Please don't let GSF end up like ground pvp

[Blizzax]

Just wanted to add some observations from server hopping and seeing differing GSF populations.

 

There are some servers with regular group building. Most of this is driven by GSF focused guilds.

Throughout the primetime there are one to three groups of four people. In general these groups are made of better than average players.

Matches on these servers are rarely competitive. More often they are one-sided - although the faction that wins changes as some groups switch sides to try doing some balancing.

 

On some other servers there is no regular grouping of players - due to the lack of GSF focused guilds. Nonetheless there are good and even ace pilots. On rare occasions one or two groups of two players can be found.

On those servers more matches tend to be competitive.

So why is that?

 

I don't think the solo queueing pilots or wingman teams of two are more motivated to even things out than the guild groups of four on other servers are.

But I think balancing works better with smaller entities willing to balance (the number crunching veterans of this forum might back this^^).

 

So, as an idea for those regular groups already trying to balance: why not test using more groups of two instead of fewer groups of four? This could increase the number of competitive matches.

 

An addition for those easily offended: this is not something I demand of specific people or the community. This is just an idea.

[ShallowHal]

Whether good pilots group or solo queue is a trivial issue when all the good pilots are flying on the same faction.

 

When things are lopsided match after match in favor of one side, it would be to the benefit of everyone if half of the good pilots stayed Imp and half went Pub. That way, you would at least have the chance of evenly matched teams being pitted against each other.

 

Despon

 

Bumped because I couldn't possibly say it any better.

 

To piggyback, if one faction is rolling the other and there is a four man group that is doing most of the heavy lifting, split that group in half and send half of it to the other faction. I know the frequent groupers say "But I'm just flying with friends!" If you're fighting against each other, aren't you still flying with friends? (it's just that half of those friend are trying to kill you, which might affect the friendship).

[SeCKSEgai]

I felt the need to revisit this.

 

It's already like ground pvp - so that's no longer contested. Just like ground, there are fewer players active during the mornings so the republic isn't at a huge numbers disadvantage, but at the cost of slow or non-existent pops. Even this morning I had to swap sides just to give imp side a fighting chance against the group that was running pubside. Did I have to? Not at all, but it motivated a few players to play a little big longer which meant a few more pops that would probably not have happened.

 

I think what really annoys me is when people don't acknowledge that they group to gain an advantage. I've never seen someone whisper a random player whose died 10-15 times to invite them to group. Sure, you want to play with friends, friends who are capable and increase your chances of winning or at least the chance of getting a random who's trying it for the first time.

 

Grouping is supposed to be fun right? You don't see random new pilots who just got rocked 50-2 group together and come back over and over for your personal enjoyment right? People are only willing to endure so much "unpleasantness" before they quit. We already know most people don't come back after the intro quest. It's silly to assume there are always going to be people willing to get demolished purely for our own pleasure.

 

One of the arguments someone told me was that as I do not pay for their game, I am not entitled to "dictate" how they play. While that's entirely true, GSF isn't restricted by the paywall aside from an even more painful req gain. More importantly, you can't play at all if there aren't people willing to play with you. Just the other day I had a 12v12 end early because teams were so one-sided that enough people left my side for it to end just minutes from it starting. Normally in that situation, some other folks end up joining in after waiting in queue. Not anymore.

 

Yeah, of course there are people you want to play with. It's an mmo, grouping is supposed to be the "thing". You can still compete against one another and still be playing with each other. In fact, you would think people would strive to play against their equals. On voice comms? Now you can talk trash while chasing each other around!

 

But really, I get that people enjoy the company of others and working together for a common goal. But can't that goal be to push each other to be better instead of looking for a dominating win? Don't get me wrong, everyone wants to win.

 

I think most players would agree that the best games are the ones you win by a sliver. Notice I still said win. Not only do you get the satisfaction of the win, but the rush of competition and feeling like everything you do as even an individual matters. When you barely manage a win over your competition, you've constantly been under pressure and you know your team had to do their best to reach that outcome, regardless of their personal skill level.

 

If you're on the losing side of said match? You know that maybe if you had done something a little differently or been a little faster or more accurate that could have made the difference. Then again you could also carry the bronze mindset of LoL and blame everyone on the team except for oneself too. Notably, there's the hope that the next match could very well be a win.

 

When players think they have a solid chance of winning, they try again. When players feel like they've lost from the start, they generally just don't bother. The whole reason we have a "harby shuffle" is that people would rather swap to the strong side in hopes of being paired with the strong players versus betting that teams will miraculously even out. Afterall, that's why you're far more likely to see imp v imp vs pub v pub on ground, and why ranked imp can go for hours with ranked pub virtually nonexistent.

 

With some people, their minds are set regardless of what is said.

 

I still stroke the ego a bit gettin double digits kills in matches where I know I don't have to. I've also held back only to be punished for it when someone backfills after a ragequit. You can't please everybody, that's simply reality. But in the end, you can't dominate anything if it doesn't pop.

 

Final Thoughts

 

When I used to do ground pvp in the morning pubside, there was this one guy that always left as soon as it even looked like we might lose. It became a running joke to see how long he'd stay before jumping ship. While we did lose some of the ones he left, it was also pretty regular that his replacement helped secure the win. Now while I think that one was too extreme, I've also come to realize that he wasn't completely off base.

 

Said player valued his/her time, if there was no enjoyment, there was no complaint, just an end of participation. If a pilot feels that things are continuously one-sided with no effort being made or consideration being given to you and your time, just leave and don't participate. Press that escape button and click exit battle. If people aren't going to have respect for you and your time, don't give it to them.

 

If the enemy team all show 5 ships and your team is mostly if not all 2s, you may miss out but it's not as if you'd enjoy that match anyway. If you're a newer or less experienced pilot, being against overwhelming odds won't really teach you anything because you'll blow up too fast regardless. If you're very experienced but your team is cannon fodder, it just allows all the enemy team's skilled pilots to focus you instead.

 

Just don't be that guy (or girl) that insults teammates and quits at the first sign of a possible loss.

 

So for those of you looking for a competitive experience only to be repeatedly disappointed - don't complain - just voice your protest silently by choosing to not participate. If you berate or insult folks, they just feel justified. Save yourself the frustration and eventual bitterness. Some people aren't willing to accept that there's a problem if people are willing to line up to be cannon fodder.

[Krixarcs]

Well stated raiyne, everyone listen up to this guy. TBH he's making a good case to be a new addition of the Kronies

[ShallowHal]

I've never seen someone whisper a random player whose died 10-15 times to invite them to group.

 

Back when I wasn't very productive as a player, Maulkat, Rose, and Despon would invite me to play with them. Generally, I think your rule of thumb is true but there are some people who do invite others to play.

 

I tend to solo queue most of the time unless I'm getting skipped a lot or get invited by someone, but I try to extend invites to people whose name I don't recognize for the sake of community building. I would encourage anyone that would like to help increase new player retention to extend offers to newer players.

Edited March 20, 2016 by ShallowHal