Darth_Wicked Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Last friday, I posted this fairly lengthy examination of how Revan and the Infinite Empire always come together, their connection acting as a beacon of sorts to herald discovery, exploration, if not rebirth. Along the way, I ended up cutting some other aspects, including imagery and symbolism present in the latest . For this thread I will try to focus on that but first, I'd like to invite you all to make a little journey with me. - - - - Forty six years ago, Stanley Kubrick directed and released a film by the name of "2001: A Space Odyssey". Based on a short story by Arthur C. Clarke called "The Sentinel", it was a watershed moment in the history of cinema, its influence still being felt far and wide. The movie centers around mankind's gradual but sure evolution throughout history, from its humblest beginnings as early hominids to spaceflight. Along the way, viewers are confronted with black monoliths, each heralding newfound knowledge or understanding. Though their age is unknown at first, it is later revealed that one of the monoliths is approximately four million years old, their exact origins a mystery. It is a tale that beautifully captures nightfall and dawn, death and rebirth, revelation and ascension. I would say more but I have no desire to spoil the story for anyone who hasn't seen it yet, not to mention I've already delved into what matters most for this topic: the black monoliths. It is time we go back to the Old Republic. - - - - Last week after the release of the , I brought up the possibility of a connection between the spears seen in it and the ones from an early Galactic Timeline video, aptly called . In it, Jedi Master Gnost-Dural elaborates on Exar-Kun: The man he was, what drove him to seek out the legacy of the Ancient Sith and how he came to Yavin 4, assuming soon thereafter the mantle of Dark Lord. All things considered however, the spears were merely the tip of the iceberg but more on that in a short bit. - - - - The six herald rebirth. Of power... order... domination. I've been reborn. My mind is clearer' date=' my power intensified. And now, with the order under my command, I'm unstoppable.[/url'] Regardless of its messenger or context, "rebirth" is a recurring motif that permeates many characters and lesser factions throughout the game. Their end-goals may vary of course but there is something they all share: A catalyst that precedes their would-be rebirth. In the latest , aside the spears I had mentioned earlier, we can see an object of some sort in the middle of the room, standing between two obelisks and a flag in the back. The obelisks appear to be chained to separate pillars, while the flag holds a remarkable resemblance to Revan's lower robe. In the middle of it all, Revan turns around, a red light emanating from his visor, and draws his lightsaber, keeping his off-hand holstered. Let us try to ascertain their significance shall we? THE OBELISKS: As mentioned earlier, one on each side, chained to separate pillars. Is it fair to assume they're meant to represent Revan's duality? ? The Destroyer and Protector? Perhaps all that, plus a more obscure ? Regardless, there's something else we may wish to consider: In ancient Egypt, obelisks were placed in pairs at the entrance of temples. They were meant to symbolize the sun god Ra, the ancient egyptians' most important deity. According to its article in Wikipedia, it was hypothesized that its shape derived "from natural phenomena associated with the sun", namely the "sunrise and sunset". And what about the chains? Are they supposed to be imagery of an endless cycle from which Revan seeks deliverance? Perhaps at all cost? THE FLAG: Judging from the video yet again, there seems to be a similarity between the flag and Revan's lower robe; Such similarity is most likely intentional. Whether this means to imply that Revan wants to destroy both Republic and Empire and carve a New Empire of his own, similar to what he supposedly tried during the Jedi Civil War, remains to be seen. Do note below why I say "supposedly": Do you still remember what Revan says to a Republic strike team, in Rakata Prime? Earlier, G0-T0 claims that Revan never sought to destroy the Republic, that something else could have been looming on the horizon. Darth Traya on the other hand calls it by name, claiming that the True Sith, the remnants of the old Sith Empire, lie beyond the Outer Rim. Even though we already went through part of it, they key here is that neither of them identify Revan as being an enemy of the Republic, that he never sought to destroy it to begin with. In the latest flashpoint, Revan identifies the Republic as a "distraction" at best, that needs to be "swept aside". Whether this entails obliteration by any means necessary or simply neutralization is another matter. Regardless, he does say "distraction", as in "a thing that prevents someone from concentrating on something else." THE OBJECT: By far the most puzzling element in the teaser. What does it do? Is it a Sith artifact of some kind? Perhaps Rakata, from the time of the Infinite Empire? Or neither? Even so, do you still remember Space Odyssey? The black monoliths and their role in that movie? Heralds of discovery, evolution and rebirth? Is it possible this object may have a similar role? Both a revelation and means of ascension? If you'll indulge me for a while longer, it is time for a short interlude. - - - - Have you ever heard of "Jacob's Ladder"? In the Book of Genesis, it is described as: A ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven. And behold, the angels of God were ascending and descending on it! As with so many other things in life, its interpretation may vary ever slightly depending on you ask. Since it's not my intention to question its interpretation, I'll solely focus on the part in bold and underlined. - - - - Back to the topic at hand... Recently, I tried to clarify on Reddit what I meant earlier pertaining the connection between Revan and the Infinite Empire: I did not mean to say that Revan was attempting to follow the same tyrannical tendencies as the Infinite Empire or anything, but more so that his evolution as a character is dependent on the legacy left behind by the Rakata. As I said earlier, a plaque on Rakata Prime says that Revan was at one point both Protector and Destroyer. This happened around the time the Mandalorian Wars and Jedi Civil War took place. 