Thoughts on KOTET chapters (spoilers).

[Aowin]

KotET was much better than KotFE but in essence that wasn't very hard. The sad thing is that KotFE had a number of filler chapters that could've been used to make the story more interesting.

 

I agree with people who speak of Scourge and Kira but also Sith Warriors as the Wrath should get something in the story but this is the issue with a single storyline.

 

And oh, why the hell would my sniper want to be an Empress?

 

And as much as I did like KotET better than KotFE, my sith inquisitor has a new name for Valkorion: Zash II ....been there done that. Valkorion in KotET just completely gave himself up, but of course my character still had no clue...

 

Oh well, it was certainly much more enjoyable than KotFE, but this game has come to an end for me. I played the story through twice (dark and light) and thanks to GC I have no desire to do anything else in this game anymore. The worst decision they ever made was to give up on class stories, but lucky for SWTOR apparently there's a whole tribe of people out there that are very easily pleased.

 

KOTET was only better in pacing. KOTFE was superior in scope, context, and depth. Nobody would have complained about the monthly chapters had they been executed more effectively. Kaliyo's was admittedly boring but the quality, for the most part, went up after that.

 

For lore reasons, it's a storytelling blunder that Scourge and Kira weren't in the story. I disagree with regard to the Sith Warrior having more of a role for the very fact that the new Emperor's Wrath doesn't really know Valkorion. You free him on Voss in the class story and that's really the extent of the relationship. Perhaps a few lines where Valkorion recognizes you as the Wrath more would have been nice.

 

I definitely think that forcing everybody to be a peacekeeper/emperor was the wrong move. I also recognize that BioWare can't have endings deviating too much as that would cause a problem story-wise for future content. Perhaps what BioWare could have done is allow the player to choose an emperor/empress to represent them on the eternal throne without the player, himself, being the emperor/peacekeeper.

 

Part of the reason I like KOTET less is because of how BioWare butchered Valkorion's character. He went from having nuance and complexity in KOTFE to being cookie cutter and predictable in KOTET.

 

It's not as if BioWare wanted to give up on class story. It financially was impractical. The amount of time that would go into eight, individual class stories with a decent amount of content (at least one chapter if not more) would be an impossible task. Honestly, BioWare should have never done class stories and did faction stories instead. Managing just two stories instead of eight would have been far more reasonable and the game may have developed differently as a result.

[Aowin]

So more people can wait until the final chapter and then subscribe to get it all? I guess that could help boost numbers for one particular month if they need to impress their investors.

 

You also forget those players would miss out on all the subscriber rewards and any potential bonus chapter. BioWare could create even more incentives for players to remain subscribed, which is what they essentially did with Galactic Command forcing you to subscribe if you want to progress through the game for gear. The game really is not playable anymore if you are not a subscriber in terms of endgame.

[Aowin]

The ending was a massive disappointment. 'o btw nothing you did mattered, uniting the entire galaxy didn't mean a dang thing because now the empire and republic are preparing for war again, at least until the next ancient evil awakens and you unite to defeat them too'.

 

Don't get me started on the whole 'twist' of Valkorion betraying you. So predictable I saw it coming from day 1 of KOTFE.

 

Yep. Nothing really changed. BioWare spent so much time taking Vaylin off the throne and giving it to the Outlander, nothing else was actually resolved. The story was just far too predictable and superficial. BioWare ruined Valkorion's character turning him into a Saturday morning villain like he was previously as Vitiate.

 

For all the hype about how KOTET was meant to be a more refined and better-crafted story, it was inferior compared to KOTFE in my eyes. Now we'll have to wait a year for new story to see if BioWare redeems itself. I don't know if remaining subscribed that long is really worth the wait, especially if we aren't even getting subscriber rewards on a monthly basis now.

[CorellianWannabe]

You also forget those players would miss out on all the subscriber rewards and any potential bonus chapter. BioWare could create even more incentives for players to remain subscribed, which is what they essentially did with Galactic Command forcing you to subscribe if you want to progress through the game for gear. The game really is not playable anymore if you are not a subscriber in terms of endgame.

 

Considering the rewards have been cosmetic, it's not a big loss for many players until now. Another companion (that I would have to grind influence for) when I already have about 2 dozen? Why bother?

 

Actually the game really isn't playable even if you are a subscriber. Grind for hours to have a few chances at a gear upgrade? Not feasible for a lot of players, especially since the game tried and discarded this system 5 years ago.

 

I still don't see why the outlander and friends think Valk is finished. He already demonstrated that he could 'hide' in the outlander's mind without anyone being aware of it. For all anyone knows he's still there regaining his power until the stresses of sitting on the throne make the outlander more vulnerable to control.

