Only (the new) Imperial Stormtroopers could be so accurate....

[LoverNoFighter]

The new stormies now use their weapon in their right hand. The old ones used their left hand. Maybe that's why they couldn't hit anything before back in the days....

[Wolfninjajedi]

/Sigh...

 

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/127594/4609999-7822759337-43557.gif

 

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/127594/4610000-7834681872-43557.gif Oh look right handed!

 

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/127594/4610001-3698567739-43557.gif Right handed again, while driving one handed!

 

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/127594/4610125-3359847748-94mpA.gif

 

Yeah, they clearly couldn't hit anything....sure....

Edited November 29, 2015 by Wolfninjajedi

[LoverNoFighter]

That's a SCOUT trooper on that speederbike..... Edited November 29, 2015 by LoverNoFighter

[Wolfninjajedi]

That's a SCOUT trooper on that speederbike.....

 

Scout Troopers are Stormtroopers, just variants of them.

Edited November 29, 2015 by Wolfninjajedi

[MadDutchman]

Watch the most recent rebel's episode, makes it pretty clear stormtroopers are just bad.

 

I think Disney is just hoping everyone forgets what Obi-wan said about them.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Watch the most recent rebel's episode, makes it pretty clear stormtroopers are just bad.

 

I think Disney is just hoping everyone forgets what Obi-wan said about them.

 

Except the movies show otherwise and actually shows what Obi-Wan saying is true, that and while Storms do have their low showings in Rebels, they also had some nice showings too.

 

What people miss about the fact on Stormtroopers is...that they aren't those generic goons that bad guys have in movies where they just show up to get blasted by the main character.

 

ANH's first scene is them completely destroying a prepared and defended Rebel Force driving them back in the engagement and then having them surrender as prisoners.

 

These guys are suppose to be securing the galaxy and keeping tabs on it.

 

Tell me, how does it make sense for a galaxy wide Empire to have terrible troopers?

 

It just doesn't make sense at all, this isn't some centered movie where it's all fixed on one location and only the action happens there. It's in a Universe where there's a galactic wide conflict, we may not see such things in the movies but considering there's a whole expanded universe...well you will see as such.

Edited November 29, 2015 by Wolfninjajedi

[LoverNoFighter]

Doesn't change the fact that they're left handed.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Doesn't change the fact that they're left handed.

 

Well right, but they can also fire right handed as shown too.

[Rhyltran]

Except the movies show otherwise and actually shows what Obi-Wan saying is true, that and while Storms do have their low showings in Rebels, they also had some nice showings too.

 

What people miss about the fact on Stormtroopers is...that they aren't those generic goons that bad guys have in movies where they just show up to get blasted by the main character.

 

ANH's first scene is them completely destroying a prepared and defended Rebel Force driving them back in the engagement and then having them surrender as prisoners.

 

These guys are suppose to be securing the galaxy and keeping tabs on it.

 

Tell me, how does it make sense for a galaxy wide Empire to have terrible troopers?

 

It just doesn't make sense at all, this isn't some centered movie where it's all fixed on one location and only the action happens there. It's in a Universe where there's a galactic wide conflict, we may not see such things in the movies but considering there's a whole expanded universe...well you will see as such.

 

I'm actually going to argue against storm troopers. If someone or a force has some really good showings and then a bunch of poor showings at best that force is pathetically mediocre. A mediocre fighting force is not "Feared" it's mediocre. Average. Average, despite being known as average, might as well be poor in the world of competition or on the battlefield.

 

Let's look at ROTJ. In ROTJ you have a heavily armored unit who has the main cast outnumbered and outgunned in terms of equipment. They score a good hit on R2D2 and score a hit on Leia's arm. This is the 501st. The most ****** and toughest of the storm troopers. It doesn't matter if the book said they were winning until Chewbacca stole the AT-ST. Even prior to that we know they were suffering more casualties than the main cast and an AT-ST is taken down by the ewoks.

 

So we have a primitive midget race capable of engineering a trap to take down two AT-ST (correct me if I'm wrong. Two are downed.) whereas as soon as Chewie takes ONE for himself (which means the enemy, who is outnumbered and outgunned managed to take down three of their war vehicles) they begin to lose. Showing they don't have the tactics or the cunning to take out the one chewie had already commandeered. Then let's look at the death star. They were ordered to allow the rebels to escape. Were they also ordered to throw their lives away? No, they were ordered to let the rebels escape.

 

No human being (except the most fanatically loyal), are going to just let themselves be the ones to die orders or not. Unless they're going to take some people with them. Many of these storm troopers, who have the advantage of getting to play defensive, die. There is quite a few casualties. In any scene where the storm troopers do decently they are either outnumbering their opponents and have them outgunned or suffer quite a few casualties. You show a few "lone exceptions." but the exception to the rule DOESN'T make the rule.

 

Let's look at the UFC. You can point to me some fighters with really abysmal records. I can showyou a few videos of them achieving some quick knockouts then counter with "See? He's actually really good." The record doesn't change.

