why strongholds and not your ship

[Ecilin]

been thinking about it why go with strongholds and not allow decoration of your ship I would much rather decorate my ship as I actually have people in it from time don't think anyone goes to other peoples houses in most games and this one will be no different.

[Denerio]

I agree. Our ships should of been the main focal point of player housing.

[Darth-Obvious]

Because it would conflict with the quest scripting and cutscenes that take place on your ship(s)

 

For example you can't move the holoterminal on the ship anywhere because there are too many cutscenes focused on it. You also couldn't put anything like a chair near it either because you or one of your companions would clip through it during a cutscene.

 

Basically there are too many cutscenes where characters move around on the ships that make customizing it to any large degree impossible.

 

The only kind of customization you can/could do to ships would be flat surfaces, ie things like different textures, carpets, etc.

[Ecilin]

never thought about the cut scenes but sure there would be way around it

 

I know I for one spent more time decorateing my ship in swg then I did my house was cool to see peoples reaction to how my ship looked so realistic when they would come on board to man the turrets

[Infernixx]

I agree. Our ships should of been the main focal point of player housing.

 

In an ideal world, that's what it would have been.

 

As it happens, the reason it doesn't work is because of the cutscenes and whatnot that are a part of our Ships. We can't change the look of the interior without screwing all that 1.0 stuff up.

 

Housing, however, is brand new and can be designed and programmed to do all these things that we want to do with it, like the Legacy bank.

 

So, while I think they would have eventually figured out how to change the insides of our Ships(and may well do so in the future), they went with the quicker and easier solution of just making Strongholds for now.

[Greyhamea]

They should at least allow customizations in your ship that won't interfere with cut scenes. They have added things to ships already (mailbox, GTN for example), we just need more of those.

[HiddenPalm]

been thinking about it why go with strongholds and not allow decoration of your ship I would much rather decorate my ship as I actually have people in it from time don't think anyone goes to other peoples houses in most games and this one will be no different.

 

I'm sure they're working on it. They have to tweak the ship cut-scenes so that they show the background as you the player has changed it to appear in the cut scene and not allow furniture to be in the way of a companion for example walking through it. It's not impossible as suggested by posters in previous posts on this topic. Its just going to take a little longer than the apartments and guild ships we will be allowed to furnish. I imagine this will come with many features on our ships to be finished, like the ladder to the gun turret, the holochess tables, crafting table, medial computer, etc.

[aeterno]

Cut scenes are probably just the most superficial problem we can see.

 

Under the hood a whole new bunch of code around strongholds is a much cleaner way to do it than to go code around and/or rewrite what has to be one of the core parts of the game. A whole bunch of problems could arise that'd manifest themselves not as clipping but as game breaking bugs.

 

Yes given enough effort they could do it. They could also code a new superior engine and give us a functioning Illum, given enough effort.

 

Reality is even with enough resources it would have still been better to do strongholds as the effort that would have taken ships becoming basically customizable can be spent on doing more with strongholds. More space, more options, more variety, more features.

[JimG]

Housing, however, is brand new and can be designed and programmed to do all these things that we want to do with it, like the Legacy bank.

Exactly, this is a new thing so it's a blank slate....easier for them to do legacy banks, set up customization options, etc. than changing the existing ships.

[Darth-Obvious]

never thought about the cut scenes but sure there would be way around it

 

I know I for one spent more time decorateing my ship in swg then I did my house was cool to see peoples reaction to how my ship looked so realistic when they would come on board to man the turrets

 

The only way around it would for the items to not show up in cutscenes, which too many people would complain about. They would want the items they purchase to be seen and reflected at all times.

 

They should at least allow customizations in your ship that won't interfere with cut scenes. They have added things to ships already (mailbox, GTN for example), we just need more of those.

 

Those things are in places that don't present a problem and sometimes they don't show up in cutscenes.

 

If you were able to see the game in it's development state, ie the way the dev team can, what you'd basically see in the dev tools on the ships are a bunch of colored lines, nodes, etc, that all indicate some sort of action or trigger. The legacy items you're referring to are in specific places on the ship(s) that don't interfere with any of these points. For instance the GTN Terminal isn't on a wall that character ever leans on in a cutscene.

 

The problem is that these unused areas are few and far between on the ships. The other big part of it being that X thing has to work for every different class ship. For instance a Agent ship might have less cutscenes on it than a Smuggler ship does so even if you found a place for X item on a Agent ship the devs might not find space for it on the Smuggler one.

 

Doing anything on the force user ships must be a huge pain in the *** because the ships are shared. For example there might be an area of the Jedi Knight's ship that is light on cutscenes or has none but that area could have alot of cutscenes for the Consular. Actually I know this to be the case having played through both stories. Certain areas get used more than others depending on class.

 

There aren't too many things that wouldn't cause problems. Texture swaps present no problem. Rugs/carpets shouldn't present an issue, nor should any wall fixtures unless a character leans on a wall. You could also have stuff hanging from the ceiling as long as it didn't hang down low enough to touch any characters.