 

Of course, my Inquisitor would wonder why none of the OTHER ghosts in his head ever noticed Valk, but I don't expect even the slightest acknowledgement of previous stories any longer.

[Tsillah]

KOTET was only better in pacing. KOTFE was superior in scope, context, and depth. Nobody would have complained about the monthly chapters had they been executed more effectively. Kaliyo's was admittedly boring but the quality, for the most part, went up after that.

 

I feel you're being entirely too generous to KotFE. It was full of enormous plot holes that were holding together this depth you refer to and I could see right through it.

 

The chapter with Marr and Satele where you create the new weapon for example was a complete waste of a chapter. It didn't add anything to the actual story. In the end you didn't need the weapon against Arcann and I still to this day don't know what I supposedly learned there because they don't explain anything more than you have to go beyond dark and light. It had no substance.

 

KotFE was just not going anywhere except this confrontation with Arcann which ended in him running away, or rather Senay rescuing him from me. It was a completely unsatisfactory end to the season and could've been avoided if they hadn't focused on that aspect of chasing Arcann down so much and given more space for actual story depth.

 

Also Valkorion being a retard who couldn't make up his mind on whether we were beyond destiny or had a destiny to follow just told me the writer couldn't have a very high intelligence which Valkorion clearly was supped to have. How else could he have survived for so long?

 

Now KotET has some strong story parts with chapter 2 and also the visit on Iokath and Nathema. There was some depth there but admittedly they still only scratched the surface of what they could've done. They rushed it but at least it didn't have painfully obvious plot holes and my character was at least more in the spot light instead of Koth. I could actually make some real decisions there too. So detail it as you want but I just enjoyed KotET more than KotFE.

 

They really just should've made Kotor III and not bother with making it an MMO. I think most people would've been much happier because the story would've been much better to begin with.

[Aowin]

Considering the rewards have been cosmetic, it's not a big loss for many players until now. Another companion (that I would have to grind influence for) when I already have about 2 dozen? Why bother?

 

Actually the game really isn't playable even if you are a subscriber. Grind for hours to have a few chances at a gear upgrade? Not feasible for a lot of players, especially since the game tried and discarded this system 5 years ago.

 

I still don't see why the outlander and friends think Valk is finished. He already demonstrated that he could 'hide' in the outlander's mind without anyone being aware of it. For all anyone knows he's still there regaining his power until the stresses of sitting on the throne make the outlander more vulnerable to control.

 

Of course, my Inquisitor would wonder why none of the OTHER ghosts in his head ever noticed Valk, but I don't expect even the slightest acknowledgement of previous stories any longer.

 

It wasn't as big of a loss before (although the bonus chapter was great), but it is now as you actually cannot play the game if you are not subscribed.

 

Galactic Command and the pitfalls of RNG are for another discussion. The point is you MUST subscribe if you want to progress in endgame.

 

I doubt that Valkorion is dead. Supposedly, he could only be contained or extinguished by his father's holocron. Valkorion obviously destroyed it. All that we accomplished was destroying Valkorion in the Outlander's mind, but I seriously doubt that means he's gone for good. He may be permanently gone, but then BioWare used a deus ex machina moment with no explanation.

 

Considering KOTFE/KOTET was really written for the Jedi Knight class, and Valkorion even acknowledges their long history together, I wouldn't expect any other classes to ever be as relevant.

[Aowin]

I feel you're being entirely too generous to KotFE. It was full of enormous plot holes that were holding together this depth you refer to and I could see right through it.

 

The chapter with Marr and Satele where you create the new weapon for example was a complete waste of a chapter. It didn't add anything to the actual story. In the end you didn't need the weapon against Arcann and I still to this day don't know what I supposedly learned there because they don't explain anything more than you have to go beyond dark and light. It had no substance.

 

KotFE was just not going anywhere except this confrontation with Arcann which ended in him running away, or rather Senay rescuing him from me. It was a completely unsatisfactory end to the season and could've been avoided if they hadn't focused on that aspect of chasing Arcann down so much and given more space for actual story depth.

 

Also Valkorion being a retard who couldn't make up his mind on whether we were beyond destiny or had a destiny to follow just told me the writer couldn't have a very high intelligence which Valkorion clearly was supped to have. How else could he have survived for so long?

 

Now KotET has some strong story parts with chapter 2 and also the visit on Iokath and Nathema. There was some depth there but admittedly they still only scratched the surface of what they could've done. They rushed it but at least it didn't have painfully obvious plot holes and my character was at least more in the spot light instead of Koth. I could actually make some real decisions there too. So detail it as you want but I just enjoyed KotET more than KotFE.

