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Evasion not blocking abilities while the user is stunned?

QuiveringPotato

By QuiveringPotato
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QuiveringPotato

QuiveringPotato

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So, I was dueling a friend playing immortal in DPS gear, and we noticed that I was still getting hit with his ravage (along with force choke, expected) while I had evasion up.

 

New bug? Never noticed this before.

 

Evasion Bug

 

As you can see in the gif, the first two hits of ravage go through my evasion.

 

Additionally, checked this afterwards, and your defense stats do indeed display the same "205%", so I'm assuming this is a bug. If it was intended, it would be at the normal level.

 

We also tested this with Deflection on an assassin and it seemed to suffer the same thing, so is this a new bug? I've never seen this happen before. (60% defense chance with deflection, but we double stunned and spammed auto attack which hits 3 times, and every hit connected, it only started missing once the sin was no longer stunned)

Edited by QuiveringPotato
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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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So, I was dueling a friend playing immortal in DPS gear, and we noticed that I was still getting hit with his ravage (along with force choke, expected) while I had evasion up.

 

New bug? Never noticed this before.

 

Evasion Bug

 

ninja nerf. you finally got your wish to nerf operatives.

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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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I've never seen this in warzones, which is strange, maybe I've never noticed it, but I don't know

 

well. I am sure it's a bug then. You play the class enough to know when it's not working as it did before.

 

Wonder what other bugs are floating around on other classes where people aren't as aware as you are for the ops class to notice them.

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QuiveringPotato

QuiveringPotato

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Its defence mechanic. While CC-d ur defence will be 0, always was like that. Doesn't matter what DCD u poped up dat increase defence chance.

 

Really? Good thing shroud works the same way, then... :rolleyes:

 

EDIT: just tested this, and your defense chance remains the same on your character sheet, so I'm thinking it's a bug.

Edited by QuiveringPotato
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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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I lost in lethality (no time to do damage and skanktank jugg does about the same dmg as fury) 1 time, lost 1 time, but won all times except one in concealment.

 

wow didn't know skank juggs were that good. I just know every time I was in a solo ranked with a skank jugg we won, rofl. Figured it was just because the player was good. :p

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QuiveringPotato

QuiveringPotato

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wow didn't know skank juggs were that good. I just know every time I was in a solo ranked with a skank jugg we won, rofl. Figured it was just because the player was good. :p

 

It's incredibly strong in a 1v1, lol. I basically had to kite and pillar hump the entire time because it was doing so much damage that I couldn't actually afford to stand toe-to-toe for any period of time. I got hit with a 15k crushing blow and I'm in full ranked gear.

 

Additionally, when I had 55% DMG reduction from utilities + revitalizers, I got hit with a 10k ravage tick, lol... #balanced

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catseverywhere

catseverywhere

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wow didn't know skank juggs were that good. I just know every time I was in a solo ranked with a skank jugg we won, rofl. Figured it was just because the player was good. :p

 

Hi, Willow here xP Skank tanks do have high damage output and durability, and, I'm going to say that a DPS geared tank is really good even in the hands of a bad player, in terms of raw numbers, but that doesn't mean that the class will carry the player fully. It makes life really nasty for classes like a marauder (I can't really see a marauder winning easily against the average skank tank... if at all. You'd need a really good marauder to do that.), but a good operative or the such can kill it, if they play it smart. Arvengis was playing smart! (Also the forum name... Quivering potato, jeez xD)

 

E.g. Had 5 duels total with Arvengis in different operative specs. He won 3 out of them, I won 2. Being a skank doesn't remove the fact that you have to try and do counterplay, trade cooldowns, pop things at specific times, and have to deal with people LoS'ing.

 

What makes it really silly is the fact that if he would've not played it like he did and LoS'd/healed/CC'd/used the mobility and toolkit of his class as much as he could, and just charged into a melee burst race? (Which I see a lot of operatives doing in warzones), he would've just died to durability and damage.

 

There isn't really anything atm I can see outdoing a skanktank in raw numbers if both classes have full uptime on each other. (Constantly in the range to do damage to each other, and actually doing damage to each other)

(EDIT: As Arvengis said, the 10k ravage tick. I think that's self-explanatory.)

Edited by catseverywhere
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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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It's incredibly strong in a 1v1, lol. I basically had to kite and pillar hump the entire time because it was doing so much damage that I couldn't actually afford to stand toe-to-toe for any period of time. I got hit with a 15k crushing blow and I'm in full ranked gear.

 

Additionally, when I had 55% DMG reduction from utilities + revitalizers, I got hit with a 10k ravage tick, lol... #balanced

wish I liked playing juggs stopped years ago on my jugg. Maybe I should pull out one of my old juggs and give it a whirl some day, after I stick him in dps gears and change him to tank spec.

 

Does your friend run tank armorings, with all dps mods or does he run the tank spec with pure dps gears even armorings? I assume he has tank armorings but figured I would ask I am curious. :D

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catseverywhere

catseverywhere

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wish I liked playing juggs stopped years ago on my jugg. Maybe I should pull out one of my old juggs and give it a whirl some day, after I stick him in dps gears and change him to tank spec.

 

Does your friend run tank armorings, with all dps mods or does he run the tank spec with pure dps gears even armorings? I assume he has tank armorings but figured I would ask I am curious. :D

I do tank armorings... but I have seen people use DPS armorings for the extra crit to ravage, and damage squeezed out.

