-MikeTC- Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Dear Bioware, While I enjoy the new content 3.0 brought us (apart from some really annoying bugs), it is arguably a little thin. You have great content there which is basically unused at the moment. I for my part really liked the old Operations. Explosive Conflict for example is a great Operation all around, especially Nightmare Mode. It was well balanced, you still needed a good team, but it wasn't very RNG dependent. Anyhow, you did it before with Terror From Beyond and Xenoanalyst, you increased the level from 50 to 55. Why not go the same route now and increase the old ops at least to level 55, if not 60. It is pretty much dead content right now anyway, so why not make good use of it? Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muljo_Stpho Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Similar suggestion but with more detail: They could re-scale all enemy stats in all ops to max level and add a bolster effect (possibly more along the lines of the GSI bolster stations so it's not limited to group finder formed groups). All level 50 ops remain "level 50 ops" in that they become available for characters to try at level 50. Likewise for the level 55 ops. That hierarchy would remain for those without one or both of the expansions and stuck at an old level cap, and also to maintain the same options opened up upon reaching each of those levels. If possible, although they would all be "level 60" they could consider aiming for slightly lower benchmarks when re-scaling the 50 and 55 ops to 60. SM 50 ops would kind of aim for "casual level 60", SM 55 ops would kind of aim for "easy level 60", and then SM 60 ops would be at the "standard level 60" benchmark. But then they could tweak the ops queue to maintain access to the earlier level ops queues instead of leveling out of them. Characters at 50-54 can join the ops queue and they'll get a group for whichever level 50 op is currently at the front of the level 50 ops rotation. Characters at 55-59 can join the ops queue and they'll get a group for either the current level 50 op or the current level 55 op. Characters at 60 can join the ops queue and they'll get a group for one from any of the 3 levels of ops. The 3 levels of ops rotations will be options to select / deselect so that players can specifically choose to only queue for a specific level if they want to do it that way. (As with flashpoint selections, not queuing for all available options disables the daily queue reward.) The bolster effect I mentioned would most likely only raise stats to the bare minimum required gear level. (If it's possible to have the bolster apply different numbers in different ops, and if they were also able to get that "casual 60" / "easy 60" / "standard 60" scaling I mentioned for the enemies, maybe 50 ops bolster to around the level of Rishi green gear (168) and 55 ops bolster to around the level of Rishi blue gear (178.)) The bolster would be there for the benefit of those under the level cap but it would still be advantageous to gear up past that level if you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icebergy Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I get very frustrated every time someone suggests something like this. No. Do not give them an excuse to reuse content and call it now. Ask for more new content, don't let them get away with the laziness that is recycling old content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrr_hypernova Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 i think add a new level 60 mode for all ops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrellma Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 No. For starters, level 50 players who don't have access to either expansion (yes, they exist) need content as well. Secondly, with regards to having them release a level 60 version of the old content, I personally would much rather have that dev time focused on actually developing new content, rather than rehashing old content. Thirdly, TFB is a bad comparison. Even though it released at level 50, it was ALWAYS balanced for 55, it was simply pushed out early. There's a reason why only a few teams cleared it before 2.0 dropped. Adjusting it from 50 to 55 involved only minor tweaks, as opposed to a complete overhaul with new mechanics to make up for abilities that we've gained and lost in that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muljo_Stpho Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) I get very frustrated every time someone suggests something like this. No. Do not give them an excuse to reuse content and call it now. Ask for more new content, don't let them get away with the laziness that is recycling old content. I have no intention of my version of the idea being a way to pass off old content as "new". Someone makes a few balance passes over the numbers (no mechanics changes, just stat tweaks), drops in and tweaks the bolster station at area start and respawn points, checks that the options work as intended in group finder. Then they sneak it all in as a quality of life update alongside whatever actual new content might also be in that patch. Everything is updated to the new approach all at once. It is NOT portioned out one at a time over a bunch of different updates so they can claim to have something "new" every month. (My idea wouldn't even work with any sort of partial conversion. The rotations for which level 50 op can be queued for that day, for example, will all be the same schedule regardless of which level bracket you're in. There would not be a separate 50 op queue for the 55-59s or the 60s. And the 55 ops would cycle on the same schedule for those at 60.) Yet it is a valid concern though. While a hard mode version of a flashpoint / op or a nightmare mode version of an op will feature new gameplay mechanics, overall it is not NEW content. But the devs will always act as if it is just as good of an addition as brand new never before seen content. Edited January 31, 2015 by Muljo_Stpho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I get very frustrated every time someone suggests something like this. No. Do not give them an excuse to reuse content and call it now. Ask for more new content, don't let them get away with the laziness that is recycling old content. Ok, then we