300 years later, he tries to do the same but ultimately fails. Why? I believe it's because his character evolution was disrupted, because the Force deemed this was not the natural path for him to come full circle. Regardless, what's they very thing that is always a constant in Revan's tale? The Rakata, the Infinite Empire and the vast repositories of knowledge and technology they left behind, almost as if someone knew what was to come. For him to evolve as a character, the logical step would be to ascend and become a god-like being with the intent of creating something. Regardless, as I said earlier, I honestly doubt it will come to pass. Maybe I'm reading too much into this but... Is it fair to assume the lines are supposed to represent an upward movement? Some sort of ascension? A ladder or stairway similar to Jacob's Ladder? One that would permit ascending and descending simultaneously? Death and rebirth? Time will tell. REVAN'S THIRD EYE: Would you still remember what the Trimūrti is by any chance? No worries. The Trimūrti, Tri Murati or Trimurati, is a concept in Hinduism "in which the cosmic functions of creation, maintenance, and destruction are personified by the forms of Brahma the creator, Vishnu the maintainer or preserver and Shiva the destroyer or transformer." These three gods have been called "the Hindu triad" or the "Great Trinity", often addressed as "Brahma-Vishnu-Maheshwara." They are different forms of the One person called the Supreme Being or Svayam Bhagavan/Lord Krishna/Parabrahman. For this exercise however, I shall focus in one element of the Trimūrti, namely Shiva... And the Third Eye the later possesses. Citing Wikipedia: The third eye (also known as the inner eye) is a mystical and esoteric concept referring to a speculative invisible eye which provides perception beyond ordinary sight. In certain dharmic spiritual traditions such as Hinduism, the third eye refers to the ajna, or brow, chakra. In Theosophy it is related to the pineal gland. The third eye refers to the gate that leads to inner realms and spaces of higher consciousness. In New Age spirituality, the third eye often symbolizes a state of enlightenment or the evocation of mental images having deeply personal spiritual or psychological significance. The third eye is often associated with religious visions, clairvoyance, the ability to observe chakras and auras, precognition, and out-of-body experiences. People who are claimed to have the capacity to utilize their third eyes are sometimes known as seers. Is it possible that the red light emanating from his visor is supposed to represent exactly that? Do note that Shiva, as destroyer / transformer of the Trimūrti, precedes Brahma the creator. As I said earlier: For him to evolve as a character, the logical step would be to ascend and become a god-like being with the intent of creating something. REVAN'S STANCE: Would you agree this stance is reminiscent of this one? The same armor all battered? The same hilt? The same enemy? Perhaps a story for another time. - - - - - - - - My analysis of the full teaser that is. Assuming you read this far, I hope you enjoyed it and that it provides some food for thought until more details for 3.0 arrive. Cheerio! Edited September 22, 2014 by Darth_Wicked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkelefantos Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 The stance just seems to be Revan's standard stance, he uses the exact same one in the Foundry. Even though the Emperor is his most logical enemy, you can't really determine that by looking at his stance. Or at least, it's a stretch . And honestly, at this point I wouldn't rule out the red flashing of his eyes as a lazy way to visualise that he's fallen to the Dark Side again without any deeper meaning . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSpectre Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I'm a huge Revan fan-girl. This post got me excited. However i do feel you might be reading too much into things, but I might be wrong considering Revan ALSO reads too much into things. Just as Devious and Cunning as Death. Nasty habit that Revan shows up at the "Wrong" time to screw everyone in the galaxy over? If i could (I really hope so) I'd sign on with Revan in a Heart beat. That man has the right idea about no Pubbies or imps. Nothing but Revan. For him to evolve as a character, the logical step would be to ascend and become a god-like being with the intent of creating something. Not gonna lie, that gave me *good* chills from reading that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkelefantos Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) I'm a huge Revan fan-girl. What if I told you that you don't have to repeatedly state this because it immediately becomes obvious in your posts? Edited September 22, 2014 by Darkelefantos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 22, 2014 Author Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) The stance just seems to be Revan's standard stance, he uses the exact same one in the Foundry. Even though the Emperor is his most logical enemy, you can't really determine that by looking at his stance. Or at least, it's a stretch . I thought of that as well but then again, his demeanor and garb on the Foundry differ slightly truth be told. And honestly, at this point I wouldn't rule out the red flashing of his eyes as a lazy way to visualise that he's fallen to the Dark Side again without any deeper meaning . I totally agree. I'm trying to be positive but then again, it is very likely that's what Bioware is going for. A shame if you ask me, considering it could be so much more. @DSpectre: Again, it is an interpretation, a visual analysis of the teaser we got, not much else. I'm not trying to pass things as facts or anything but more so provide points of reference here and there, as seen in other bodies of work. Edited September 22, 2014 by Darth_Wicked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSpectre Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 @DSpectre: Again, it is an interpretation, a visual analysis of the teaser we got, not much else. I'm not trying to pass things as facts or anything but more so provide points of reference here and there, as seen in other bodies of work. Oh i know, but one's imagination makes things seem alot better. We are long overdue for some classic Revan roflstomping, tho. I wanna see what made him famous in before Kotor 1. The military