Kaggath Battlegrounds Heats - Empire of Plagues vs Imperial Droid Division

[Beniboybling]

As for the LoT staying in such a close orbit, wouldn't that be...a BAD idea for the EoP? Granted it isn't heavy stuff, but that would put it in range of the ground defenses which while light compared to it, would still be able to nibble on it. If the Fleet were to come in as well the ship would be unable to move much. Though, I do wonder if the fleet has enough tractor beams left to stop/slow its immediate fall so that they can evac those beneath it.

 

Idea: If the LoT is right over the battle ground, the fleet engages and everything bellow evacuates well beyond the radius the Flagship would crash into. All that needs to be destroyed, are the dovin basals. That done, it plummets downward crushing Lomi and Muur, winning the day for the IDD.

Don't think they'd be able to reach, I mean its in the atmosphere, but that's still fairly high up.

 

I can imagine that the spider droids might be able to zap at it, but they would soon become occupied. Also parts that break off could plummet and cause damage to the planet.

 

One thought I has was that if the explosives thrown at the LoT were big enough, most the ship could be vaporised and so the city would only be subject to pumice and debris as opposed to a hulking carcass. Still risky though.

 

Also could bombard from above, but honestly I feel Muur will be counting on the disastrous possibility of it crashing into the planet to protect it. Literally parking it right above the city and daring anyone to shoot it down.

 

Interesting idea though, but such an evacuation would take time, and leave the IDD exposed.

[Beniboybling]

GG

Lol what does GG even mean and why do people keep saying it!?

 

It means good game right? Don't see how that applies.

[karadron]

Yeah actually know I think about it they could just land than on the IDD's BOE.

 

OK, replace that argument with drops pods are deployed into several skycrapers, which then deploy EoP troops who set the skyscrapers up as BOEs. They might be capable of using some kind of vongforming technique, or Killik technique to reinforce these buildings with organic matter, I am sure that both races had this power.

 

So yeah, far less destructive but still effective.

 

I'm going to say that a drop pod would not have the capacity to carry enough troops and material for that to work, unless they split it 50/50. Even then the EoP only has so many starting Killiks. Splitting their forces in this situation could be just as bad.

 

Numbers vs High Quality in tight spaces = Pyrrhic numbers win or Decisive Quality win.

[Canino]

What?

 

Rackghouls were idiots, they couldn't climb fences ffs, all they wanted was meat.

 

The only self aware one was 171A, because it's a force sensitive, force driven Virus, Virus' that are actually scientifically created won't be able to absorb knowledge.

 

None of Warrens virus, except the one that's basically her faction committing Suicide, can absorb Knowledge, at least, to my knowledge

 

 

"How can they use speeders and weapons? The rakghouls on Taris are mindless!"

"I know the truth now, Zayne. The plague carves out and discards the targets personality—but the being's learned skills remain, waiting to be activated. So, while raks on their own serve only their hunger, the wielder of the talisman can draw upon what they were."

―Zayne Carrick and Celeste Morne

 

Rakghouls only truly reached their full potential, however, when under the power of the Muur Talisman. When a being possessed the Muur Talisman, they were able to enslave the rakghouls to their will, and command them as an army with the potential for nearly infinite expansion. Under the talisman's effects, rakghouls became more demure, and were able to call upon the knowledge and skills they had possessed in their former lives. Unfortunately, though, their former personalities could not be restored, as all that remained in the rakghouls was an imprint of who they had once been.

Under the Muur Talisman, or Muur, they retain skills and knowledge.

[Silenceo]

I'm going to say that a drop pod would not have the capacity to carry enough troops and material for that to work, unless they split it 50/50. Even then the EoP only has so many starting Killiks. Splitting their forces in this situation could be just as bad.

 

Numbers vs High Quality in tight spaces = Pyrrhic numbers win or Decisive Quality win.

 

This is just such the situation that reminds me of my signature. I am sure if the EoP pulled this tactic, the IDD could afford to recall a few squads of Dark Troopers to exterminate the infestation above. The lifts would still be secure, but patrols would be less active for a few hours while the topside was taken care of.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Silenceo

[karadron]

 

"How can they use speeders and weapons? The rakghouls on Taris are mindless!"

"I know the truth now, Zayne. The plague carves out and discards the targets personality—but the being's learned skills remain, waiting to be activated. So, while raks on their own serve only their hunger, the wielder of the talisman can draw upon what they were."