 

Hate it or not when you add up the movies AND rebels. The majority of the time? They really do suck.

 

Believe or not people don't just take stormtroopers and make them out to be bad for giggles while praising villains in other movies. There's a reason they are the joke they are. They just aren't intimidating and there's not much intimidated by them. From what we've seen on screen they're just not an intimidating force.

 

Also if the 501'st had as much trouble as they did vs the ewoks, hang, chewie, luke, and leia? A regular squadron would have performed that much worse.

Edited November 29, 2015 by Rhyltran

[Wolfninjajedi]

I'm actually going to argue against storm troopers. If someone or a force has some really good showings and then a bunch of poor showings at best that force is pathetically mediocre. A mediocre fighting force is not "Feared" it's mediocre. Average. Average, despite being known as average, might as well be poor in the world of competition or on the battlefield.

 

Let's look at ROTJ. In ROTJ you have a heavily armored unit who has the main cast outnumbered and outgunned in terms of equipment. They score a good hit on R2D2 and score a hit on Leia's arm. This is the 501st. The most ****** and toughest of the storm troopers. It doesn't matter if the book said they were winning until Chewbacca stole the AT-ST. Even prior to that we know they were suffering more casualties than the main cast and an AT-ST is taken down by the ewoks.

 

So we have a primitive midget race capable of engineering a trap to take down two AT-ST (correct me if I'm wrong. Two are downed.) whereas as soon as Chewie takes ONE for himself (which means the enemy, who is outnumbered and outgunned managed to take down three of their war vehicles) they begin to lose. Showing they don't have the tactics or the cunning to take out the one chewie had already commandeered. Then let's look at the death star. They were ordered to allow the rebels to escape. Were they also ordered to throw their lives away? No, they were ordered to let the rebels escape.

 

No human being (except the most fanatically loyal), are going to just let themselves be the ones to die orders or not. Unless they're going to take some people with them. Many of these storm troopers, who have the advantage of getting to play defensive, die. There is quite a few casualties. In any scene where the storm troopers do decently they are either outnumbering their opponents and have them outgunned or suffer quite a few casualties. You show a few "lone exceptions." but the exception to the rule DOESN'T make the rule.

 

Let's look at the UFC. You can point to me some fighters with really abysmal records. I can showyou a few videos of them achieving some quick knockouts then counter with "See? He's actually really good." The record doesn't change.

 

Hate it or not when you add up the movies AND rebels. The majority of the time? They really do suck.

 

Believe or not people don't just take stormtroopers and make them out to be bad for giggles while praising villains in other movies. There's a reason they are the joke they are. They just aren't intimidating and there's not much intimidated by them. From what we've seen on screen they're just not an intimidating force.

 

Also if the 501'st had as much trouble as they did vs the ewoks, hang, chewie, luke, and leia? A regular squadron would have performed that much worse.

 

The 501st wasn't on Endor, it was Tempest Force. Well EU Legends anyway.

 

The script also notes that the battle turned into the Rebels favor too when the AT-ST was hijacked. It's also not like we saw the full battle here, so even though the Ewoks did take out 2 AT-STs, and the script notes the battle only turned around when Chewie hijacked his AT-ST and destroyed the final one. The battle didn't seem to be in any danger of losing for the Empire up until that point, otherwise the script wouldn't make a note that the battle turned into the Rebels favor when Chewie hijacked the AT-ST.

 

The Stormtroopers didn't have the firepower to take out the AT-ST that was hijacked, ontop of this it's not like the Stormtroopers were expecting to fight, much less a small diminutive little force that can blend in with the environment really ease and can jump in hordes to overpower the enemy, they were sent to capture. If you take notice in the movie, each scene pretty much is mass Ewoks piling on a small group of Stormtroopers as they are busy with something else. With the exception of like 2 scenes really.

 

Ah but Stormtroopers are fanatically loyal and it is stated, that they are prepared to throw away their lives for the Empire, they don't fear death and do take on suicide missions.

 

Also I'm incorporating the EU Legends into this as well, where they are shown to be an intimidating and pretty bad*** force.

 

Rebels do yes, have shown more bad showings than good, but they've also in this new canon have shown good things too. In Rebels for example and have shown a few things in the new comics too.

 

Never said it was a rule or anything, but they are hardly the goons you see in those 80s action films with Arnold or anyone else that just show up and get blasted.

 

At any rate the OP was on the accuracy and how they didn't hit anything in the movies, but as I showed...they did so that's really all the point I needed to get across.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Wolfninjajedi

[Rhyltran]

The 501st wasn't on Endor, it was Tempest Force. Well EU Legends anyway.

 

The script also notes that the battle turned into the Rebels favor too when the AT-ST was hijacked. It's also not like we saw the full battle here, so even though the Ewoks did take out 2 AT-STs, and the script notes the battle only turned around when Chewie hijacked his AT-ST and destroyed the final one. The battle didn't seem to be in any danger of losing for the Empire up until that point, otherwise the script wouldn't make a note that the battle turned into the Rebels favor when Chewie hijacked the AT-ST.

