Sukhrajsgh Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 Hey, I just started playing two weeks ago and I decided to play the Sith Warrior. I read the dulfy guide but I had misunderstood as I thought that Vengeance Juggernaut could also tank as well as dps, which resulted in me gearing my Vengeance in tank gear. It was only today when someone I met in flashpoint was kind enough to point out my mistake. So I wanted to ask whether or not it is feasible for me to keep my Vengeance Juggernaut in Tank gear or should I switch to the Immortal discipline instead? The thing as I understand it, while Immortal Juggernaut sacrifice it damage ability for defense thus taking slightly longer to kill the enemy than usual. Any insight on the matter is appreciated appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdrianDmitruk Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 (edited) If you have tank gear, you should be using the Immortal discipline, full stop. Of the three tanking stats (shield, absorb, and defense), only ONE will even work on DPS disciplines such as vengeance (that being defense). Shield and absorb are only relevant to characters wearing a shield, and shields only work when you're in tank stance. Let alone that even defense is not optimal for vengeance. Before SoR, it at least made retaliation procs more likely, but now retaliation procs off of your misses, not defended attacks like it did before 3.0. Now there is such a thing as "skank tanking," where if a tank was to quit a FP group or something, you swap into the tank form and tank without taking the immortal discipline and/or without a full set of tank gear, using taunts (which are tied to Soresu form, not the discipline) and AOE to get aggro and cooldowns to help stay alive. But that is a relatively advanced concept; you need to know the class thoroughly to do it successfully, and if you are asking these kinds of questions you are almost certainly not ready for it. For DPS, you want mostly power and accuracy, with some surge and maybe alacrity, and a sprinkling of crit. Read the vengeance guide that is stickied at the top of this forum, as it will give exact stat priorities and help you with your rotations. Ultimately, the answer to your question lies in what you want to do with your character. Do you want to soak all the aggro for the rest of your group, soak all the damage, and have the healer heal you to full? Go immortal. Want to just kill stuff? Go DPS (but don't try to DPS with your tank gear--get a second set of DPS gear). (Tanking is much harder as it requires a lot more situational awareness about what's happening to the rest of the group.) Edited August 7, 2015 by AdrianDmitruk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhrajsgh Posted August 7, 2015 Author Share Posted August 7, 2015 Thanks for the advise. I think I will switch to the immortal tree, seeing as I choose Vengeance under the impression that it could both tank and dps. I tried both the Vengeance in full dps gear and immortal in full tank gear and I found that I liked the immortal better seeing as I die less easily even if it takes me slightly less longer to kill the enemies. I accidentally jumped into the middle of 8 enemies of strong and elite class and managed to survive it as an immortal with Quiin healing me whereas the same scenario with Vengeance ended up with me dead really fast. As such I believe I will go full on tank as I think it suits me better and was technically what I was doing from the beginning. Thx again for the advise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadDogBarking Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 In all trees that share tank and dps there are some VERY VERY VERY specific situations where certain builds can SKANK TANK. Beaware that any ability to pull this means that you must first master being a better than above average tanks and dps. There have been some loop holes in the past that have gotten or should be gotten NERFED. SIne used to be able to exit combat and run macros to quickly switch into tank stance an gear. There were also builds in the pre 3.0 skill tress that could kinda split the trees. Even with questionable mechanics or flat out exploits/cheats players still needed to understand the basics. If I am in pvp defending a node or in Voidstar and defending the second round while ahead I may switch to a tank stance because a standing player is better at protecting the objective than pure damage. PS please remember if playing PVP you can still throw taunts off of DCD (I hope) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atofinado Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 I was off since the dread masters release, now with the discipline system; by my surprise, im unable to adapt and gave up on immortal [sadly since i love tanking on jugg]. The odd stuff appeared when i started farming tatical flashpoints, as dps, and ending turning soresu on and guarding someone. Then the spark hit my mind: Why not ? Note here that im not talking about "skank tank" or idk how you guys call it. Im talking about fully geared as tank, with soresu, shield and everything else as VENGEANCE. Feel free to bash me now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdrianDmitruk Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) I was off since the dread masters release, now with the discipline system; by my surprise, im unable to adapt and gave up on immortal [sadly since i love tanking on jugg]. The odd stuff appeared when i started farming tatical flashpoints, as dps, and ending turning soresu on and guarding someone. Then the spark hit my mind: Why not ? Note here that im not talking about "skank tank" or idk how you guys call it. Im talking about fully geared as tank, with soresu, shield and everything else as VENGEANCE. Feel free to bash me now I've actually done this in HM FPs before when the tank either DC'd or quit. It's doable, but less than optimal. I haven't tried it in operations. I would definitely let the healer know. If you know what you are doing and use DCDs properly, it shouldn't be a big issue for 4 mans. If the tank already left, most healers are fine with it as they just want to finish rather than wait for a full Immortal tank; if you queue this way you will probably find more objections. As I haven't tried it for operations, I cannot recommend it. I do occasionally heal operations, and I generally want the tanks to have as much mitigation as possible (including from the tanking tree) so I have more GCD room to deal with the inevitable DPS standing in bad. If you have a regular ops group you ran with, that might be less an issue, at least for SM. Edited August 22, 2015 by AdrianDmitruk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atofinado Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Yeah i can feel where it starts to lose the grip, 4-man its ok, my focus is mostly keep the target in check and leave the trash to the group, just to keep things non-deadly and... I am an addict... CAN'T STOP TANKING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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