Yet another Companion Combat Role Re-Spec thread

[SW_display_name]

(why GenChat?

Because this is more of a discussion topic than a suggestion, since this usually creates some debate )

Because we need a new one every once in a while to remind you guys players still want this.

 

Why do I want to be able to change the Combat Role of my Companions? Here's some quick reasons off the top of my head:

• Because I want my Wookiee to use a Bowcaster.
  
• Because I'd rather have Risha healing me, since Guss Tuno permanently stopped being funny after about 1 hour and now makes me want to disable in-game sound.
  
• Because I'm already a Tank, so I wish my favorite comp, Lord Scourge, wasn't self-defeating and useless to have out.
  
• Because I'm already a Tank, so I wish my favorite comps, Khem & Xalek, weren't self-defeating and useless to have out.
  
• Because I'm already a Tank, so I wish Tanno Vik and M1-4X weren't self-defeating and useless to have out.
  
• Because I'm already a Tank, so I wish Qyzen and Iresso weren't self-defeating and useless to have out.
  
• Because I'm already a Tank, so I wish Blizz and Skadge weren't self-defeating and useless to have out. Also yes, I like Skadge. Haters can hate. Yolo. Swag. etc. etc.
  
• Because I don't really need a Tank on my Sniper, so I'd much rather have Kaliyo & SCORPIO stop doing silly amounts of Threat and just focus on DPS.
  
• Also while we're talking about Troopers — because I'm Havoc Squad and don't want idiot squad members running up and meleeing Sith when we're all trained soldiers with blaster rifles and assault cannons.
  
• Because making C2-N2 Tank would satisfy something malicious deep inside me.
  
• Because Malavi Quinn makes me a sad Twi'lek for many reasons, but I like having a Healer, and I'd much rather make Vette do it... or hell, make Pierce respec Combat Medic.
  
• Because Jaesa Sin-Tanking for my Marauder would make me happy.
  
• Because Dr. Lokin creeps me out and I'm pretty sure he's like a quintuple-agent, so I'd rather have Temple as my Healing backup when I've got deeps covered.
  
• Because I cannot take Talos Drellik seriously and would rather not burst out laughing constantly during dark, serious battles because his foppish voice keeps reassuring me I'm fine, so I'd rather have a different Healer, please.
  
• Because I'm already a Healer, so I'd rather Mako not be 1000% redundant and actually accompany me places.
  
• Because I'm already a Healer, so I'd rather Tharan not be 1000% redundant and actually accompany me places.
  
• Because I'm already a Healer, so I'd rather Elara not be 1000% redundant and actually accompany me places.
  
• Because I'd rather adventure with my imaginary CPU lover/spouse, and not feel hampered by role redundancies.
  

 

Obviously this list is rough and highly-personal. But that's the point — Companions are a hugely intimate, personal thing for people and everyone develops their own favorites and least-favorites.

 

IMO it's flawed design to then pressure people into using specific ones not out of Story/Lore/Flavor/RP preferences, but brute-force efficacy once you get the swing of the combat system.

 

Some points:

• I'm not saying every Comp needs to do every role. This would be ideal, but even giving each Comp 2 roles to choose from (and I mean seriously, not the ghetto 'Stance' changes that just ultra-gimp the Comp) would be a step forward.
  
• This doesn't have to be magical. You can repurpose ability animations and designs from other Companions in a cut+paste fashion if necessary. The functionality would be the most important thing.
  
• I would love Force-using Healers/Tanks instead of the stock "Every healer is a Scoundrel, every Ranged Tank is a Vanguard" formula... but see above. If that's stretching the 'Time to Do This' budget too far, just give us more options at least.
  

[hallucigenocide]

they could all use an overhaul tbh.. especially the dpsers they seem so weak that you hardly notice any difference from the tank and healer comps.

[DomiSotto]

I agree. As long as it doesn't mess up a special ability like Holiday, I am all for it. I often end up choosing my role so I could use a specific companion as primary. In other words, yeah, I play a melee DPS so I can play with Scourge eventually.

 

Tbh, I would settle for every companion having the healer spec option in addition to their normal role to fall back upon. The more, the merrier, obviously, but this would be something that will make things better right away for me personally on basically every toon.