 

They really just should've made Kotor III and not bother with making it an MMO. I think most people would've been much happier because the story would've been much better to begin with.

 

I enjoyed the first nine chapters of KOTFE. I thought BioWare did a great job. Admittedly, where they faltered was on some of the monthly chapters.

 

Chapter XII is ridiculous. I liked the implications of it and what it could mean, but BioWare never took that story any further. It was a waste of time and its inclusion in KOTFE was silly since it ultimately meant nothing. That entire chapter should have had huge implications for the rest of the story. The weapon was a silly gameplay gimmick and I didn't even use mine. Had that chapter been relevant, however, it would have been amazing.

 

I didn't mind Arcann getting away. In fact, we were never promised by the Scions that Arcann would be killed so soon. What the Scions did say is that Arcann would be removed from the throne, and he was. Either way, besides chapter X and XII, I felt the monthly chapters largely held up, even if the pacing was bad at times.

 

There were definitely a lot of contradictions. Going back to Chapter XII, BioWare had some great ideas but they just did not execute on them. Instead of trying to convincingly wrap up this story, they just gave us a half-baked experience with little satisfaction.

 

Honestly, I was irritated by Koth joyriding with the gravestone the entire expansion. Why? Just why? I didn't like Iokath because nothing was explained about SCORPIO's creators and it was just a superficial subplot of a rogue AI gone rampant. Nathema was interesting, but severely underused as Scourge and Revan should have showed up given their history with the planet. I liked the first two chapters of KOTET, but after that it really went downhill fast. I don't see value in choosing who lives or dies as most of those choices are just gimmicks that don't have long term consequences.

 

I disagree with your KotOR III sentiment. Only Obsidian could have done KotOR III in terms of the storytelling. BioWare had no input on KotOR II, thus the Revan book retconned much of what happened in that game. Regardless, the Revan book and the JK class story are KotOR III. I don't mind BioWare doing an MMO, but I really do believe it should focus on its strengths more, such as the story, rather than other MMO staples that really are just decent at best.

[Slowpokeking]

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5. Mental defense? Read Drew Karpyshyn's little writing excerpt on the front page. Vaylin could have crushed Senya with the snap of her finger. Vaylin bested the Outlander with ease until Valkorion stepped in. Arcann also was no match for his sister. Especially since Vaylin's power was fully unlocked, nobody should have stood a chance. It was an underwhelming and undeserved victory to move the plot forward. Vaylin was powerful enough to scare Valkorion.

.

 

But Valkorion was able to hold her off plus Arcann and the Outlander. She wasn't that powerful.

 

Vaylin was defeated by Senya and pushed off by the badly injured Arcann in KotFE, I think we lost because Valkorion was behind it. Since his plan was to let us absorb her full power.

Edited December 8, 2016 by Slowpokeking

[Aowin]

But Valkorion was able to hold her off plus Arcann and the Outlander. She wasn't that powerful.

 

Vaylin was defeated by Senya and pushed off by the badly injured Arcann in KotFE, I think we lost because Valkorion was behind it. Since his plan was to let us absorb her full power.

 

Vaylin was bested by Senya in lightsaber combat, not the ability to wield the Force. BioWare makes it explicitly clear that when it comes to the Force, no one rivals Vaylin. Senya just had more experience with a lightsaber, thus she was able to outwit Vaylin and keep her at bay. The problem with Vaylin is she is sadistic and has a massive ego, so she generally holds back in order to torment her victims. Senya explains this with specificity in Drew Karpyshyn's short story.

[Nothing_Shines]

It really needed a third option between Font of All that is Light and Evil Imperial Overlord. How about option C? Tell the eternal fleet and all skytroopers to self destruct and break the back of the eternal empire. Same result of Sith Empire and Republic rearming to resume the old war, and my bounty hunter can go off with Lana Banana to find Mako and be a bounty hunter again. Let Theron take over if he thinks the Alliance is still necessary. My BH seriously couldn't give less of a poodoo after Valky and Co. are all dead finally.

[Aowin]

It really needed a third option between Font of All that is Light and Evil Imperial Overlord. How about option C? Tell the eternal fleet and all skytroopers to self destruct and break the back of the eternal empire. Same result of Sith Empire and Republic rearming to resume the old war, and my bounty hunter can go off with Lana Banana to find Mako and be a bounty hunter again. Let Theron take over if he thinks the Alliance is still necessary. My BH seriously couldn't give less of a poodoo after Valky and Co. are all dead finally.

 

I do agree that we should have had the option to destroy the eternal throne, rendering the entire eternal fleet useless. Of course, such a departure from the other two choices (which are really the same) would have made the story for the nex expansion unwieldy and difficult to write. Thus, we get a forced ending where all choices are really the same with merely a title difference.