 

EDIT: Anyway, on an on-topic point. Evasion should still stop white damage, even while stunned. Its assassin counterpart, force shroud, stops all yellow damage, which is a lot more common, and it stops stuns, which are force/tech abilities. Personally, it feels a little unbalanced (Since you've got a defensive cooldown which doesn't exist anymore because of one CC happening)... And when fighting most operatives, just stunning them during their evasion became a reflex at this point.

Edited by catseverywhere
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helpmewin

helpmewin

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As deflection and saber ward tho. If dat didn't worked as needed 5 years adress this issue. Evasion never was assasin's shroud counter part. This is 2 different classes with different mechanics.

 

As for skanks - some players use mara set to get auto-crit dispatch.

Edited by helpmewin
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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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I do tank armorings... but I have seen people use DPS armorings for the extra crit to ravage, and damage squeezed out.

 

EDIT: Anyway, on an on-topic point. Evasion should still stop white damage, even while stunned. Its assassin counterpart, force shroud, stops all yellow damage, which is a lot more common, and it stops stuns, which are force/tech abilities. Personally, it feels a little unbalanced (Since you've got a defensive cooldown which doesn't exist anymore because of one CC happening)... And when fighting most operatives, just stunning them during their evasion became a reflex at this point.

 

thanks for stopping in the forums and giving more detail on skank juggs. Yes, we all know who "QuiveringPotato" is in the game, who doesn't know Arvengis? :p

 

That's the difference between good players and great players, when someone can react to a defensive like evasion and manage a stun in there. I bet the majority of players do not manage a stun on evasion.

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catseverywhere

catseverywhere

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thanks for stopping in the forums and giving more detail on skank juggs. Yes, we all know who "QuiveringPotato" is in the game, who doesn't know Arvengis? :p

 

That's the difference between good players and great players, when someone can react to a defensive like evasion and manage a stun in there. I bet the majority of players do not manage a stun on evasion.

Never saw the forum name before, and found it funny, that's all xD

Also, it's really not that hard to squeeze in stuns during evasion... It's a big green warning bubble.

As for the people who know Arvengis, well, I didn't know him until we ran into each other in a flashpoint xD I'm pretty new to Ebon Hawk and only recently came back to SW:TOR in 4.0, from a long hiatus. It was actually really nice to have dueling practice+chat with him and all the sorts, he's a cool person!

 

As deflection and saber ward tho. If dat didn't worked as needed 5 years adress this issue. Evasion never was assasin's shroud counter part. This is 2 different classes with different mechanics.

 

As for skanks - some players use mara set to get auto-crit dispatch.

 

Evasion technically is a counterpart/comparable to Force Shroud. Both are immunity abilities, that last a baseline of three seconds. One protects against white damage, the other against yellow damage. The classes might have mechanics which are generally different, but if you compare the two abilities alone, they have the same function, that of a defensive cooldown. If an assassin is being slammed down with force/tech damage, they can pop force shroud. If an operative is being hit with white damage, they can pop evasion. That's what makes the abilities similar enough to be called counterparts.

 

You can argue otherwise, but if you use the above logic, both abilities are close enough in function and execution to fall under the same category. Just like Adrenaline Rush and Focused defense are self-healing abilities which kick in when you're taking large amounts of damage and under a certain HP threshold, and will heal you, even if they're not identical (Although PT's and juggernauts have a different playstyle), or deliverance and underworld medicine are both hardcast burst heals. (Although sorcs and operatives have a different playstyle.)

 

Evasion should still stop white damage, even when stunned. And this is, well.. coming from the person who's doing the stunning on people using evasion. It just feels like they wasted a cooldown, since the numbers are popping over their head through their green safety bubble.

Edited by catseverywhere
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helpmewin

helpmewin

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They aren't. If srsly i don't want to argue with specialists in balance/mechanic terms what actually every first in this forums is. If u sirprised after 5 years dat melee/range defence while CC-d is 0, so gratz it was a news for me a long time ago too. Edited by helpmewin
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catseverywhere

catseverywhere

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They aren't. If srsly i don't want to argue with specialists in balance/mechanic terms what actually every first in this forums is. If u sirprised after 5 years dat melee/range defence while CC-d is 0, so gratz it was a news for me a long time ago too.

I never said I was the one surprised. I've known it for a long while now, and showed it to Arvengis during our duels. He was the one who started the thread, I agree that it (A CC rendering evasion useless) shouldn't be happening. In the given context, you're running based off of assumptions and conjencture (about me not knowing that evasion could be turned off by a stun), and just saying that "they aren't" (in the case of evasion and force shroud) without putting forward a logical submission to support it doesn't help either (Since, if you would prove that they aren't, beyond reasonable doubt, everyone would likely agree with it), but otherwise, what you believe is your choice, and I'm not going to stop you.

Edited by catseverywhere
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helpmewin

helpmewin

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Word "immune" was in shroud description to remind. It was converted (description) to 100% and then to 200% chance to resist. Evasion was 100% melee and ranged defence chance - then it comes to 200% and started to work as shroud purge. Why bw summed many conc abilities similar to decetion idk. And how evasion should work in "logical sense as shroud counter part" - i have no answer too - this should be adressed to combat team. Edited by helpmewin
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catseverywhere

catseverywhere

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Yeah, it is an issue for the combat team to address. It's why this thread was created, basically ^^"

Anyway, hope I didn't offend you. I didn't mean to do that, if I did... I just like constructive/critical arguments. Helps bring out good, although different points of view on things :D

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Lhancelot

Lhancelot

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I just like constructive/critical arguments. Helps bring out good, although different points of view on things :D

Well, you will love the PVP forums... That's all we do here is argue. Constructive and critical? Hmm not sure about that part. :D

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