ShadowMudkip Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I know, just saying personal view point. Salt is every where in this lol, I cant blame you for not voting, just wish I could have had 1 match where I didnt get raged at by the exact same people over and over again. Honestly, I think it have been far closer of a match had I faced you and Aurbere faced Sel. Perhaps more fun too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Honestly, I think it have been far closer of a match had I faced you and Aurbere faced Sel. Perhaps more fun too. possibly, but I think that would have depended on the helicopters that follow me.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowMudkip Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 possibly, but I think that would have depended on the helicopters that follow me.... Helicopters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 Note folks if you're not going to vote seriously don't vote at all thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowMudkip Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Alright, since no one is interested in seriously voting, I decided to go through the thread and vote based on my findings. Lightsaber Combat This one is difficult, imo, due to the power disparity between players. Despite what Sel has said, I believe that Kyp can give Krayt a serious run for his money, though I believe that he will still lose in the end to Krayt. I believe that pime K'Kruhk and prime Wyrrlock are pretty close, so no definitive edge. I believe that Leia has a small edge over Talon, but that edge is canceled out by the fact that Krayt has a slight edge over Kyp. Had Tune argued Streen's ability as a duelist a little better, I might have given him the edge. However he didn't, so I am not giving an edge to either side in this catagory. Edge: Neither Force Powers Most controversial area in this debate tbh. Krayt is overall the more powerful force user than Kyp, however, I believe that Tune did a good enough job demonstrating Kyp's superiority in the TK area though. Just because one is an overall better force user, does not mean that they are better in every category and every ability. Wyyrlok is better than K'Kruhk, no contest. Leia and Talon I feel are equals, if not Leia taking a slight edge. Streen is primarily a force user, however, I don't believe that Tune argued him well enough. Edge: Selenial Teamwork and Tactics This one is really close, both sides demonstrated good knowledge in this area, and provided examples and quotes to back them up. However, I feel Tune pulled ahead slightly in the tactics aspect. Edge:Tunewalker Handling the environment Tune made more arguments for the environment, but Selenial made a more complete argument in her final post. Overall I feel that neither side really put enough time into this area. While Tune did make more arguments, his arguments felt less complete, or unfinished. Sel on the other hand, neglected this area until the very end, and would have lost this category to Tune had her argument been not been slightly better than Tune's. In the end though, I would have to say that Tune covered more bases with his arguments than Sel did. Slight Edge: Tunewalker Miscellaneous Both of you did your fair share of undercutting of the other's team, this made it extremely difficult to gauge each character individually. One thing that you both have forgotten, is that we are supposed to enter this assuming no prior knowledge. In my case, this was actually true, as I have very little knowledge on either of your teams. Neither of you attempted to make serious rebuttals, and this seriously hurt my understanding of both of your teams. Also the fact that feats were being ignored because of assumed bias did not help either of your causes. In the future, I would advise to not ignore parts of a debate. Verdict I have a verdict that I personally decided, however I don't wish to earn the ire of either Tune or Sel simply because of how I felt during this debate. That being said I won't be casting a vote for either side. However, my above decisions in the categories still stand, so Beni, feel free to use those in your decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Note folks if you're not going to vote seriously don't vote at all thanks. Psst, guys, that's your Queue... I'll think about it tomorrow, right now I'm wasted. tldr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Psst, guys, that's your Queue... *Cue I ain't 'queued' for this. In regards to voting, I am really unsure and still thinking it over. I mean, lots of things that I found 'head shake' worthy on both sides, but also a lot on both sides I agreed with... Meh, I will get back to you. *10 months later...* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I wasn't detailed, I made a joke, but my vote was still serious.