Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 Because the GA is only gonna send 1 A-wing and the rest of the fighters won't cover eachother....right.The A-Wings are outnumbered 9 to 1. Which means any 1 A-wing will have to contend with 9 tri fighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 The A-Wings are outnumbered 9 to 1. Which means any 1 A-wing will have to contend with 9 tri fighters. Or...the A-wings could also cover one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 I did say probably. Interesting point, though. Though, to be honest, does skill matter for them? There's a ton of them, they don't need to be the best pilots on the field.Not really, I just wanted to make the general point that IMO droid pilots beat organic pilots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 Not really, I just wanted to make the general point that IMO droid pilots beat organic pilots. In some cases, sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) Or...the A-wings could also cover one another.Which frees up 9 tri fighters for every 1 A-Wing that moves to cover another. Meaning 2 will be up against 18, 3 will be up against 36 etc. etc. there is no escaping the ratios I'm afraid. Its a simple case of mathematics. Edited October 13, 2014 by Beniboybling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 Which episode? Because it's sourced to the Liberty of Ryloth with the bombing thing.Liberty of Ryloth, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 Interesting fact folks, it would seem that discord missiles can acclerate to up to 10,000G! Also notice how only Anakin has every shown an ability to evade them. The point I'm trying to make here is that every missile will hit. But I've said enough about fighters. I expanded on my commando strategy earlier, if anyone wants to counter. Other than that I think I've covered all my points, I don't know if there is currently anything that Aurbere would like to focus on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) I am having a few things not add up for your fighter numbers Beni. From your Recusant's you will supposedly be receiving 3840 droid star fighters, 240 per ship, HOWEVER, they are recorded to have no hangers unless they are of a specific variant. The only type of droid star fighter that has been shown to be able to lock onto the outer hull of a vessel while waiting to deploy, are the Hyena and Vulture models. The Tri-droid was not. Nor do they have hyperdrives. While there are often allowances made in the transportation of star fighters in these Kaggaths, here it simply does not work since the Tri-driod has no means to grasp onto the ships that are carrying them. Every time we have seen Tri-driods, there is often a vessel with proper hangers in the Frey such as a Lucra-hulk or a Providence- class. The allowances can only go so far, and I was against counting such a lethal fighter as a normal star fighter from the start, which doesn't really fit. I understand you chose them specifically due to their strength in both ship to ship and droid fighters carriable, but after more searching, it just doesn't work like that. Granted, you could still get quite a few from the Malevolence and Escort Carriers, but the Recusants, which make up over 1/2 of your fighter compliment, simply is not able to carry them. They were only ever seen capable of carrying Vulture/Hyena models, never anything else, likely due to technical limitations which compounded the high cost of Tri-driods which led to them not being as widely used as many would wish. Summery: The only version of the Recusants able to carry Tri-droids is the larger variant, which is not being used here. Side Note: A-Wings have chaff flares that are a direct counter to those missiles. Edited October 13, 2014 by Silenceo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 Liberty of Ryloth, lol. Well that episode didn't show any proton bombs nor bombardments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 Well that episode didn't show any proton bombs nor bombardments.Lol sorry I meant bombing runs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 I'm not seeing any chaff flares for the A-wing, source on that? Also the jammers could be particularly useful for the A-wings, disrupting the Tri-Fighters systems and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 Lol sorry I meant bombing runs. Eh still nothing of that was shown lol, it was said that it was gonna happen but never did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) I'm not seeing any chaff flares for the A-wing, source on that? Also the jammers could be particularly useful for the A-wings, disrupting the Tri-Fighters systems and the like. New Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels, I think. I can check if you need me to. Edit: Nope, not in there. Strange, I remember reading it somewhere. Edited October 13, 2014 by Aurbere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 OK, I think everything has been brought to the table, so I think we can move on to final arguments. Unless anyone wants to discuss this: I'm going to take a moment to note that Jaina's StealthX is equipped with Jedi Shadow Bombs rather than the standard proton torpedo. Remember when doing final arguments, try to touch on everything we've discussed and maybe bring up something new. Every little bit helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 OK, I think everything has been brought to the table, so I think we can move on to final arguments. Unless anyone wants to discuss this: Remember when doing final arguments, try to touch on everything we've discussed and maybe bring up something new. Every little bit helps. I think my last post concerning Tri-droid fighters and Recusants was skipped over by the majority, and I believe it warrants looking into. Could prove fatal if it is proven true. Don't know why I forgot to bring it up much earlier in the debate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) I am having a few things not add up for your fighter numbers Beni. From your Recusant's you will supposedly be receiving 3840 droid star fighters, 240 per ship, HOWEVER, they are recorded to have no hangers unless they are of a specific variant. The only type of droid star fighter that has been shown to be able to lock onto the outer hull of a vessel while waiting to deploy, are the Hyena and Vulture models. The Tri-droid was not. Nor do they have hyperdrives. While there are often allowances made in the transportation of star fighters in these Kaggaths, here it simply does not work since the Tri-driod has no means to grasp onto the ships that are