Edited May 10, 2014 by DomiSotto

[thewitchdoctor]

Yes, please.

 

I almost always roll with a healer companion for non-stop killing. Which means, I almost always just use Treek (or HK on my PT), because the default healer companions for most of my played classes: 1) assassin, Talos, "Oooh, we won?;" 2) smuggler, Gus, "I healed you with Jedi power!;" 3) guardian, Doc, "I'm a male whore!;" and 4) marauder, Quinn, "Yes, my Lord;" are all horrible! And Quinn should be a wall decoration in my new mansion anyways (See My BEG post).

 

My PT, with Mako, is about the only winner in that list.

 

But, if I could have Vette as my healer for my marauder? Blizz on my PT? "UTINI!" I'd be very, very happy.

[Daekarus]

I agree with the gist of this thread - I've wished for it many times. However, do you think that this change risks diluting the identity the devs went through the trouble to create for each companion? I'm not sure if it does or not.

 

I will say that getting your presence boosted to 300+ with Legacy unlocks really helps. After levelling a few toons I was able to switch from Elara Dorne to M1-4X for endgame stuff simply because I liked him. When he has good equipment an is boosted by presence he is just fine in his attack stance.

[Darth_Wicked]

I greatly enjoy having companions assuming specific roles, the way they are in-game. I wouldn't have no desire whatsoever to change them around myself.

 

However, I kinda wish that just like with Treek and HK-51, some of the original companions abilities took into account - for example - when an enemy is stunned, CC'ed and so forth, since it's annoying to forget to disable AoE attacks and have them breaking CC repeatedly.

 

I would have also liked - for example - to have a ranged Tank companion to either use something similar to Force Pull or Force Leap, instead of being locked to one ability alone.

 

Regardless, I don't see it ever coming. It would just devalue whatever new companion to be released at a later date, not to mention the ones you can acquire in the game already, like Treek and HK-51.

Edited May 10, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Damask_Rose]

Yes please!

 

My marauder needs to spend more time with Vette. He's finding Quinn a little too appealing now...

 

My sniper would like to spend time with her husband, even if he can't seem to dress himself.

 

My commando thinks Elara is much cuter than Vik or Yuun and he'd like to get to know her better.

 

My sorcerer would like to play with Talos since she can't steal Quinn away from my juggernaut.

Edited May 10, 2014 by Damask_Rose

[SW_display_name]

I agree with the gist of this thread - I've wished for it many times. However, do you think that this change risks diluting the identity the devs went through the trouble to create for each companion? I'm not sure if it does or not.

To be honest, it actually does that already because the Devs are forced to shoe-horn Companions into odd roles just to fit your "1 of each" requirement.

 

Some examples:

• Why is Tanno Vik, a demolitions expert who uses a blaster when you meet him on Balmorra, suddenly a sword-wielding Melee Tank?
  
• Same with Yuun? Why is a Havoc Squad soldier doing MDPS? Right, because we're supposed to have a mTank and a mDPS.
  
• Why is my advanced combat droid M1-4X unable to understand a command like "Stay back and shoot rockets so you don't sustain unnecessary damage, good boy"?
  
• Why is a selfish psychopath like Kaliyo going out of her way to take all the damage and heat herself?
  
• Why is my Jawa a tank? Because it's funny? It stopped being funny after about 5 minutes.
  
• Why is my fey archaeologist suddenly a medic?
  
• Why is my Kilik-infested diplomat suddenly running around acrobatically slashing things with a weird pointy vomit blade?
  
• etc.
  

 

What I'm saying is, the roles are already largely arbitrary. Only in rare cases (like Doc) do the roles represent an actual part of the character's story, rather than a fudging-around square peg / round hole to fit the 1-of-each requirement.

 

Like, let's look at Mako.

• Why is she a healer? Really? She's a cybernetic slicer urchin. But it's okay — she's 'gentle' ... ish... so we can accept it.
  
• Why wouldn't she be able to swap to RDPS with a blaster pistol, though? She's also a feisty survivalist that's been hanging out with the scum of the galaxy for years.
  