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Psst, guys, that's your Queue... I'll get to it now, I was busy after the patch :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) Alright, since no one is interested in seriously voting, I decided to go through the thread and vote based on my findings. Lightsaber Combat This one is difficult, imo, due to the power disparity between players. Despite what Sel has said, I believe that Kyp can give Krayt a serious run for his money, though I believe that he will still lose in the end to Krayt. I believe that pime K'Kruhk and prime Wyrrlock are pretty close, so no definitive edge. I believe that Leia has a small edge over Talon, but that edge is canceled out by the fact that Krayt has a slight edge over Kyp. Had Tune argued Streen's ability as a duelist a little better, I might have given him the edge. However he didn't, so I am not giving an edge to either side in this catagory. Edge: Neither Force Powers Most controversial area in this debate tbh. Krayt is overall the more powerful force user than Kyp, however, I believe that Tune did a good enough job demonstrating Kyp's superiority in the TK area though. Just because one is an overall better force user, does not mean that they are better in every category and every ability. Wyyrlok is better than K'Kruhk, no contest. Leia and Talon I feel are equals, if not Leia taking a slight edge. Streen is primarily a force user, however, I don't believe that Tune argued him well enough. Edge: Selenial Teamwork and Tactics This one is really close, both sides demonstrated good knowledge in this area, and provided examples and quotes to back them up. However, I feel Tune pulled ahead slightly in the tactics aspect. Edge:Tunewalker Handling the environment Tune made more arguments for the environment, but Selenial made a more complete argument in her final post. Overall I feel that neither side really put enough time into this area. While Tune did make more arguments, his arguments felt less complete, or unfinished. Sel on the other hand, neglected this area until the very end, and would have lost this category to Tune had her argument been not been slightly better than Tune's. In the end though, I would have to say that Tune covered more bases with his arguments than Sel did. Slight Edge: Tunewalker Miscellaneous Both of you did your fair share of undercutting of the other's team, this made it extremely difficult to gauge each character individually. One thing that you both have forgotten, is that we are supposed to enter this assuming no prior knowledge. In my case, this was actually true, as I have very little knowledge on either of your teams. Neither of you attempted to make serious rebuttals, and this seriously hurt my understanding of both of your teams. Also the fact that feats were being ignored because of assumed bias did not help either of your causes. In the future, I would advise to not ignore parts of a debate. Verdict I have a verdict that I personally decided, however I don't wish to earn the ire of either Tune or Sel simply because of how I felt during this debate. That being said I won't be casting a vote for either side. However, my above decisions in the categories still stand, so Beni, feel free to use those in your decision. Thank you. This kind of feedback is fantastic. I dont mind winning or losing honestly, I mind clear and present bias and hypocracy. I mind being heckled by outsiders constantly who are trying to hide under the "corrections" umbrella, when they are making no corrections out side of heckling me I honestly dont think Zoltan or Aurbere can make an unbiased vote on this one because I was fighting their arguments and heckling as much as I was Selenial's Arguments and heckling. I mind being yelled at for a different opinion then another, and in that I fight back. This is the first Vote I have seen, that wasnt clearly full of bias and mal content. Thank you.... I will take this into consideration in the future for debates. Edited August 18, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 OK, since Beni desires detailed and serious votes, here's mine. Lightsaber Skill Selenial. Tune did a decent job sporting his team's lightsaber skills, but he made several inaccurate assumptions, such as with K'Kruhk's fight with Grievous, and didn't really develop his arguments in this area. Selenial went into exhaustive detail on the lightsaber abilities of her team members and brought in so much evidence to support her position. Additionally, she exposed the aforementioned inaccuracies as well as hit extremely hard on several of Tune's arguments in this area to the point of practically invalidating them altogether. She gets the obvious edge here. Force Abilities Again, Selenial. Tune's position that he established here was shaky at best. One of his main arguments--Kyp's Dovin Basal feat--was exposed as a feat heavily exaggerated and Selenial did a brilliant job highlighting that Kyp could not apply that power for several uncontested reasons. Outside of Kyp, Tune didn't really develop his characters in the realm of Force abilities nearly to the extent that Selenial did. Additionally, Selenial's arguments concerning Streen made this category even worse for Tune, as she clearly showed that Streen is not much of a factor due to the circumstances surrounding his best feats. Selenial takes it because of her exhaustive development of the Force abilities of her characters and her ability to essentially halt many of Tune's best arguments in this area. By the end of it, Tune didn't really have anything noteworthy on the table to compare to Sel's arguments. Teamwork & Tactics Selenial, once again (this is gonna be a thing, isn't it?) Selenial