―Zayne Carrick and Celeste Morne

 

Rakghouls only truly reached their full potential, however, when under the power of the Muur Talisman. When a being possessed the Muur Talisman, they were able to enslave the rakghouls to their will, and command them as an army with the potential for nearly infinite expansion. Under the talisman's effects, rakghouls became more demure, and were able to call upon the knowledge and skills they had possessed in their former lives. Unfortunately, though, their former personalities could not be restored, as all that remained in the rakghouls was an imprint of who they had once been.

Under the Muur Talisman, or Muur, they retain skills and knowledge.

 

They only retain their skills, not their knowledge. The Rakghouls were nothing without the talisman and even with it they were solely controlled by the person who controlled it. The evidence actually points in the opposite that any knowledge was retained, since their personality is drained. In fact that quote only says that skills remain not any personal knowledge.

[Beniboybling]

I'm going to say that a drop pod would not have the capacity to carry enough troops and material for that to work, unless they split it 50/50. Even then the EoP only has so many starting Killiks. Splitting their forces in this situation could be just as bad.

 

Numbers vs High Quality in tight spaces = Pyrrhic numbers win or Decisive Quality win.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yorik-trema

 

Capacity: 36 passengers/35 metric tons

 

Times that by a dozen for each building. and I'd say that is more than enough to transport the necessaries, and I'm sure they'll have enough Yorik-tremas to field all that they would need to set up a BOE.

 

P.S. Roughly 60 of these would be needed to transport their entire ground force. I reckon they could split there force in half thanks to the rakghouls and mount a proper offense from the Uppercity.

[Canino]

They only retain their skills, not their knowledge. The Rakghouls were nothing without the talisman and even with it they were solely controlled by the person who controlled it. The evidence actually points in the opposite that any knowledge was retained, since their personality is drained. In fact that quote only says that skills remain not any personal knowledge.

 

Rakghouls only truly reached their full potential, however, when under the power of the Muur Talisman. When a being possessed the Muur Talisman, they were able to enslave the rakghouls to their will, and command them as an army with the potential for nearly infinite expansion. Under the talisman's effects, rakghouls became more demure, and were able to call upon the knowledge and skills they had possessed in their former lives. Unfortunately, though, their former personalities could not be restored, as all that remained in the rakghouls was an imprint of who they had once been.

I guess you missed that part

 

And while yes this is purely with the talisman, it is still quite the advantage to the AiR. Give the talisman to Plo and send her into to combat on the back of a leviathan. Plo+talisman+leviathan=insta win:D

 

I kid of course. But still effective.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Canino

[Beniboybling]

This is just such the situation that reminds me of my signature. I am sure if the EoP pulled this tactic, the IDD could afford to recall a few squads of Dark Troopers to exterminate the infestation above. The lifts would still be secure, but patrols would be less active for a few hours while the topside was taken care of.

Mmm, I think this warrants discussion of actual ground forces vs ground forces.

 

Note though that the intentions of the EoP will be to spread your forces thing. They will realise that together as a unit they are a nigh unstoppable hammer, but if spread across multiple fronts they will be easier to pick off.

[Beniboybling]

And while yes this is purely with the talisman, it is still quite the advantage to the AiR. Give the talisman to Plo and send her into to combat on the back of a leviathan. Plo+talisman+leviathan=insta win:D

 

I kid of course. But still effective.

Could prove disastrous is Plo loses the Talisman, I doubt Muur would part with it.

[karadron]

Could prove disastrous is Plo loses the Talisman, I doubt Muur would part with it.

 

Muur parting with that talisman would be like Yoda parting with his humor, not going to happen.

[Beniboybling]

Muur parting with that talisman would be like Yoda parting with his humor, not going to happen.

Or his

[Silenceo]

Mmm, I think this warrants discussion of actual ground forces vs ground forces.

 

Note though that the intentions of the EoP will be to spread your forces thing. They will realise that together as a unit they are a nigh unstoppable hammer, but if spread across multiple fronts they will be easier to pick off.

 

Yet the EoP would be unable to leave the skyscrapers of the upper city once there, and due to their positioning would be much easier to lock down than normal. The vehicles which are not being used for the Lower City conflict, would go and guard the entrance/exit of these buildings. Perhaps firing at the ships after they had landed.

