jcurri Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 And if there is why isn't it stickied? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SammyGStatus Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 And if there is why isn't it stickied? JM Ayden? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devrius Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 And if there is why isn't it stickied? Since they decided GSF was a failure these forums no longer have any admins looking at it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommmsunb Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 JM Ayden? Yes it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verain Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I doubt the players could agree on the top five issues. Everyone would be too busy arguing over whether the rail sniper or the battle scout needs the larger nerfs. The top issue facing us, however, is that the devs are gone. Gone. Not here, gone. They aren't working on GSF, or at least, not in a way that makes sense. Proof: Two patches ago we saw a datamine go live that broke the XML that describes many items. It also had a nerf for Ion missile (both in effect and in tooltip) and EMP field (the effect was nerfed, the tooltip was not). This was clearly a work in progress, and the fact that the game engine could NO LONGER READ many of the tooltips was a pretty good clue on this. Effect: This stayed constant through every minor patch, then went live. It's still live, to this moment. Ion missile got nerfed with no patch notes, EMP field got nerfed with no patch notes or tooltip update (it says 4500, but really 3000, it used to be 4500, if you are going to post about this just instead go test it so you don't crap up the forums with lies), and many of our tooltips are incoherent ("deals damage over 0 seconds", "deals damage over <text terminates, missing two entire sentences"). This is our number one issue- if we had a single dev, this would get addressed. We would see this entire thing reverted (likely), or at least see patch notes on the nerfs plus tooltips updated to match what is in game plus tooltips working again. Also sab probe is broken if you take the "slows enemy" tier 5 talent. Workaround: don't take that talent, take the other one. That bug has been around for awhile, and maybe someone could fix that. Balance issues are secondary to new maps. A new game mode would be excellent, and new ship would help a ton. Even new cartel ship clones would go very far here. Lack of devs is our number one issue. Lack of content is our number two issue. Balance and bugs are pretty distant- the balance isn't that bad, the bugs aren't unworkable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeLM Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Everyone would be too busy arguing over whether the rail sniper or the battle scout needs the larger nerfs. Battle scout. Honestly it's not the frame, it's the components. Distortion field needs its missile break removed and replaced with something else, and TT and BO need severe nerfs. Then bump up their survivability on the frame, maybe. Also nerf armor pen so that damage reduction isn't a beginner's trap. Also BLC should not be the best laser cannon on any ship that can equip it. Some combination of the above changes is probably what the forum can come around to with enough persuasion. But like you said, none of that's going to happen. Edited September 22, 2014 by FridgeLM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaskar Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Battle scout. Honestly it's not the frame, it's the components. Distortion field needs its missile break removed and replaced with something else, and TT and BO need severe nerfs. Then bump up their survivability on the frame, maybe. Also nerf armor pen so that damage reduction isn't a beginner's trap. Also BLC should not be the best laser cannon on any ship that can equip it. Some combination of the above changes is probably what the forum can come around to with enough persuasion. But like you said, none of that's going to happen. No and no and hell no. 1. Take the reactor off the ship and it's fixed. TIE fighters did not have shields, just saying.... 2. TT & BO are fine. They act the same way on other ships that use them with the same lasers, people don't ***** because they are not on a target that is hard to hit. 3.BLC is superposed to be the best LC on the ships that it can be bolted too but the best T2 pilots use quads. Imagine that, I just blew a BLC sized hole in your theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin_Kelvar Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) 2. TT & BO are fine. They act the same way on other ships that use them with the same lasers, people don't ***** because they are not on a target that is hard to hit. Both of those, to the best of my knowledge, are scout exclusives (the latter being a T2 exclusive). It appears the consensus is that scouts, as an overall class but especially the T2, have too much burst because of these class exclusive components and the goal of nerfing those components is to reduce the entire scout classes burst, not just one variants. 3.BLC is superposed to be the best LC on the ships that it can be bolted too but the best T2 pilots use quads. Imagine that, I just blew a BLC sized hole in your theory. Arguably it depends on the build. I very much doubt the best T2 pilots using quads attempt to engage in close quarters dogfighting. BLC blows LLC and RFLs out of the water as best close range weapon. Which is a problem since they should all cater to different playstyles not be the be all end all close quarters blaster. It's in essence what HLCs would be to long range weaponry if they had the tracking penalties of MLC along with all their current strengths. Distortion field needs its missile break removed and replaced with something else Maybe reduce the evasion active time back to it's beta 3 second (so the left tier upgrade becomes really meaningful again) and make the right tier replace disto fields active and passive evasion with a missile break? I'd honestly be ok with the missile break if it meant sacrificing evasion since you'd have to choose between extra protection against missiles or extra protection against blasters but not get protection from both. A scout could choose to have the extra missile break but it would come at the cost of less passive and active evasion meaning you could more easily hit them with blasters (or if they go with evasion it means you more easily hit them with missiles). Balance issues are secondary to new maps. A new game mode would be excellent, and new ship would help a ton. Even new cartel ship clones would go very far here. Lack of devs is our number one issue. Lack of content is our number two issue. Balance and bugs are pretty distant- the balance isn't that bad, the bugs aren't unworkable. As a fellow vet I agree that, for us, this is the priority since it retains us and gives us reasons to keep playing. However, I think for the long term GSF population health bugs and balance are