argued this category beautifully. She perfectly highlighted the loyalties of her team members to Krayt's vision and brilliantly applied Darth Krayt's telepathic abilities to this area as a means to further enhance the team's ability to work together. Additionally, she expertly dissuaded any attempts at exploiting the natural Sith trait of betrayal by highlighting Talon and Wyyrlok's loyalties to Krayt. Tune did a decent job in this area, but his arguments were undeveloped, and what arguments he did have Selenial argued against enough to mitigate any advantage Tune might have in this area by the nature of Jedi teams. As far as tactics go, the only real tactic I saw here was ganging up on Talon in a 2v1. Once again, Selenial put great amounts of effort into the nature of 2v1 fights and heavily emphasized Talon's skills in this area through her experience against two highly skilled opponents. Tune didn't argue this nearly to the same extent that Selenial did, and it cost him as he had no real answer for her strategies here. Point to Sel. Handling the Environment There wasn't much argument here, but what was argued seemed to fall in Selenial's favor. The issue here is that Tune made arguments, but never really finished them. Selenial emphasized her team's ability to make use of the environment in a variety of ways, whether it be through telekinetically throwing objects or simply navigating through it. So point to Sel here. Vote Is it really any surprise? Sel wins this match. Possibly the best point in her favor is simply debate style. Not only did she argue her team brilliantly, but she argued Tune's team better than he did. One of the most important parts of any debate should be knowing the capabilities of your opponent's team. Tune really didn't seem to know Sel's team as well as he should have, whereas Sel had vast knowledge on Tune's team and simply understood them better. Furthermore, one of Tune's biggest issues was that he left several arguments unfinished and many lacked the depth and detail that Sel's had. In addition to Sel simply outdebating him on every point he brought up, I'd say all of this is clear cause for voting Selenial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Well, thanks for the votes, both of you I appreciate both, even if I like Aurbere's a little more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I edited my vote. I hope you'll prefer it this was Tune... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhyltran Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Lightsaber Combat Tune did an adamant job trying to argue his team's use of the lightsaber but unfortunately I don't think he was as convincing as Selenial was in this regard. I feel the big factor here was a lot of assumptions and not enough hard evidence to really back up his side. The opposite here was Selenial who spent a lot of time and effort to not only prove her team's lightsaber superiority but provide a lot of evidence backing it up in this case. Force Abilities Tune spent way too much time trying to argue Kyp's superiority and giving in the Sel's baiting rather than focusing on the rest of his team. Too much time was spent on Kyp and using (once again) assumptions and "possible" scenarios rather than sticking to the cold hard facts. The rest of his team suffered as nearly the entire debate was centered around Kyp and while Selenial fell into this with Krayt not only did she demonstrate that Krayt is overall more powerful than Kyp (though, I don't think it was by as large of a margin as she claims) but did fall back and support the rest of her team by giving an accurate measure of their displays as well as how their force displays would matter in the context of the debate. Teamwork This is where Selenial was the strongest. Selenial's arguments in this category were phenomenal and well-spoken. I feel that Tune's arguments in this category was his best showing as well but Selenial's thought process was easy to follow and hit all the right marks. I have to echo much of what Aurbere and others have stated in this category and thus won't go too into detail here but needless to say I give this one an edge with Selenial but I feel Tune was close in this regard. Environment: I was unimpressed with this category and unlike some others feel that neither of them made a strong showing here. Some arguments were made but I think both contestants underused this portion quite a bit. In Sel's defense, with her other strong showings I don't think it really matters. My vote goes to Selenial. Now, I want to give some advice mostly directed at Tune. I know you wanted to argue that Kyp is equal to Krayt but both fighters don't need to be completely equal in all categories in order to compete. As long as Kyp isn't weak enough to be completely bulldozed by Krayt that is all you need to convey. Instead of spending so much time arguing in favor of Kyp you should have spent that time countering Sel's point, showing why your team is superior to hers, and if you didn't agree spent more time trying to convince us, the audience, rather than Selenial herself. The weakest part of your argument wasn't your team choice but it had to do with the fact that it felt more like a Kyp support thread than a team deabte thread. This is what hurt you the