 

Skadge?

• He's a giant slab of angry meat. Alright, makes sense he's a Melee Tank — he'd have no issues barrelling in first or taking heat.
  
• Can you imagine Skadge complaining, though, if you told him "Just kill everyone you see with your bare hands and let me keep them distracted"?
  

 

Temple? Does she even have a personality to go against?

• "You, shoot things with your blaster pistols." Yes, sir!
  
• "You, take this tricorder and make me feel better when I start bleeding." Yes, sir!
  

 

Vette?

• "Stand back and shoot things." — Vette is happy
  
• "Stand back and heal me." — Vette is happy
  

 

Blizz?

• Why is our Jawa on the front lines? Yes it's funny, but really, why?
  
• vs. hey Jawa — stand back and destroy things with your improvised artillery. Utini!
  
• vs. hey Jawa — stand back and heal me with your unreliable scavenged medtech junk. Utini!
  

 

etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. ... etc.

 

Like, it's a totally legit question and I'm glad you asked it. Just, my response is: "I think it probably just enhances the companions' identity if done properly, or possibly makes some of them feel more appropriate to their personality/identity".

[Darth_Wicked]

^^ Now you're probably venting a bit too much.

 

Not to mention that by NOT mentioning Tharan and "airlock" in the same sentence automatically defeats everything you've said thus far.

[thewitchdoctor]

I've had this conversation a number of times, and the one thing (surprisingly) is that not everyone feels the same way about all companions. (Like, who likes Quinn or Corso? One is a traitor and the other is a whiny stalker who doesn't know the meaning of "Bugger Off;" but some people like them!)

 

So, I don't think that putting a 'Companion Role Change Kit' on the Cartel Market would make any of the companions less desirable. I think it would go a long way in making people CARE more about at least one of their companions.

[RandomXChance]

So since almost every companion already has two roles, this is just another thread about having every companion be a healer because people are too lazy to figure out how to use DPS and tank comps. Yes, DPS comps/stances need adjusting because they are very weak, but that is all that is needed.

 

Learn how to use the various companions the way they are designed. Lets not just make them all the same because players cannot be bothered to learn how to manage their companions.

Edited May 10, 2014 by RandomXChance

[Wahala]

Weeeelllll,

 

Generally all the companions have 2 "specs" (Like healing and DPS or Tank and DPS) that you can turn off or on ... In fact, you can turn them both off ... and you can turn off any "abilities" you don't want to use. (Like AOE stuff). So IMHO I think Bioware has done a fantastic job on companions. It is true that you can't get heals from a Tank (or tanking from a healer) except for Treek (talkative little munchkin that she is). I think that wanting every companion to be able to replace every companion is just a bit beyond. It is really kind of picky to want this or that ability on every companion (like 7 each character). I LIKE the variety, and just use whoever I want whenever I need and see no problems with them. Maybe I am just easy to please and would like the devs to concentrate on more content instead of revamping everything.

 

Good luck tho.

 

-

[DomiSotto]

I am not running with healers by default, I am running the 1000 kills on each, then switch to my beloved comp for each class on the next re-equip cycle. But I notice that healers make the best supporting role, and require the least equipment to function well & next to no maintenance. Shooting Tanks seem to be better than Melee tanks by some reason as well.

 

My favorite companion, the one I would add for every class if I could, is actually a DPS. Don't care if a shooting DPS is lousy in everyone else's opinion. I can't wait to grind through the nest 2 companions to get back to playing with my fav one.

 

Also, the OP's point that using a companion in a similar role as the PC. I would love to play all 8 classes, and might do male alts on some, but I don't know how many times I can run the game.

 

Finally, there are companions I am not interested in equipping but want that1000 kills on. Sticking a healing class on them allows to do so easily in their starting gear. Otherwise you have to rig them up.

Edited May 10, 2014 by DomiSotto

[Darth_Wicked]

I've had this conversation a number of times, and the one thing (surprisingly) is that not everyone feels the same way about all companions. (Like, who likes Quinn or Corso? One is a traitor and the other is a whiny stalker who doesn't know the meaning of "Bugger Off;" but some people like them!)