 

Like I said regarding the Lower City patrols, they would not take any of the forces from the check points, but rather the patrols that were operating. Considering there are about 30-50 per drop mod, and say about 10-20 actually landed on the sky scrapers *the other 10-20 landing in the streets, likely mopped up by the vehicles and concsripts.* that would be a relatively easy situation for a few patrols of Dark Troopers to clean up. Each patrol likely would have 2 PII's and probably 10 PI's per patrol would likely be able to handle each of the pods. That would divert approximately 100-200 PI's and 20-40 PII's. While it would be a good chunk of their forces, the PIII's would still be defending the Lifts, as well as all of the remaining forces.

 

Due to the location, and the vehicles aiding the patrols, I find it highly unlikely that the EoP on the Upper City would spread beyond their skyscrapers. Due to each of these being isolated from each other they can not group up for strength, superior numbers divided does not equate to superior numbers power. In other words, the EoP would be out of their element, stranded, and unable to make a run for it. They would be hunted down rather easily by the dispatched patrols and gunned down. They know exactly where these pods are, unlike the Lower City war where they are still searching.

[Canino]

Could prove disastrous is Plo loses the Talisman, I doubt Muur would part with it.

 

But can it be lost? It seems it as though that may be difficult:

 

The power of the Talisman also allowed its claws to become legs for mobility and bound itself to anyone who called to it.

 

I don't really understand this, but it seems that as long as Plo called for it to her, it would attach itself to her.

[Warren-Stride]

As Canino pointed out, these rakghouls are not the rakghouls we have seen on Taris before, either in SWTOR or KOTOR. Muur's Talisman allows him to control these creatures and turn any suitable being within a wide radius into a rakghoul. Essentially, the sentient being population (including aliens) around the AiR HQ would be transformed into rakghouls at the very start of the Kaggath. As far as the Undersity gangs such as the Black Vulkars, all Muur needs to do is walk into their base, hold up the talisman, and BOOM no more criminals.

 

And the knowledge of these people, along with their skills (such as blaster wielding) would be retained due to the talisman's power. They would be smarter, more cunning, and more than just mindless beast. Although they would lack sentient thought, they would be forever-loyal servants of Muur's will.

[karadron]

But can it be lost? It seems it as though that may be difficult:

 

The power of the Talisman also allowed its claws to become legs for mobility and bound itself to anyone who called to it.

 

I don't really understand this, but it seems that as long as Plo called for it to her, it would attach itself to her.

 

Yeah but if it's latched on to Muur it would be a contest of wills, if Plo has the stronger will it would go to her. Then again it is his talisman, it probably would be permanently attached to him.

[karadron]

As Canino pointed out, these rakghouls are not the rakghouls we have seen on Taris before, either in SWTOR or KOTOR. Muur's Talisman allows him to control these creatures and turn any suitable being within a wide radius into a rakghoul. Essentially, the sentient being population (including aliens) around the AiR HQ would be transformed into rakghouls at the very start of the Kaggath. As far as the Undersity gangs such as the Black Vulkars, all Muur needs to do is walk into their base, hold up the talisman, and BOOM no more criminals.

 

And the knowledge of these people, along with their skills (such as blaster wielding) would be retained due to the talisman's power. They would be smarter, more cunning, and more than just mindless beast. Although they would lack sentient thought, they would be forever-loyal servants of Muur's will.

 

No the Muur Talisman only works on humans. Nonhumans would have to contract the disease the normal way.

 

 

Although having Muur walk into an alien bar and act all high and mighty with his talisman and it not working would be pretty humorous.

[Silenceo]

No the Muur Talisman only works on humans. Nonhumans would have to contract the disease the normal way.

 

 

Although having Muur walk into an alien bar and act all high and mighty with his talisman and it not working would be pretty humorous.

 

*Bounty Hunters glance at the wanted signs, and see that Muur is wanted for 100,000,000,000,000 credits dead.* *Epic Bar Brawl ensues, with the IDD being contacted for the reward pickup.* (Muur likely kills them all, but not before the IDD has closed in on the position)

[Canino]

Yeah but if it's latched on to Muur it would be a contest of wills, if Plo has the stronger will it would go to her. Then again it is his talisman, it probably would be permanently attached to him.

 

If he willingly gives it to her that problem is solved...