most in this topic. Not only that but you presented too many possibilities and assumptions rather than sticking with the facts. If everyone felt that a certain showing or two isn't an accurate representation or had outliers you should have moved on and focused on other areas the character stood out. Then moved on to the rest of your team and how they would handle the opposition based on the feats in question. I'm sorry if this seems harsh but it's not a bash on you. I think you did really good but I'm not pulling punches here and just telling it like it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karadron Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 As I previously stated my vote for this match goes to tune. In order to make my opinion readily understood and most beneficial to the two participants I am going to go about explaining my reasoning in a manner that, to me at least, is a bit different that the others. Duel Breakdowns: Kyp vs Krayt: The main portion of this debate was proving that Kyp could handle Krayt, not the other way around. Both debaters seem to have a well-developed understanding of the Darth so it’s needless to say that if tune wanted this matchup to work he would need to provide enough evidence that Kyp could at the very least keep up with Krayt. I feel that enough evidence was provided by tune to prove that these two would be fairly evenly matched in terms of both Force ability and saber skills. Overall though I find that this duel is the least important one and would most likely be determined by the outcomes of the others. Wyyrlok vs K'Kruhk While both debaters seem to believe that K’Kruhk is the lesser Force user of the two, due to displays in combat, their attitude on his saber abilities differ so much as to be either lowballing or overhyping. The conclusion that I reached via the arguments is that this K’Kruhk could very likely win. His natural durability and past experiences that were noted all indicate that he has the skills necessary to at the very least keep this fight going on for a long time. Leia vs Talon Honestly given what was provided I just don’t see Leia losing. While a formidable opponent Talon really does not seem to be above Leia’s capabilities to defeat. I think there was enough presented by tune that would prove that some of Talon’s skills are countered by Leia’s capabilities. Streen vs Everyone After reviewing the thread I have come to the conclusion that Streen’s AE could really be the most important ability in play. It does have the potential to wreck the arena. While it may have a cast time, I believe that the only way to guarantee that he won’t succeed is for someone to go for him first—a move that could very easily go awry. Environment and teamwork: Between the two debaters I feel that tune covered the environment much more thoroughly. In regards to teamwork I’m giving this to tune on the basis that his team gets to use Force Meld, because Sel never countered it. As it stands, in my opinion, environment is one of the most important factors in a duel (looks back to Beni vs Zoltan) and as tune spent more time on environment than Sel (who never posted anything on it) I can’t give Sel any leeway in that regard. Overview: While people may not like what I have to say in regards to my conclusions I will say that I believe tune did a better job covering various angles and provided a much more thorough analysis of how the entire arena and skill sets of all characters could be utilized. The Broken Rules: Seriously, in regards to no third/fourth party interference certain people did a terrible job of keeping this a 1v1 debate. Also Rule #8 about no aggressive posting, trolling, and flaming was also broken an astronomical amount of times. In all actuality these rules were trampled underfoot in the middle of the thread making for a mockery of what this tournament is supposed to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 My own vote will not be long, but quite short. Albeit, longer than Z's single word vote. Things to Note: Coming into this thread, I didn't really know much about the Legacy Era characters so it was quite a learning experience, but I also didn't know much about Jedi Leia because I tended to ignore her, or about K'kruk or Streen much at all. Both of them I originally underestimated quite a bit. However, after viewing all of the feats and accolades, from both sides, they seem a lot more equal than I had presumed, with 4vs3 pushing it in Tune's favor. Despite this, the pushes for Krayt > Kyp were noticable, but after a while become... unsavory... due to the tones and lack of new evidence... Though the force meld I felt was never properly countered, which proves a HUGE boon in such a battle. All of the combatants are apparently skilled, but I am sure you all know who I think won this match - by the skin of their teeth, mind you. Vote: Tunewalker Explanation: Despite the fact Sel had superior formatting skills *for the most part* I merely found Tune's arguments more in tune *badumtsh* with my own mind set and thoughts, but in a more aggressive manner. Lots of Sel's arguments were convincing, and at times better than Tune's, but when filtering out the attitude, hype, and such, I felt that the feats of the 4 vs the feats of the 3, would pull out a win