 

So, I don't think that putting a 'Companion Role Change Kit' on the Cartel Market would make any of the companions less desirable. I think it would go a long way in making people CARE more about at least one of their companions.

 

Way to downplay what he did and why he did it.

[casirabit]

Finally, there are companions I am not interested in equipping but want that1000 kills on. Sticking a healing class on them allows to do so easily in their starting gear. Otherwise you have to rig them up.

 

Incorrect. Trying running a healer in Oricion in starting gear. How long will they last? Not long enough to get the 1000 kills you want.

 

A companion in starter gear healer or not for a level 55 would not last very long. This may be okay for some lower levels but not when you get into the higher levels.

[SW_display_name]

^^ Now you're probably venting a bit too much.

I'm... not venting anything? It's just my assessment of each companion.

[casirabit]

As far as re-spec the companions I don't see any need for it but that's my opinion. I use the companion that best fits the situation but most of the time it is my Hk droid. I have used al my companions depending on what I needed.

 

I am not one that cares about romancing a companion. Frankly I find scripted romance boring and predictable.

 

Whether they do it or not doesn't bother me but in my opinion not needed.

Edited May 10, 2014 by casi

[Darth_Wicked]

I'm... not venting anything? It's just my assessment of each companion.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=7411635&postcount=8

 

Your "assessment" sounds a bit like venting to me, unless venting has a different meaning altogether for you.

 

Also, I'm not exactly sure why Temple's personality would even have an issue with her dual-wielding pistols but that's just me.

 

The fact that you somehow believe that Bliz, as a scavenger, would serve better compared to Mako and her slicing abilities is a bit of a eye-roller, for example. I assume the later understands a bit more of technology, thus she would be more akin to using kolto and that kind of stuff?

Edited May 10, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[RandomXChance]

Incorrect. Trying running a healer in Oricion in starting gear. How long will they last? Not long enough to get the 1000 kills you want.

 

A companion in starter gear healer or not for a level 55 would not last very long. This may be okay for some lower levels but not when you get into the higher levels.

 

When you are just looking for the 1K kills achievement, why in the world would you go to Oricon!?!? I left them in starter gear and went to early planets and did other achievements while getting the 1K. What a non-starter argument.

 

As they are now, there is mostly logic to the 2 roles (most of) the companions can do.

 

There are the pure dps comps based on Marauders/Snipers. All of the others can be healer/dps or tank/dps. This makes sense since the tanks do damage to get aggro and even the medics need weapons for protection from the dangers of the galaxy. Letting any comp do any of the three roles completely annihilates any semblance of logic. Skadge as a healer (terrible bedside manner!), Gus Tuno as a tank (well I guess stupid dialogue is great aggro generation).

[DomiSotto]

Well, do you have to play with a companion on Oricon? I am talking the normal sequence of planets. Sorry, I should have specified it.

 

Like, who likes Quinn or Corso? One is a traitor and the other is a whiny stalker who doesn't know the meaning of "Bugger Off;" but some people like them!

 

Uhm, I like both of them. Riggs has a wonderful VA, one of the best, and Mal's quiet struggle for dignity is touching. He appeals to my maternal (my BT pure Sith leaps into action with a battle cry "Will you LEAVE MAL ALONE?!" when he draws aggro, I swear) Both are not immediately likable, I give you that, but there are ways to make them RP well with the main character. Plus Mal has the best Oriental overlay in the game (well, IMO).

 

In fact, it's the sadness of letting go of Guss' functionality back to Riggs's content-trove AND having to grind with minimally upgraded Jaesa when I have perfectly set up Mal that makes me secretly wish I could... just, you know, spec J as a healer and eliminate 1000 toons without having to worry about that woman dying on me or paying for her equipment only to last till Pierce comes shouldering in.

 

In defense of Guss, I had one of the best moments in the game punching him in the face, but now I see some surprising depth in his dialogues and he is genuinely funny sometimes as well. If only he were a Nautolan...

Edited May 10, 2014 by DomiSotto

[hallucigenocide]

So since almost every companion already has two roles, this is just another thread about having every companion be a healer because people are too lazy to figure out how to use DPS and tank comps. Yes, DPS comps/stances need adjusting because they are very weak, but that is all that is needed.