 

The Stormtroopers didn't have the firepower to take out the AT-ST that was hijacked, ontop of this it's not like the Stormtroopers were expecting to fight, much less a small diminutive little force that can blend in with the environment really ease and can jump in hordes to overpower the enemy, they were sent to capture. If you take notice in the movie, each scene pretty much is mass Ewoks piling on a small group of Stormtroopers as they are busy with something else. With the exception of like 2 scenes really.

 

Ah but Stormtroopers are fanatically loyal and it is stated, that they are prepared to throw away their lives for the Empire, they don't fear death and do take on suicide missions.

 

Also I'm incorporating the EU Legends into this as well, where they are shown to be an intimidating and pretty bad*** force.

 

Rebels do yes, have shown more bad showings than good, but they've also in this new canon have shown good things too. In Rebels for example and have shown a few things in the new comics too.

 

Never said it was a rule or anything, but they are hardly the goons you see in those 80s action films with Arnold or anyone else that just show up and get blasted.

 

At any rate the OP was on the accuracy and how they didn't hit anything in the movies, but as I showed...they did so that's really all the point I needed to get across.

 

You're right. They weren't on Endor. In fact they were disbanded before them I believe. Regardless those were the Empire's best troops. Palpatine confirms as much to Luke. So as I mentioned, any other squad, would have done poorly. They may not have the equipment to take out any AT-ST but do remember neither did the Ewok's they set their traps during the middle of the fight. Plus the Imperials lost three AT-ST. We have people in real life fanatically loyal and willing to do suicide missions but suicide for no reason is pointless. They could have allowed the rebels to escape with no deaths if they were capable of that.

 

They are the goons seen in the 80's action movies. In 80's action movies they might kill a few cops but usually are completely incapable of killing or mortally injuring any main character. There's no different in the star wars movie. How many storm troopers has Leia, Han, and Luke killed? How many main characters do we see die on screen? To be fair until episode 2.. the droids are just as bad but by Episode 2 at least they manage to bring down Jedi even if it is through overwhelming them with firepower.

 

The script mentions the battle turned around when Chewie commandeered the AT-ST but that isn't the rebels getting lucky. He did manage to do it. Just as the Ewoks managed to take down two more. It's actually more incompetence on their part that they lost ALL through of their AT-ST's. That the Ewoks managed to set up the traps and that a diminutive race of tiny people with spears, slingshots, and gliders took down the Empire's most elite force.

 

Do remember. These aren't some run of the mill soldiers. These were the best of the best. It would be the equivalent of a nation irl's finest soldiers armed to the teeth, tanks and all, losing to naked tribe's men. You mention the Ewoks actually had them outnumbered. Palpatine did say legion but let's assume for the moment he's exaggerating. Remember what happened to the Aztecs when they encountered Cortes? The ewoks were armed with more primitive weapons than the Aztecs. The imperial soldiers were armed with better weapons than the Spanish invaders (by far) with better armor and physical training (going by the EU.) It should have been a steamroll.

 

Plus when people say they can't aim they don't mean literally. Take all their showings from the movies and rebels. Take all their misses and hits. What is their hit percent? Take the clone troopers. Take all the times in the clone wars and movies. All the time their blasters found their marks versus their misses. What is their hit percent in comparison?

[Wolfninjajedi]

Well it's not like they could just let Luke and co just waltz out of the Death Star, that would raise some red flags that they could just easily leave without any resistance.

 

I'd also say they are more than just the 80s goons, as I just recall the goons just showing up to die. At least majority, there might be a minority of showings I'm missing, but with Storms they have a pretty good record, with steamrolling Tantive IV, Storming Echo Base, Cloud City(oh they blew apart 3PO he's a main character! ), giving fits to the main cast on Endor(one Scout had a rousing fist fight with Han), capturing the Rebel Strike Force, so on.

 

Sure they may not have killed any main characters...but then that's hardly surprising is it not?

 

Let's also not forget though that it wasn't just the Ewoks, but also a Rebel Strike Force consisting of Rebel SpecForce, Han Solo and Chewie with a hijacked AT-ST.

 

I'll admit sure the Ewoks taking out 2 of the 4 AT-STs were kinda bizarre, given how would they even know to set up traps when they didn't know any AT-STs were there. Or at least that quickly, unless they saw the force as it was arriving to the bunker.

 

But just because we see a few scenes of Ewoks ganging up on distracted Storms, we gotta assume that was all of the Troopers right? As I recall aslo we see a Stormtrooper throw around an Ewok like a sack of potatoes(lol that image).

 

But anyway, I really don't wanna go back and forth on this, so we'll just agree to disagree I guess. Plus there's also that infamous Plot Armor, so the good guys always gotta win no matter how ridiculous it might be!

 

Including Legends though Rhy, you gotta admit that Stormtroopers are above the generic goons most commonly seen as they have taken down main characters from time to time and show them as being awesome.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Wolfninjajedi