 

There's some stuff you could play around with in terms of customizing ships, but not a lot, or nearly the amount that people would want.

 

I'm sure they're working on it. They have to tweak the ship cut-scenes so that they show the background as you the player has changed it to appear in the cut scene and not allow furniture to be in the way of a companion for example walking through it. It's not impossible as suggested by posters in previous posts on this topic. Its just going to take a little longer than the apartments and guild ships we will be allowed to furnish. I imagine this will come with many features on our ships to be finished, like the ladder to the gun turret, the holochess tables, crafting table, medial computer, etc.

 

Yeah no, they're not going to go back in and readjust nearly every cutscene on the ships just for some furniture.

 

The only time I can think of where they ever changed anything in a cutscene was with the Dread Masters helmets, but that didn't require any angle changes, or rescripting, just model swaps.

 

They didn't go back and adjust anything with the Cathar when they added them (except Aric) and that was just audio related stuff, and I imagine the Voss will be the same (if they're adding them) so there's no way they're going to go back and tweak anything on the level your suggesting.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Darth-Obvious

[Andryah]

Cut scenes are probably just the most superficial problem we can see.

 

Under the hood a whole new bunch of code around strongholds is a much cleaner way to do it than to go code around and/or rewrite what has to be one of the core parts of the game. A whole bunch of problems could arise that'd manifest themselves not as clipping but as game breaking bugs.

 

Yes given enough effort they could do it. They could also code a new superior engine and give us a functioning Illum, given enough effort.

 

Reality is even with enough resources it would have still been better to do strongholds as the effort that would have taken ships becoming basically customizable can be spent on doing more with strongholds. More space, more options, more variety, more features.

 

/Agree.

 

Given a choice of:

 

A) implementing a project by building a new set of content on unique new code (in this case Strongholds).

 

OR

 

B) trying to peel through existing code (in this case players ship content) written by people no longer present, and not break more things then you fix as you poke around, change wiring, etc. etc. etc.

 

Based on my years of experience.... Im'a go with A.

B is a suicide option....though it could be a meta-game for professional complainers too.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Andryah

[Drudenfusz]

/Agree.

 

Given a choice of:

 

A) implementing a project by building a new set of content on unique new code (in this case Strongholds).

 

OR

 

B) trying to peel through existing code (in this case players ship content) written by people no longer present, and not break more things then you fix as you poke around, change wiring, etc. etc. etc.

 

Based on my years of experience.... Im'a go with A.

B is a suicide option....though it could be a meta-game for professional complainers too.

Nearly every major patch had broken something withing the game, and the addition of the legacy stuff to the starship had caused some issues with cut scenes. Somehow I think that BioWare does a poor job in code documentation and I wouldn't be too surprised if nobody who programmed the starships is still around. So, yes, I agree, I doubt there is much improvement on our ships to be expected in the future... The one minor thing I still hope is that we might get one day an option for new paintjobs for them too (GSF does that from the start, but I am pretty sure, those fighters use completely different coding), and that will be true for the strongholds, they will be done quite differently from the intereior of our starships.

[Edzew]

never thought about the cut scenes but sure there would be way around it

 

I know I for one spent more time decorateing my ship in swg then I did my house was cool to see peoples reaction to how my ship looked so realistic when they would come on board to man the turrets

 

heh i was the exact opposite. but then again i never had anything bigger than a single man ship B^P i also ran a store out of my house so i actually had people in my house all the time.

 

but in TOR i don't see why we would have other players in our homes other than maybe guild mates and even then what would be the point?

 

unless you are a RPer

[Sarfux]

Your ship is the place to travel the galaxy. Your home is the place to settle down. Play house, settle down, kick back and relax etc. As the ship droid says "its meant to be your home away from home" and your home will be strongholds, your ship is the home away from your home. Why? Because they would have to redo all the cutscenes for the ship and all that. I agree with the choice they made. Plus, they will keep adding other planets and they will have great, great views. I favor the Strongholds over the ships.

[RaiderMid]

I hope these Strongholds are pretty cool just to chill in, craft, ect. As far as my ship goes, it's just transportation to me and I generally never hang around on my ship any longer than necessary.

[HiddenPalm]

Yeah no, they're not going to go back in and readjust nearly every cutscene on the ships just for some furniture.

 

The only time I can think of where they ever changed anything in a cutscene was with the Dread Masters helmets, but that didn't require any angle changes, or rescripting, just model swaps.

 

They didn't go back and adjust anything with the Cathar when they added them (except Aric) and that was just audio related stuff, and I imagine the Voss will be the same (if they're adding them) so there's no way they're going to go back and tweak anything on the level your suggesting.

 

Why would you say there is only one way around it? There are a million ways around it. Here's one way. If they use a LOTR style housing method for the ships where you are only allowed to put furniture in specific places with specific sizes of things they allow you to place on those specified places, then it would be fine. For example if there is a cut scene with a companion walking, that companion would not bump into anything, because you cant just place a chair where ever you want. Reviewers online have already suggested this is probably how housing will work.

