Beniboybling Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 So you are legitimately interested in a Vader vs Plagueis debate? :woah:No I'm just intrigued as to what mad ideas spurred such a belief that Vader is superior to Plagueis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 No I'm just intrigued as to what mad ideas spurred such a belief that Vader is superior to Plagueis. Far superior TK feats, and slightly superior accolades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 If that'd be true then top10 would look like this: #1. Luke #2. Leia #3. Caedus #4. Jaina etc etc no, no it wouldnt .... Leia's knowledge and understanding never came near its peak. Jaina didnt inherit as much of the connection, and HER knowledge and understanding is no where near (and she may yet make the top 10). Power in force is measured 3 ways Connection Knowledge Understanding (knowledge and understanding are not one and the same) The family lines of Skywalkers have the greatest connection of any force user ever... other then them we have seen a few others with strong "connections" that never became truly powerful. Galen Marek is one of them, he had the potential to be stronger then Sidious (meaning his connection was stronger) I am starting to enjoy my arguments being taken the completely wrong way and causing endless face palms. Its working well to warm up my hands... so thanks every one for that. To be fair, Midi-chlorian manipulation I believe actually suggests a greater level of understanding, question is if Caedus's level of connection over rides that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Implying such a thing is possible? Nope just want some laughs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Far superior TK feats, and slightly superior accolades.Proof, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 No I'm just intrigued as to what mad ideas spurred such a belief that Vader is superior to Plagueis. I know, I know! It's because Vitiate > Sidious, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Nope just want some laughs. So long as you don't take him seriously. I think we stopped doing that when I put him on ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 no, no it wouldnt .... Leia's knowledge and understanding never came near its peak. Jaina didnt inherit as much of the connection, and HER knowledge and understanding is no where near (and she may yet make the top 10). So to reiterate Tune's argument for him: Skywalkers are better than everyone else except when they're not, because then they suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Proof, please. Do you want the proof in the scans where he throws around Y-Wings with casual gestures, when he brings down gigantic trees, cathedrals, and mining equipment, or when he blasts away dozens of enemies, breaks open Tie-Fighters with a grip of his hand, and unleashes a blast that sends monsters of grotesque size squealing for cover? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Jaina didnt inherit as much of the connection, and HER knowledge and understanding is no where near (and she may yet make the top 10). You just contradicted yourself right here. You say being Skywalker automatically makes them having higher connection to the force, except when they actually don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 So to reiterate Tune's argument for him: Skywalkers are better than everyone else except when they're not, because then they suck. ninja'd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) i'm done, i am just going to give my verdicts on this stuff. I am not being misunderstood or patronized for theories on a fictional universe. Especially when I have given reasons and grounding for them. Even IF sidious didnt have the "black hole feat" and what he did in the movies was all he ever saw him do... he would still be "the strongest sith lord of all time" even if the movie accolades dont show all that much. Yoda would still be the "strongest jedi barring Luke" again even with out the other stuff in the books and shows. Vader would still be 80% of the emperor and his BEST FEAT would still be the sword fight with his son... not his TK ability to throw around large objects like they are paper weights, no his best feat is a saber duel, the closest REAL showing of power. Power has always been measured in the three ways. Knowledge and understanding are the path one takes to reach full power. Connection determines that full power. A greater connection has always meant a greater potential. With equivlant knowledge and understanding the deciding factor is Connection. "size matters not, judge me by my size do you? and where you should not, for my ally is the force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Luminous beings, are we not this crud matter." Edit: if you guys dont want people to troll you, dont troll others... follow your own rules for once in your lives. Edited January 21, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Edit: if you guys dont want people to troll you, dont troll others... follow your own rules for once in your lives. Aurbere and Beni been harassing members for years according to the members who left here to go to KMC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) Edit: if you guys dont want people to troll you, dont troll others... follow your own rules for once in your lives. It's not trolling, you literally said that: Being a skywalker makes him have greater CONNECTION to the force then any one here. no, no it wouldnt .... Leia's knowledge and understanding never came near its peak. Jaina didnt inherit as much of the connection, and HER knowledge and understanding is no where near (and she may yet make the top 10). PS: Also don't be like that, we are having a discussion nothing more Edited January 21, 2015 by cs_zoltan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) It's not trolling, you literally said that: PS: Also don't be like that, we are having a discussion nothing more No they are trolling, you are having a discussion, they are to busy snickering between their teeth like little teenage girls to have a conversation. You simply misunderstood, and are taking quotes out of context for me. Power in