 

It would be nice to go back to more personalized class stories, but it's just not going to happen with the limited budget and staff SWTOR has now. At best you can hope returning class companions (hopefully in the next expansion) will add some needed personal flare depending on the class one plays.

[Slowpokeking]

Vaylin was bested by Senya in lightsaber combat, not the ability to wield the Force. BioWare makes it explicitly clear that when it comes to the Force, no one rivals Vaylin. Senya just had more experience with a lightsaber, thus she was able to outwit Vaylin and keep her at bay. The problem with Vaylin is she is sadistic and has a massive ego, so she generally holds back in order to torment her victims. Senya explains this with specificity in Drew Karpyshyn's short story.

 

We were bested by only the lightsaber skill as well. If you take a look your SI never used the superforce attack against her.

[Aowin]

We were bested by only the lightsaber skill as well. If you take a look your SI never used the superforce attack against her.

 

The point still stands that, realistically, the Outlander stood no chance against Vaylin. I just felt the final confrontation was unconvincing and a bit of a let down. Then again, Valkorion also being "destroyed" seemed a bit weak considering it's not explained how or why we should believe he's gone.

[Slowpokeking]

The point still stands that, realistically, the Outlander stood no chance against Vaylin. I just felt the final confrontation was unconvincing and a bit of a let down. Then again, Valkorion also being "destroyed" seemed a bit weak considering it's not explained how or why we should believe he's gone.

 

Why? I was probably the most powerful Dark Counciler, have total of 5 powerful spirits plus my own mega power. Why would I lose to Vaylin for sure?

 

As for the JK, he was able to defeat the Emperor and only grew to be stronger in KoTET, why wouldn't he defeat Vaylin?

[Aowin]

Why? I was probably the most powerful Dark Counciler, have total of 5 powerful spirits plus my own mega power. Why would I lose to Vaylin for sure?

 

As for the JK, he was able to defeat the Emperor and only grew to be stronger in KoTET, why wouldn't he defeat Vaylin?

 

You consumed five powerful Sith Lords. Valkorion has consumed multiple planets and fears his daughter. Darth Nox is strong, but Vaylin is in an entirely different league.

 

The Jedi Knight was able to defeat one of the Emperor's bodies, but he could not destroy him. I really think you underestimate just how much of a threat Vaylin is. Valkorion put a mental leash on her for a reason, for fear that she would surpass him.

[Slowpokeking]

You consumed five powerful Sith Lords. Valkorion has consumed multiple planets and fears his daughter. Darth Nox is strong, but Vaylin is in an entirely different league.

 

The Jedi Knight was able to defeat one of the Emperor's bodies, but he could not destroy him. I really think you underestimate just how much of a threat Vaylin is. Valkorion put a mental leash on her for a reason, for fear that she would surpass him.

 

Valkorion was able to hold off her, Arcann and the Outlander at the same time. Sure Vaylin might have potential, but she was no match for her father when she died.

 

So how could Vaylin erase the Emperor? Valkorion put a leash didn't mean he was weaker, more likely he wanted to use his daughter as a weapon, otherwise he could have easily killed her.

[Aowin]

Valkorion was able to hold off her, Arcann and the Outlander at the same time. Sure Vaylin might have potential, but she was no match for her father when she died.

 

So how could Vaylin erase the Emperor? Valkorion put a leash didn't mean he was weaker, more likely he wanted to use his daughter as a weapon, otherwise he could have easily killed her.

 

Vaylin was being held back due to her mental instability. Also, BioWare wanted to make sure that Arcann and Senya had some action (depending on your choices) in determining Valkorion's fate. Without a doubt, Vaylin was the biggest threat to all of the. Valkorion just happened to know how to pull Vaylin's strings to keep her in line.

 

Valkorion was scared of his daughter's power. He put a leash on her so that she would not one day rise up and take the eternal throne. Valkorion doesn't just kill without purpose. Everything he does for a reason, and he found more use to Vaylin as a tool rather than discarding her at a young age.

[DirtyDiggler]

I'm disappointed in how the game ended. I really wish they would of included our missing companions as well. But I don't want to rule over the alliance, I was hoping I'd get to become the Sith emperor which is disappointing..

[Aowin]

I'm disappointed in how the game ended. I really wish they would of included our missing companions as well. But I don't want to rule over the alliance, I was hoping I'd get to become the Sith emperor which is disappointing..

 

That could still happen considering the Empire and the Republic seem to be gearing up for another conflict. Of course, the Sith Empire just recently allied with the Eternal Alliance, so it would be somewhat strange for Empress Acina to so rapidly change positions.