 

Bioware figured all of this out ages ago and are only now releasing the beginning of their results. Nothing in gaming is impossible, ever.

Edited March 28, 2014 by HiddenPalm

[Sarfux]

I hope these Strongholds are pretty cool just to chill in, craft, ect. As far as my ship goes, it's just transportation to me and I generally never hang around on my ship any longer than necessary.

 

You are going to be pleasantly surprised.

[Ecilin]

if old code and ex employees is a valid reason for not doing something then they might as well close the game now cause even the best new code will still interfere with the old code in one way or another when its all integrated

 

I would just like to see a reason for strongholds something that actually has players coming to your house <and don't say the lame *** prestige they announced nobody gives a crap it will mean about as much as legacy achievement points absolutely nothing>

 

being as there is virtually no market in this game unless your a coms vendor even running a store out of your house like in swg isn't an option

 

personally housing just will serve no purpose other then money sink and another category they can add to the cartel market can already see the blogs come check out the new exclusive cartel market furniture that nobody will ever see lol.

 

after reading more and more on the topic today and me loving to decorate stuff I have decided I will just pass there is no way they will do it as well as games like swg or everquest 2 did

 

most likely this will be a poor imitation like everything else in this game with limited items and options so going to just save my money.

[Docmal]

The cut scene problem is easy to fix... You cant customize your ship until you reach 55 and finish your missions. Then you can purchase a ship upgrade that has a new bigger layout that is customizable.

[Darth-Obvious]

if old code and ex employees is a valid reason for not doing something then they might as well close the game now cause even the best new code will still interfere with the old code in one way or another when its all integrated

 

It's not about interfering with old code, they do that all the time. There's just no reason to devote the amount of resources to it over new content.

 

If you could have any 1 new feature what would it be? Would it honestly be ship customization? How far down on your list of things you want to see in order before you get to ship customization?

 

I would just like to see a reason for strongholds something that actually has players coming to your house <and don't say the lame *** prestige they announced nobody gives a crap it will mean about as much as legacy achievement points absolutely nothing>

 

What reason do other players have for coming to your ship?

 

Housing in games is generally for RPing, vanity, or showing off. There's really nothing beyond that. Lots of games have allowed players to visit other players living quarters but there's never really been any good reason and TOR isn't going to be the game to change that.

 

personally housing just will serve no purpose other then money sink

 

Yeah, how stupid of them to add something like this. I mean if all it's going to do is make money for them what's the point?

 

after reading more and more on the topic today and me loving to decorate stuff I have decided I will just pass there is no way they will do it as well as games like swg or everquest 2 did

 

Check out Wildstar. Housing is a big feature of theirs.

 

most likely this will be a poor imitation like everything else in this game with limited items and options so going to just save my money.

 

Yeah maybe, but then again maybe you'll wise up and spend your time doing things you actually like doing.

[Darth-Obvious]

The cut scene problem is easy to fix... You cant customize your ship until you reach 55 and finish your missions. Then you can purchase a ship upgrade that has a new bigger layout that is customizable.

 

That isn't fix and is actually pretty bad from a business perspective because then you're limiting it to only a section of the game's population. In other words they stand to make less money off it that way.

 

There's also nothing saying there won't be future cutscenes involving your ship.

 

Even with problems/limitations that exist you could still make the ship look pretty different. Different textures sets alone would go a long way. You just can't really alter the geometry in any significant way.

[Hoshkar]

I would have loved to see the ships become a housing sort of thing, but I can understand why that would be hard for them to do over a new system using instanced homes on various planets. It is still nice to see these sort of things added to games that are lacking them. Why newer MMOs even launch without some sort of housing system on day one is beyond me at this point. They make an awesome time and money sink for the game, and become very addicting very fast

[Greyhamea]

I would much prefer having ships that can be customized to having an apartment that I can add things to. Doesn't mean that I won't get a house, but if I had to chose which I think they should have spent time on, it would have been ship customization. Especially since I already considered that this games version of player housing.

 

And I'm fine with changes in ships not being anything that really affects the layout.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Greyhamea

[Darth-Obvious]

I would much prefer having ships that can be customized to having an apartment that I can add things to. Doesn't mean that I won't get a house, but if I had to chose which I think they should have spent time on, it would have been ship customization. Especially since I already considered that this games version of player housing.

 

And I'm fine with changes in ships not being anything that really affects the layout.

 

I'm sure they will add ship customization in a limited fashion at some point however it's one of those things that even in a limited fashion would be fairly time consuming since they'd be having to do it across 6 different ship models.

 

That's the other benefit for them to do housing, ie one single layout versus 6 different unique ones. That's assuming that each apartment layout is the same per planet, but if each of the 3 are unique then that's still only 3 layouts.

[MWidowmaker]

you cant add more rooms to ships like you apparently will be able to do with strongholds