carrying them. Every time we have seen Tri-driods, there is often a vessel with proper hangers in the Frey such as a Lucra-hulk or a Providence- class. The allowances can only go so far, and I was against counting such a lethal fighter as a normal star fighter from the start, which doesn't really fit. I understand you chose them specifically due to their strength in both ship to ship and droid fighters carriable, but after more searching, it just doesn't work like that. Granted, you could still get quite a few from the Malevolence and Escort Carriers, but the Recusants, which make up over 1/2 of your fighter compliment, simply is not able to carry them. They were only ever seen capable of carrying Vulture/Hyena models, never anything else, likely due to technical limitations which compounded the high cost of Tri-driods which led to them not being as widely used as many would wish. Summery: The only version of the Recusants able to carry Tri-droids is the larger variant, which is not being used here. Side Note: A-Wings have chaff flares that are a direct counter to those missiles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLyxmD_UAK4 Well that's a real shame, looks like old Grievous won't be able to blast his opponents into the stone age after all. Oh well, I'll settle for the Old Republic era! OK, so by my third and final calculations that gives the Hegemony 1,440 tri-fighters and 480 bombers. Meaning the still outnumber the Alliance's fighters 3 to 1, and bombers 4 to 1. That's more than enough to secure swift space superiority, 9 to 1 was overkill. I reaffirm all my pasts statements, though I shall edit them with the correct figures for the sake of accuracy. I may have to however bust out that tri-fighter write up... Edited October 13, 2014 by Beniboybling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 New Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels, I think. I can check if you need me to. Edit: Nope, not in there. Strange, I remember reading it somewhere. Nah I looked there, i'll look through a few other sources but I've already looked through 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 I think my last post concerning Tri-droid fighters and Recusants was skipped over by the majority, and I believe it warrants looking into. Could prove fatal if it is proven true. Don't know why I forgot to bring it up much earlier in the debate... You probably should have. Well, Beni's new numbers are a bit more modest. I think we could discuss those a bit more then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLyxmD_UAK4 Well that's a real shame, looks like old Grievous won't be able to blast his opponents into the stone age after all. Oh well, I'll settle for the Old Republic era! OK, so by my third and final calculations that gives the Hegemony 1,440 tri-fighters and 480 bombers. Meaning the still outnumber the Alliance's fighters 3 to 1, and bombers 4 to 1. That's more than enough to secure swift space superiority, 9 to 1 was overkill. I reaffirm all my pasts statements, though I shall edit them with the correct figures for the sake of accuracy. I may have to however bust out that tri-fighter write up... Uhm... Well, wow... That was a lot easier than I thought it would be... I had even readied multiple counter points and everything... Anyways, I think this should put the GA in a much more favorable position. *Goes off to verify the new calculations * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLyxmD_UAK4 Well that's a real shame, looks like old Grievous won't be able to blast his opponents into the stone age after all. Oh well, I'll settle for the Old Republic era! OK, so by my third and final calculations that gives the Hegemony 1,440 tri-fighters and 480 bombers. Meaning the still outnumber the Alliance's fighters 3 to 1, and bombers 4 to 1. That's more than enough to secure swift space superiority, 9 to 1 was overkill. I reaffirm all my pasts statements, though I shall edit them with the correct figures for the sake of accuracy. I may have to however bust out that tri-fighter write up... Please do. Every little bit helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 I think my last post concerning Tri-droid fighters and Recusants was skipped over by the majority, and I believe it warrants looking into. Could prove fatal if it is proven true. Don't know why I forgot to bring it up much earlier in the debate...I actually remember now you bringing that up in your for show thread, which as I know recall prompted me to opt for escort carriers, it would appear it has been far too long since that point for my poor little memory to cope. However, my prior genius will rescue me from disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) Eh still nothing of that was shown lol, it was said that it was gonna happen but never did.The leveled several villages... I'm upset that you have forgotten such a tragic loss of life. Edited October 13, 2014 by Beniboybling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenceo Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 I actually remember now you bringing that up in your for show thread, which as I know recall prompted me to opt for escort carriers, it would appear it has been far too long since that point for my poor little memory to cope. However, my prior genius will rescue me from disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted October 13, 2014 Author Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) Uhm... Well, wow... That was a lot easier than I thought it would be... I had even readied multiple counter points and everything... Anyways, I think this should put the GA in a much more favorable position. *Goes off to verify the new calculations *Well, as I said above, I had actually already considered this point and reached agreement, but I totally forgot. I think they are legit, I found them in an old faction thread and it has now dawned on me that I must have made these calculations prior to the Kaggath, after having said discussion. Yes, my memory truly is that terrible. Edited October 13, 2014 by Beniboybling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) The leveled several villages... I'm upset that you have forgotten such a tragic loss of life. I really didn't see anything like that...but i'll look again. Edit: Ok I see what you mean, but they only got one village and it took many of them to destroy it. Although the Sourcebook doesn't have the proton bombs listed, also proton torpedos can be used for bombing. Edited October 13, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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