Lupious Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 (edited) Just curious what everyone's thoughts were. Some of the crafted gear gives more defensive stats, but not as much endurance. Example: Elite Gloves Commendation Gloves (Massassi Duelist's MK-1 Gloves): 332 Endurance 193 Willpower 104 Shield 93 Defense Veracity Ruusan Dynamic Defense Gloves: 231 Endurance 222 Willpower 102 Shield 84 Absorption 27 Defense So basically, if you use the crafted gloves you lose 101 Endurance (about 1000 hp), but you gain 29 Willpower and 16 points worth of defensive stats (104 shield + 93 defense on Elite = 197 vs 102 shield, 84 absorption, 27 defense on crafted = 213). TL : DR is 16 points of defensive stats + 29 willpower > 101 endurance? Seems to me some crafted pieces are better than the 192 Elite Commendation pieces. Not all, granted, but some. That's just one example but there are a couple other pieces like that. The downside of course is that you're stuck with whatever graphic the piece has since crafted doesn't have mods BUT the upside is you can essentially get in full Elite Commendation quality gear in almost half the time by mixing and matching Elite Commendation Gear with crafted. Thoughts? Edited December 22, 2014 by Lupious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aelanis Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Let's look at it this way. Across all 12 pieces of your gear, would you trade 12.7k hit points for 192 defensive stats, which might equal roughly 4% in a stat you don't have a lot of stats in? General rule of thumb: it's not a bad trade if you get 2x as much Endurance as you lose mitigation stats. If you would gain more than that, you really want to make the trade. Less, not so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupious Posted December 22, 2014 Author Share Posted December 22, 2014 Well I don't think you'd ever do all 12 pieces. 12.7k is a lot of hp to lose. I'm sitting at around 56k health right now with stim though so if I did say 3 pieces, I'd lose 3,030 hp and go down to roughly 53k. Doesn't seem like much of a difference and having better defensive stats vs more hp is better for the healer (to a point of course - you don't want to drop below x amount of hp). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aelanis Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 The fact that you wouldn't even consider it at 10 times the scale should hint that it might not be a good idea at regular scale. Getting back roughly 6 times the mitigation stat you would lose in endurance is a VERY good trade. Granted, there's a point where scale comes into play, but it's not really going to happen in the game as is. As far as that X hp number you're talking about, it's a very, very, very complex number that KBN is actually trying to quantify in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupious Posted December 22, 2014 Author Share Posted December 22, 2014 (edited) I understood what he's saying in the post but not the calculations. He's going to have to post real world numbers for us to mirror for that to make sense to 99.99% of the population Essentially though that is sort of what this thread (in a very simplistic way) is asking. How much HP is enough and when is it better to give up HP for defensive stats? The super super simplistic version is even if you're giving up 1000 hp for just 1 point of defensive stat, and you don't need that 1000 hp to survive, then the 1 point of defensive stat is better. (I know that's a really simplistic version because if you don't need the 1000hp to survive, you don't need the 1 point of defensive stat to survive either). I think what most people are looking for in threads like this (or at least I was when I posted) is a yes/no answer. Is 16 points of defensive stats + 29 willpower > 101 endurance? Yes/No? From KBN's thread, it sounds like there isn't a definitive answer yet because we don't have the "exchange rate" of endurance to defensive stats...yet. That means it's more of a gut feeling at this point I guess. Edited December 22, 2014 by Lupious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aelanis Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 The accepted gut feeling here: no, the defensive boost and willpower boost are not worth the trade in endurance. Whether we're right or not... well, we'll possibly find out eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XisscVekno Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 This is what I'm going to end up doing personally. I have no clue how far you progressed before 3.0 hit so your armoring will be up to you to decide. Myself my armoring are all 180/186 so replacing those and losing the set bonus is a huge Mitigation lost. If you are not running with a set bonus then taking the vendor armoring might be fine. As for the rest I'm planning on going with a lettered mod and the mitigation heavy enhancements or in the case of this threads examples crafted enhancements and vendor mods. I'll be doing this UNTIL I start getting the SM/HM token pieces which I will then switch back to mods with more Mitigation over the lettered ones. Reason I'm doing this is because things hit slightly harder in SM/HM of ravagers and temple where your old 180/186 gear won't quite be enough so to give the healers a little bit more of a buffer when healing you add some more health. The other reason I'm doing it this way is I'm a die hard Mit tank. always have been always will be. I don't think EH tanking works any more in today's current MMO line up. Also as a raid healer myself at one point I know that steady damage is much easier to dear with on a tank than damage that spikes all over the place which is what tends to happen to EH tanks and Avoidance tanks. Also, another thing is if you look at those vendor enhancements you sacrifice a lot of mitigation stats for that health and imho it's not worth it. If you where sacrificing shield then I wouldn't be against it so much, but since as a sin/shadow absorption is life with our tanking mechanics it's hard to give up that stat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramalina Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Just curious what everyone's thoughts were. Some of the crafted gear gives more defensive stats, but not as much endurance. Example: Elite Gloves Commendation Gloves (Massassi Duelist's MK-1 Gloves): 332 Endurance 193 Willpower 104 Shield 93 Defense Veracity Ruusan Dynamic Defense Gloves: 231 Endurance 222 Willpower 102 Shield 84 Absorption 27 Defense So basically, if you use the crafted gloves you lose 101 Endurance (about 1000 hp), but you gain 29 Willpower and 16 points worth of defensive stats (104 shield + 93 defense on Elite = 197 vs 102 shield, 84 absorption, 27 defense on crafted = 213). TL : DR is 16 points of defensive stats + 29 willpower > 101 endurance? Seems to me some crafted pieces are better than the 192 Elite Commendation pieces. Not all, granted, but some. That's just one example but there are a couple other pieces like that. The downside of course is that you're stuck with whatever graphic the piece has since crafted doesn't have mods BUT the upside is you can essentially get in full Elite Commendation quality gear in almost half the time by mixing and matching Elite Commendation Gear with crafted. Thoughts? You're sort of comparing unlike things here. If you're too limited on credits or crafting alts, the crafted stuff may be much CHEAPER than modded gear. The proper comparison to my mind though, is Comms gear vs the stats from gear with Crafted Armor/Mods/Enhancements. The general answer is that Comms armors are fine, but you can do better with 186 crafted mods and enhancements if you pick the right ones. That's for sets of gear. If you pick the one or two pieces in the set of comms gear that actually have good secondary stats for your class and role, you can buy a lot of them to replace the mods and enhancements in all of the pieces that have terrible secondary stats. So the breakdown is: Crafted non-modable gear: Quick, cheap. Comms Gear Sets: Quick, cheap, lots of endurance, crappy secondary stats Crafted Mods and Enh: Quick, price varies by server, good secondary stats available. Comms Gear Swapouts: Good stats, requires almost twice as many comms spent as a plain comms set. Set pieces from Operations: The really good stuff for PvE (in most cases). Personally I've gone with a mix of crafted mods and enhancements and swapouts from the elite coms gear. Took about one week to get Ops ready gear. Of course, that's with 7 crafting alts, buying the same amount of crafted mods and enhancements on the GTN would have taken a small fortune in credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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