 

Learn how to use the various companions the way they are designed. Lets not just make them all the same because players cannot be bothered to learn how to manage their companions.

 

i'd be fine with that make them more attractive to use.. dps companions are only good if they're really good geared whereas a healer comp works fine with crap gear.

[Darth_Wicked]

When you are just looking for the 1K kills achievement, why in the world would you go to Oricon!?!? I left them in starter gear and went to early planets and did other achievements while getting the 1K. What a non-starter argument.

 

As they are now, there is mostly logic to the 2 roles (most of) the companions can do.

 

There are the pure dps comps based on Marauders/Snipers. All of the others can be healer/dps or tank/dps. This makes sense since the tanks do damage to get aggro and even the medics need weapons for protection from the dangers of the galaxy. Letting any comp do any of the three roles completely annihilates any semblance of logic. Skadge as a healer (terrible bedside manner!), Gus Tuno as a tank (well I guess stupid dialogue is great aggro generation).

 

Imagine...

I TANK YOU WITH JEDI POWER.

AGROOOOOOOOOOO...!!!

Edited May 10, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[SW_display_name]

So since almost every companion already has two roles,

No they don't. The alternate 'stance' is pathetic and even if it was boosted, half+ of their skill bar is still neutralized when they try to switch roles. I'm asking for actual role identity changes.

 

this is just another thread about having every companion be a healer because people are too lazy to figure out how to use DPS and tank comps.

No it isn't, and now I seriously question whether a) you read what I wrote, and b) if you did, whether you have basic reading comprehension.

 

Since I suggested about 10x for a Tank comp to pick up an MDPS, my Wookiee to have RDPS or RTank so he can Bowcast like a Wookiee should etc.

 

Also, you appeal to the standard forum "You want something different, therefore you are stupid / ignorant / lazy" response, which honestly — that's getting old, love.

 

First of all: "figure out" how to use a DPS comp? Are you serious? Please enlighten us about what sort of elaborate flowchart is required to let your DPS comp autoattack and kill things.

 

For that matter, it takes about as much effort to 'figure out' how to exploit a Healer comp properly — simply leaving them on passive healing duty vs. micro'ing their CC, LOS'ing them to draw mobs, swapping them to DPS stance when you're barely taking any damage, etc is about as much 'figuring out' as telling your Tank comp to go smash things.

 

Learn how to use the various companions the way they are designed. Lets not just make them all the same because players cannot be bothered to learn how to manage their companions.

Have you ever compared different Healer companions? Have you noticed they all use the exact same abilities? Have you noticed we have no Force-based healers? Have you noticed they're almost all Scoundrel-based, not even a Merc thrown in?

 

You know what makes our companions different? Their identities. Every comp has a different look, personality, storyline, etc. This makes them stand out against each other significantly more than whether they share some bland and uninspired combat abilities with another comp.

 

This isn't about "learning how to use" anything. It's about wanting to use different companions in different ways, because your playstyle is not compatible with the role a given comp is shoehorned into.

 

No, I really don't need a second healer for exponential healing power when I'm already heal spec. No, I really don't need 2 Tanks 1 Mob when I'm already Tank spec.

 

But someone does like the comps in those roles — hence why I'm simply asking for the ability to fine-tune what they do.

 

Or to play it your way: Stop being lazy, and learn to RP more and create more detailed storylines for your characters, so you appreciate why it's frustrating to be stuck with a given companion fulfilling your only option for a given role.

[Darth_Wicked]

In defense of Guss, I had one of the best moments in the game punching him in the face, but now I see some surprising depth in his dialogues and he is genuinely funny sometimes as well. If only he were a Nautolan...

 

I'm still surprised to this day how come we didn't get a Nautolan companion...

Edited May 10, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Sangrar]

they could all use an overhaul tbh.. especially the dpsers they seem so weak that you hardly notice any difference from the tank and healer comps.

 

really? I was using my geared tank comp for a long while up until I switched to using a geared dps companion (not even hk mind you) and I immediately noticed how much faster mobs got cleared and bosses went down compared to tank