top priority. Newbies won't necessarily know the workarounds so when they see something broken they'll just be disgusted and leave. Likewise for us vets the balance issues aren't bad since we know the ways to combat most of the balance issues whereas newbies don't. And if a newbie feels balance is bad they'll leave. If a newbie is turned away by either thing no amount of new maps or ships will make them give GSF a second chance (or they'll return to check out the new stuff, see the exact same things that turned them away are still there and leave again for the same reasons they did the first time). Edited September 23, 2014 by Gavin_Kelvar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaskar Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) Both of those, to the best of my knowledge, are scout exclusives (the latter being a T2 exclusive). It appears the consensus is that scouts, as an overall class but especially the T2, have too much burst because of these class exclusive components and the goal of nerfing those components is to reduce the entire scout classes burst, not just one variants. Maybe in your neck of the woods. They just need to die easier. No "scout" should take three fully charged rails HITS to kill. Not two protons, not six HLC hits. They need to lose survivabilty and make the burst be the ONLY thing the class of ship has going for it. Arguably it depends on the build. I very much doubt the best T2 pilots using quads attempt to engage in close quarters dogfighting. BLC blows LLC and RFLs out of the water as best close range weapon. Which is a problem since they should all cater to different playstyles not be the be all end all close quarters blaster. It's in essence what HLCs would be to long range weaponry if they had the tracking penalties of MLC along with all their current strengths. Quads are mixed with pods at close range and do more burst than BLC and Clusters or BLC and pods. This statement says you don't play the ship. you should not talk about it in a authoritative way. Edited September 23, 2014 by zaskar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin_Kelvar Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Maybe in your neck of the woods. They just need to die easier. No "scout" should take three fully charged rails HITS to kill. Not two protons, not six HLC hits. They need to lose survivabilty and make the burst be the ONLY thing the class of ship has going for it. I don't disagree with them dying easier, I've hated evasion since the beta. But they're not going to strip away all (or almost all) it's evasion to compensate for their inherent high manual evasion gained from their speed and maneuverability. Like it or not evasion is a major factor in their survivability by increasing their effective hit points (I think someone once crunched the numbers and evasion gives them close to the same effective hit points of a striker). Quads are mixed with pods at close range and do more burst than BLC and Clusters or BLC and pods. This statement says you don't play the ship. you should not talk about it in a authoritative way. I do play scouts although I prefer strikers. Nevertheless perhaps I should clarify by close quarters I meant "high deflection shooting" which BLC is difinitively better at than Quads. No doubt quad'n'pod can be used in close quarters but what we're talking about is the individual weapon, not what it combines with to achieve overall best DPS. In any rate it doesn't change the fact that, of the close range blasters (BLC, RFL, LLC), BLC is by far better than the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaskar Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 1. Scouts live longer. They should have their shields adjusted, IE do away with the reactor. 2. We're taking ships not systems here. You have to take everything into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeLM Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) 1. Take the reactor off the ship and it's fixed. TIE fighters did not have shields, just saying.... 2. TT & BO are fine. They act the same way on other ships that use them with the same lasers, people don't ***** because they are not on a target that is hard to hit. 3.BLC is superposed to be the best LC on the ships that it can be bolted too but the best T2 pilots use quads. Imagine that, I just blew a BLC sized hole in your theory. 1) I don't have a problem with their survivability (except for missile break on distortion), I have a problem with their burst. It's outrageous and unjustifiable, especially when no other ship can come close. Frankly if you strip away some burst I'd be fine with upping their survivability elsewhere. 2) Actually, people do complain about TT on speed scouts, because it's just as awful to be blown up before you can react no matter which ship is doing the burst. TT is overpowered. 3) Can you show me a design document that indicates that BLC is "supposed" to be the best laser on any ship that can equip it? In-practice it is especially in close range high mobility dogfighting, but given this game has at least half a dozen laser variants that all cost the same requisition I somehow doubt this component was intended to blow away all competition. And I'll have to drop a giant [Citation needed] on your claim that "the best" T2 pilots use quads. Edited September 24, 2014 by FridgeLM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin_Kelvar Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) 2. We're taking ships not systems here. You have to take everything into account. And you're completely ignoring my point that some weapons are inherently better than others (again BLC being distinctly superior than all other close range blasters). Put them on the GS, they're the go to weapon for close quarters, put them on a scout built for high deflection shooting at close quarters same thing. People NEVER take a different weapon unless they're going for a totally different build/style (such as quad'n'pod which is not even attempting to be a high deflection dogfighting style due to neither weapon being good at high deflection shooting). Edited September 24, 2014 by Gavin_Kelvar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verain Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) Quads are mixed with pods at close range and do more burst than BLC and Clusters or BLC and pods. This statement says you don't play the ship. you should not talk about it in a authoritative way. There are several solid type 2 scout builds. Quads and pods deals burst damage, but it's a pretty different type of burst damage. It's very controlled by cooldowns, and the damage is incredible. It's also mitigated by armor and mobility. Chared Plating shuts it down. BLC and pods is less damage versus most targets, but more versus armored ones. BLC and cluster gets damage in when quads and pods cannot. It's definitely better at dogfighting, but can't perform anything close to the quads and pods in terms of erasing enemies. Edited September 24, 2014 by Verain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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