get nothing then... There are 3 older ops sitting there that would not take nearly as long to convert to 60 as 3 new ops would... If I had to guess, we can either have the 3 older ops upgraded, or 1 new op... would you rather have the 1 new ops vs. those 3 scaled to 60? Maybe yes, and if so, fair enough... but I'll be shocked if we get a new op before the summer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kissakias Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 each lvl has its own FPs and OPs so simply NO game is linear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icebergy Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 would you rather have the 1 new ops vs. those 3 scaled to 60? I would take 1 new Op over 3 recycled content Ops. Every. Single. Time. I would take 1 new Op over 4 recycled Ops. I would take 1 new Op over 5 recycled Ops. I do not want to run the same old stuff I have ran for months again and have them call it something new. Get this garbage out of here. You want tired, recycled, lazy content? Go play WoW, Blizzard reuses their assets over and over. You want to run the old Ops? Go run them, nothing is stopping you. Keep this garbage out of the dev time that could be spent making new stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I would take 1 new Op over 3 recycled content Ops. Every. Single. Time. I would take 1 new Op over 4 recycled Ops. I would take 1 new Op over 5 recycled Ops. I do not want to run the same old stuff I have ran for months again and have them call it something new. Get this garbage out of here. You want tired, recycled, lazy content? Go play WoW, Blizzard reuses their assets over and over. You want to run the old Ops? Go run them, nothing is stopping you. Keep this garbage out of the dev time that could be spent making new stuff. I am inclined to agree. If SWTOR was churning out new operations at a faster pace, maybe it would be worth some dev time to create level cap versions of all end-game content. As Dread Fortress and Dread Palace were the only new operations and highest level / gear content for over a year, I really don't want them to be relevant again... kind of sick of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-MikeTC- Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 (edited) No. Do not give them an excuse to reuse content and call it now. Ask for more new content, don't let them get away with the laziness that is recycling old content. The two things don't have too much overlap. A revamp of the old content would hardly require much dev time. A new Ops requires a lot of all parts of the game design, from story, combat to conding and so on. For starters, level 50 players who don't have access to either expansion (yes, they exist) need content as well. I highly doubt that. Pure F2Ps are not running any Ops because they can't afford Ops passes anyway, and even if they could they would hardly get a team for that. Preffered usually have at least RotHC, so they won't really be needing any level 50 content anyway. Thirdly, TFB is a bad comparison. --- Adjusting it from 50 to 55 involved only minor tweaks, as opposed to a complete overhaul with new mechanics to make up for abilities that we've gained and lost in that time. It is the perfect comparison actually. I don't want them to change the mechanics, leave them as is. Just change HP and DPS output and we're golden. each lvl has its own FPs and OPs so simply NO game is linear Now that is just not true. Granted there are SM FPs meant to augment the story and then there are HM FPs which were never meant to be linear, but to be content you could do for endgame. While we're at it, these should be changed to level 55 or 60 as well btw. Regarding Ops I'd even be happy to have SM be level 50 and HM and NiM be level 60. Awesome. Edited February 2, 2015 by -MikeTC- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletBlaze Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 You are forgetting there are some people that don't have level 60 toons. Yes they exist. If you made all the operations for level 60 toons, what do those people get to run? We have to consider others that don't have level 60 toons so they can have some content to. Not all content should be level up to 60 as that leaves others out, which is not fair to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletBlaze Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 (edited) MikeTC-;8009414]I highly doubt that. Pure F2Ps are not running any Ops because they can't afford Ops passes anyway, and even if they could they would hardly get a team for that. Preffered usually have at least RotHC, so they won't really be needing any level 50 content anyway. Some guilds purchase Operation passes. I know we do for those that can't purchase level 50 operations passes.. So your theory is not correct. I have even purchase operation passes for F2P friends who want to run the operations. Edited February 2, 2015 by ScarletBlaze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-MikeTC- Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) Some guilds purchase Operation passes. I know we do for those that can't purchase level 50 operations passes.. So your theory is not correct. I have even purchase operation passes for F2P friends who want to run the operations. While I agree there might rare cases it's hardly what usually happens. The only Ops for Level 50 content I see nowadays are Achievement runs which are no fun at all if it can be soloed by any level 60 char. The problem with level 55 players I do see though. So why not make all SM content level 55 and HM and NiM level 60? Does that sound fair? Edited February 3, 2015 by -MikeTC- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-MikeTC- Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) I am inclined to agree. If SWTOR was churning out new operations at a faster pace, maybe it would be worth some dev time to create level cap versions of all end-game content. Well shouldn't it be quite the opposite? If we were getting a new Ops every other month I wouldn't even care that much. But we're not and we will not. So why not at least have something which can be achieved way easier and is still fun to do? Edited February 3, 2015 by -MikeTC- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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