mastermind and war master. =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 Oh i know, but one's imagination makes things seem alot better. We are long overdue for some classic Revan roflstomping, tho. I wanna see what made him famous in before Kotor 1. The military mastermind and war master. =) Indeed. It is something we never got to see previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Krushya Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 I don't believe Revan was trying to destroy the Republic. As you mentioned that he destroyed a great deal but left worlds and structures intact. If you delve deeper and pay closer attention to the dialogue of Kreia and HK-47 in KoTOR II, you'll notice there was mention that Darth Revan was trying to STRENGTHEN the Republic by destroying people in power, entire worlds that could have destablized the Republic, while leaving the Republic's infrastructure intact. This lead me to believe that Darth Revan wanted to not only protect the Republic from a "greater threat," namely the True Sith Empire as we'll eventually come to know them, but rather give the Republic the means to defend itself. I believe Revan would have eventually succeeded, but Malak interfered and saw HIS chance to become the reigning Dark Lord of the Sith, by attacking Revan's flagship. Malak could not defeat Revan in personal combat as is evidenced by his new face accessory. I read on WookieePedia that Malak attempted to defeat Revan once before in a light saber battle and lost his jaw in the process. Destroying the Star Forge delayed the Sith Emperor's invasion plans, which most of us got the sense was coming anyway. When Revan regained most of this memories by the end of KoTOR he defeated Malak once and for all and saved his beloved Bastila Shan from the dark side. Eventually his memories called him to venture out into the "Unknown Regions" to confront the evil he sensed out there. We would not know how long delayed the Emperor's plans were until SWTOR came out. 300 years passed and no one knew the fate of Revan or of his friend Meetra Surik (The Exile) when she went off to find him. That's my take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 (edited) When Revan regained most of this memories by the end of KoTOR he defeated Malak once and for all and saved his beloved Bastila Shan from the dark side. Eventually his memories called him to venture out into the "Unknown Regions" to confront the evil he sensed out there. He only regained his memory entirely after recovering his mask, five years after the end of KoTOR. Before that, it was pretty much still fragmented. When he set out to the Unknown Regions, making stops here and there accompanied by Canderous, he did so precisely because of that: He was trying to regain the missing pieces. Edited September 25, 2014 by Darth_Wicked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allenion Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Fascinating post. While this may not be exactly what BioWare is going for, I'm sure this imagery fits in perfectly with their end goal. I am under the impression that the Emperor (or what's left of him) has imbued his consciousness into Revan and they have become one individual. My gut feeling is that the red light emanating from his visor is the power of the Emperor coming through. How else could Revan be reborn? Why else would he suddenly seem so much darker, leaning more towards his destroyer aspect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Krushya Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 He only regained his memory entirely after recovering his mask, five years after the end of KoTOR. Before that, it was pretty much still fragmented. When he set out to the Unknown Regions, making stops here and there accompanied by Canderous, he did so precisely because of that: He was trying to regain the missing pieces. Yeah. I understand that. I know Revan's memories were fragmented and that he didn't totally regain his memories until after he recovered he mask. I read the novel "Revan." But he was getting flashes of fragmented memory before he found the mask. That's what I was trying to say. It was implied to the dialogue of the 1st KoTOR game that he was getting flashes of memory not just the locations of the Star Maps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 Yeah. I understand that. I know Revan's memories were fragmented and that he didn't totally regain his memories until after he recovered he mask. I read the novel "Revan." But he was getting flashes of fragmented memory before he found the mask. That's what I was trying to say. It was implied to the dialogue of the 1st KoTOR game that he was getting flashes of memory not just the locations of the Star Maps. The memory flashes he gets during the first KoTOR pertain his confrontation with Bastila aboard his flagship. I can't remember if the one where he visits the Star Map on Dantooine with Malak was one of those however. After Malak tells him the truth aboard the Leviathan, they start to "pour" however; Regardless, not one concerns the True Sith in the Unknown Regions per se. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Krushya Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 The memory flashes he gets during the first KoTOR pertain his confrontation with Bastila aboard his flagship. I can't remember if the one where he visits the Star Map on Dantooine with Malak was one of those however. After Malak tells him the truth aboard the Leviathan, they start to "pour" however; Regardless, not one concerns the True Sith in the Unknown Regions per se. Right. You are right. I am not trying to state or imply more than that. I'm trying to avoid confrontation. I haven't played the KoTOR games in many years so my memories are becoming fragmented LOL. Thank you for helping to clear things up for me (us). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 Right. You are right. I am not trying to state or imply more than that. I'm trying to avoid confrontation. I haven't played the KoTOR games in many years so my memories are becoming fragmented LOL. Thank you for helping to clear things up for me (us). To be frank, I haven't played KoTOR either since before this game was launched, around July or August 2011 I think. I still play TSL quite honestly. The latter is so worth it, even today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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