force = Connection, Knowledge , and Understanding Just because you have the greatest connection does not auto make you win in power in the force. You must examine the other portions for a full blown showing of power. So yes a skywalker by default has the greatest connections. That doesnt mean they by default have the greatest power since Connection is only 1 part of 3. Caedus is showing 2 of those other three parts. Knowledge on par with the others and understanding on par with all save Perhaps... Plaegus, The question then becomes is his stronger connection able to overcome Plaegus's greater understanding. And its one I am not ready to answer for sure just yet. but right now, that answer is yes, but I am not sold. Edited January 21, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarSquirrel Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) It's not trolling, you literally said that: PS: Also don't be like that, we are having a discussion nothing more No it was trolling. As an outside observer with absolutely no involvement here, Sel was definitely trolling as were you. Everyone understands what Tune was saying, but decided to give him a hard time for it anyways. So kids, lighten up (including Tune) and if you disagree actually present a legitimate reason (such as why the argument that "the Skywalker line is superior" is not correct) instead of provoking each other with a short, snarky reply which serve absolutely no purpose other than to antagonize. Edited January 21, 2015 by StarSquirrel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 You also said that Jaina didn't inherit much of the connection, so what makes Cadeus connection higher than others by default if his accolades don't back this up, and his own sister didn't inherit that supposed connection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) You also said that Jaina didn't inherit much of the connection, so what makes Cadeus connection higher than others by default if his accolades don't back this up, and his own sister didn't inherit that supposed connection? Because it has been stated several times that Caedus could have surpassed LUKE eventually meaning he has AT LEAST the same if no BETTER Connection then Luke... Who inherited his Fathers Connection. Who was supposed to take over for the powerful Force Entity in Star Wars. THE FATHER. I actually already said this. Edit: Since Jaina did not share the same potential as Caedus its safe to assume that she did not inherit as much of this connection Edited January 21, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 No it was trolling. As an outside observer with absolutely no involvement here, Sel was definitely trolling as were you. I didn't mean to troll so I guess poor wording? In either case he literally said in one post that being Skywalker means you by default have higher connection to the force and in the next post he said that Jaina doesn't have this higher connection. And I called him out on that contradiction. How is that trolling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Edit: Since Jaina did not share the same potential as Caedus its safe to assume that she did not inherit as much of this connection So you agree that whether or not Cadeus has high connection to the force has nothing to do with being a Skywalker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 So you agree that whether or not Cadeus has high connection to the force has nothing to do with being a Skywalker? No.... it has everything to do with him being a skywalker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) I didn't mean to troll so I guess poor wording? In either case he literally said in one post that being Skywalker means you by default have higher connection to the force and in the next post he said that Jaina doesn't have this higher connection. And I called him out on that contradiction. How is that trolling? There is no contradiction. Not all skywalkers share the skywalker line's full potential. Caedus isnt one that doesnt share that full potential, he has it in spades, as did Luke, as Did Anakin, as did Anakin (Figuring that one out ). Edit: Leia didnt really (as far as I know) Jaina didnt really, they took more after their Mother/ grand mother. Then their father/ grand father. if you are wondering how 2 sons of Leia could inherit Anakin' potential when they are sons of the. "weaker sibling" its called Recessive genes. Edited January 21, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Again, we should not be arguing on potentials and connections. We should be focusing on the power that they have displayed. If we focused on potential and such, Plagueis easily outdoes Caedus via his ability to increase his potential infinitely. Focus on what they have done, IE their feats, rather than connection to the Force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Again, we should not be arguing on potentials and connections. We should be focusing on the power that they have displayed. If we focused on potential and such, Plagueis easily outdoes Caedus via his ability to increase his potential infinitely. Focus on what they have done, IE their feats, rather than connection to the Force. Vader's best feat is right here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjSZ4Pxbz5M quatify it with out using any other outside source. and watch where it unjustly puts him. Clearly, such a method is.... inadequate. We dont see Caedus's limit, we dont see Vitiates limit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarSquirrel Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 I didn't mean to troll so I guess poor wording? In either case he literally said in one post that being Skywalker means you by default have higher connection to the force and in the next post he said that Jaina doesn't have this higher connection. And I called him out on that contradiction. How is that trolling? You're right, after rereading yours was reasonable (though the "ninja'd" comment was unnecessary, if rather innocuous). Sel was still trolling. Instead of laying out an argument and explaining the confusion for Tune to address, she was snippy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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