given the environment and other variables. Sel, don't disown me for disagreeing. Off-topic: This wasn't brought up in this thread, but rather the most powerful thread, about Krayt = Luke before Krayts prime, yet Luke is banned due to his power... I think you see what I am saying... Same applies to Kaggath's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhyltran Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 As I previously stated my vote for this match goes to tune. In order to make my opinion readily understood and most beneficial to the two participants I am going to go about explaining my reasoning in a manner that, to me at least, is a bit different that the others. Duel Breakdowns: Kyp vs Krayt: The main portion of this debate was proving that Kyp could handle Krayt, not the other way around. Both debaters seem to have a well-developed understanding of the Darth so it’s needless to say that if tune wanted this matchup to work he would need to provide enough evidence that Kyp could at the very least keep up with Krayt. I feel that enough evidence was provided by tune to prove that these two would be fairly evenly matched in terms of both Force ability and saber skills. Overall though I find that this duel is the least important one and would most likely be determined by the outcomes of the others. Wyyrlok vs K'Kruhk While both debaters seem to believe that K’Kruhk is the lesser Force user of the two, due to displays in combat, their attitude on his saber abilities differ so much as to be either lowballing or overhyping. The conclusion that I reached via the arguments is that this K’Kruhk could very likely win. His natural durability and past experiences that were noted all indicate that he has the skills necessary to at the very least keep this fight going on for a long time. Leia vs Talon Honestly given what was provided I just don’t see Leia losing. While a formidable opponent Talon really does not seem to be above Leia’s capabilities to defeat. I think there was enough presented by tune that would prove that some of Talon’s skills are countered by Leia’s capabilities. Streen vs Everyone After reviewing the thread I have come to the conclusion that Streen’s AE could really be the most important ability in play. It does have the potential to wreck the arena. While it may have a cast time, I believe that the only way to guarantee that he won’t succeed is for someone to go for him first—a move that could very easily go awry. Environment and teamwork: Between the two debaters I feel that tune covered the environment much more thoroughly. In regards to teamwork I’m giving this to tune on the basis that his team gets to use Force Meld, because Sel never countered it. As it stands, in my opinion, environment is one of the most important factors in a duel (looks back to Beni vs Zoltan) and as tune spent more time on environment than Sel (who never posted anything on it) I can’t give Sel any leeway in that regard. Overview: While people may not like what I have to say in regards to my conclusions I will say that I believe tune did a better job covering various angles and provided a much more thorough analysis of how the entire arena and skill sets of all characters could be utilized. The Broken Rules: Seriously, in regards to no third/fourth party interference certain people did a terrible job of keeping this a 1v1 debate. Also Rule #8 about no aggressive posting, trolling, and flaming was also broken an astronomical amount of times. In all actuality these rules were trampled underfoot in the middle of the thread making for a mockery of what this tournament is supposed to be. I actually am in complete agreement with your broken rules section. There was a lot of unneeded hostility and interference when there shouldn't have been. It won't make me change my vote but I do want to point this out and I hope the next competitions remain cleaner. If this continues in future competitions (I don't think anyone cares but I'll say it anyway) I'll probably stop voting altogether. Just my two cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raandomname Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 I actually am in complete agreement with your broken rules section. There was a lot of unneeded hostility and interference when there shouldn't have been. It won't make me change my vote but I do want to point this out and I hope the next competitions remain cleaner. If this continues in future competitions (I don't think anyone cares but I'll say it anyway) I'll probably stop voting altogether. Just my two cents. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 (edited) As I previously stated my vote for this match goes to tune. In order to make my opinion readily understood and most beneficial to the two participants I am going to go about explaining my reasoning in a manner that, to me at least, is a bit different that the others. Duel Breakdowns: Kyp vs Krayt: The main portion of this debate was proving that Kyp could handle Krayt, not the other way around. Both debaters seem to have a well-developed understanding of the Darth so it’s needless to say that if tune wanted this matchup to work he would need to provide enough evidence that Kyp could at the very least keep up with Krayt. I feel that enough evidence was provided by tune to prove that these two would be fairly evenly matched in terms of both Force ability and saber skills. Overall though I find that this duel is the least important one and would most likely be determined by the outcomes of the others. Wyyrlok vs K'Kruhk While both debaters seem to believe that K’Kruhk is the lesser Force user of the two, due to displays in combat, their attitude on his saber abilities differ so much as to be either lowballing or overhyping. The conclusion that I reached via the arguments is that this K’Kruhk could very likely win. His natural durability and past experiences that were noted all indicate that he has the skills necessary to at the very least keep this fight going on for a long time. Leia vs Talon Honestly given what was provided I just don’t see Leia losing. While a formidable opponent Talon really does not seem to be above Leia’s capabilities to defeat. I think there was enough presented by tune that would prove that some of Talon’s skills are countered by Leia’s capabilities. Streen vs Everyone After reviewing the thread I have come to the conclusion that Streen’s AE could really be the most important ability in play. It does have the potential to wreck the arena. While it may have a cast time, I believe that the only way to guarantee that he won’t succeed is for someone to go for him first—a move that could very easily go awry. Environment and teamwork: Between the two debaters I feel that tune covered the environment much more thoroughly. In regards to teamwork I’m giving this to tune on the basis that his team gets to use Force Meld, because Sel never countered it. As it stands, in my opinion, environment is one of the most important factors in a duel (looks back to Beni vs Zoltan) and as tune spent more time on environment than Sel (who never posted anything on it) I can’t give Sel any leeway in that regard. Overview: While people may not like what I have to say in regards to my conclusions I will say that I believe tune did a better job covering various angles and provided a much more thorough analysis of how the entire arena and skill sets of all characters could be utilized. The Broken Rules: Seriously, in regards to no third/fourth party interference certain people did a terrible job of keeping this a 1v1 debate. Also Rule #8 about no aggressive posting, trolling, and flaming was also broken an astronomical amount of times. In all actuality these rules were trampled underfoot in the middle of the thread making for a mockery of what this tournament is supposed to be. Let me be clear first that I have no problem with people voting against me. However if you're not even going to bother reading my posts, then why should we take your vote seriously? For example, you say I never posted anything on the environment, but my post on such can be found here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8389834&postcount=189 So either you're voting having missed my entire final post, or you have a very selective memory :/ Edited August 19, 2015 by Selenial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Karadron, Sil, what made you vote the way you did? @Karadron, Sel did cover the environment in her final argument. Extensively so, I might add. @Sil, Didn't Tune say Battle Meld wouldn't work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Karadron, Sil, what made you vote the way you did? @Karadron, Sel did cover the environment in her final argument. Extensively so, I might add. @Sil, Didn't Tune say Battle Meld wouldn't work? I really don't feel like combing through the thread again to find that reference Aurbere... and I already explained why I voted how I did, and not really in the mood to go into an expansive explanation, cus reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karadron Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Let me be clear first that I have no problem with people voting against me. However if you're not even going to bother reading my posts, then why should we take your vote seriously? For example, you say I never posted anything on the environment, but my post on such can be found here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8389834&postcount=189 So either you're voting having missed my entire final post, or you have a very selective memory :/ Naw, just missed it when I tried to reread the thread. I stopped somewhere in the middle where all hell broke loose because it wasn't worth my time to sift through all the junk here. I just read it and my opinion didn't change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Naw, just missed it when I tried to reread the thread. I stopped somewhere in the middle where all hell broke loose because it wasn't worth my time to sift through all the junk here. I just read it and my opinion didn't change. So you also didn't read the massive post I made that broke the forum character limit? Lol k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 So wait. If you didn't read Sel's final posts, then how can that vote count? It's lacking in information and is based on an incomplete view of the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Now it's getting awkward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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