 

And let's not forget he didn't even create the talisman, it was given to him by Sorzus Syn, so I highly doubt it is permanently attached to him (lets also look at Vader & Celeste Morne).

[Warren-Stride]

I think we should discuss Jerec's "safety". The AiR vehicles are best used hunting Force-Sensitives. As such, they will be best used going after Jerec. This includes the Leviathans and the Voxyn.

 

Leviathan will smash through the IDD forces. They were known to be very agile, despite their size, so climbing up the buildings is no issue. Leviathans interfered with the sense abilities of Force Users, causing them to hear screams, develop headaches, and become obsessed with making the mental pain stop. As Silenceo has pointed out, Jerec is very in-tune with the Force. Unfortunately, this would work against him, as he would be more susceptible to the effects of the Leviathans, essentially able to hear the screams louder, absorb more mental attacks, and develop more impulsive behaviors due to his extreme exposure to the power of SIX of these things.

 

Voxyn, on the other hand, can sense Force Sensitives through the Force and have many offensive abilities: sonic blasts (their signature opening attack), flesh-melting acid, disease-coated claws, and a poisonous barbed tail. They were extremely durable, able to heal quickly, resistant to explosives, and have the ability to function normally even when severely injured. Their agility and durability negate the firepower of the IDD defenses, and their acid spit could melt through metal and their sonic blasts are potent enough to shatter solid objects.

 

Once this strike-force of Force-sensitive-killing creatures reaches Jerec, it's all over.

[Warren-Stride]

No the Muur Talisman only works on humans. Nonhumans would have to contract the disease the normal way.

 

 

Although having Muur walk into an alien bar and act all high and mighty with his talisman and it not working would be pretty humorous.

 

Source?

 

From what I'm reading on Wookieepedia, anyone who was not Force Sensitive was effected.

 

"Through use of dark side alchemy, any non-Force-sensitive that was struck by the Talisman became infected with the rakghoul plague and transformed more quickly than from rakghoul bites in the Under City of Taris. In addition to that under the command by a Force-user the Talisman could transform into rakghouls all suitable beings in much wider radius."

Edited July 20, 2014 by Warren-Stride

[Warren-Stride]

If he willingly gives it to her that problem is solved...

 

And let's not forget he didn't even create the talisman, it was given to him by Sorzus Syn, so I highly doubt it is permanently attached to him (lets also look at Vader & Celeste Morne).

 

Although I tend to agree that Muur wouldn't part with the talisman, an argument had occurred to me in which Lomi Plo has the talisman, hides herself from the minds of the Lowercity inhabitants, and just runs throughout the city, blasting people with it an turning them into Rakghouls.

[Selenial]

If Muur's talisman only works on Humans, then the EoP won't get many properly useful Rakghouls until they reach the upper city, most of the inhabitants of the Lower city were entirely Alien populations.

[Warren-Stride]

If Muur's talisman only works on Humans, then the EoP won't get many properly useful Rakghouls until they reach the upper city, most of the inhabitants of the Lower city were entirely Alien populations.

 

There's no evidence to support that claim.

[Warren-Stride]

Conscription probably would be highly effective. People's homes are being endangered, and when that a lot of people will want to defend it, no matter how terrible it might be. The Lower City could easily turn into a protracted guerilla conflict between the EoP and certain gangs, some supplied by the IDD. In this case the advantage of numbers is gone. Hit and runs, backdoor raiding, lift sabotage, anything that could slow down or hinder the virus.

 

My Morale Argument:

 

People, no matter their discipline or allegiance or training, are still people. Fighting undead, green blobs, brainwashers, and mutations would and should terrify anyone with an amygdala. Fighting AiR is going to be emotionally and mentally taxing, and it’s going to take an obscene amount of bravery to put up a fight against nightmarish forces like these. I’m not saying it can’t be done, but I think evaluating the physiological impact of fighting monsters that could turn you and your friends into monsters if you get too close is a valid argument.

 

Basically, these are people. Not heroic, strong, trained fight-for-glory military personnel. If a zombie outbreak really did happen in the United States, do you think people would stay in their homes and try to fight it? Heck no! I'd be on the next flight to Switzerland. (Because zombies respect neutrality, right?)

 

Rakghouls are basically like Star Wars zombies. Not the literal kind like Project I71A, but close enough. It would be cliche and point out the women and children, really I should just point out that any sane person would book it. Or at least try to.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Warren-Stride