is concerned (the less said about this ungrateful wretch, the better, thanks), and non-humans can respond to Nik the Whiner on Coruscant with dialogue that reflects their non-human status. It isn't clear where a Rattataki player character is from, although Kaliyo seems to have reason to think that a Rattataki Agent isn't from Rattatak.(2)

 

(1) If "alien" meant "not from round here", then *all* Bounty Hunter characters would be "alien filth" since they are all non-Imperials, and say so repeatedly during the class story, and both Darth Arkous and Darth Marr mention this point.

 

(2) I'm inclined to think that this is an oversight in the story rather than an explicit statement.

 

So Kallig was an alien in the sense of "outsider" rather than the modern "alien filth" sense, although he might have been both.

 

And I wouldn't want to regard Bioware's rather arbitrary set of choices in the structure of the insta-6X character default choices as anything but arbitrary choices. (And DS Inq may be a bit one-dimensional - a subject for another time - but it *is* immensely fun.)

[FlameYOL]

It depends on whether or not you play the SI as alien. You join the dark council before the failure at Corellia so Darth Hadra was still alive by that point, after her death Karrid takes over so you're already a councilor by that point. Now if she is the first alien to join the council I guess it depends if you ARE. BioWare most likely will never make a canon version of all 8 class stories due to how Revan was received so the answer depends on headcanon.

[kepeskvaeri]

There is no mention of any of the 8 main characters in the books as individuals . The hero of tython is not mentioned even if he dshould be, barsenthor should also be in there some where if we went with logic the 2 most powerfull or at least most famous jedi at the time should have been in on the operation of eleminating the single most dangerous threat in the empire. The reason? because Drew could not involve them because that would force him to make some choices about the class, gender and race that would not have suited the players and readers.

My favourite inq is a LS chiss madness sorceress and my warrior is a gray human maruader but every player character comes in its own shapes and sizes and unless Bioware or anyone else eans to make a game or write a book that takes place between the old republic and the rise of Darth Ruin (a very large time-gap some 1700 years) we probably will not get a canon race or gender for our characters.