I-ku-u Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I've opened a ticket for this bug, but in a necessarily very abbreviated form. Short form: During this event it became clear to me that many players are aware of a kill stealing mechanic *and* taking advantage of it. Situation 1: One of my mid-level alts tags one of the rakghoul event mobs (infected <foo> or rakghoul, doesn't matter) - starts DPSing while the level appropriate adds spawn - kills first mob only to find some nearby 55 has engaged the adds and usually kills them quite quickly (depending on the level of my alt). Said 55 gets sole credit for the kills. It happened so often for my mid-20 level alt that he barely got any adds killed - this was *very* annoying. Situation 2: My main, a level 55 who I have played so sporadically since before the Hutt Cartel came out that she is still only partially geared in Basic level gear, tagged a Fungal Breeder. During the fight, a nearby player (not grouped) went all out DPSing, even tho' I had not asked for help. The mob's nameplate was red to me the whole fight (in which I was fully engaged, just to be clear), yet I did not get credit for the kill and the other player looted it. Initially I wasn't even sure this was a bug, but my search efforts found only references confirming my understanding that tagging the mob is sufficient to ensure kill credit. From situation 2, this is clearly not the case. My *guess* now is that total DPS is the deciding factor, but I really have little info to work with. As to situation 1 - if the mobs are specifically *spawned* for a particular character/group, why allow anyone else to get credit at all, especially as they despawn if the players disengage from the fight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 It's not a bug, the mobs spawned and the other players got the tag first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-ku-u Posted January 25, 2014 Author Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) It's not a bug, the mobs spawned and the other players got the tag first. Then I see that my description of events was not sufficiently clear. In situation 2, your comment clearly doesn't apply and I fail to see how my description thereof could be misunderstood by any competent reader. In situation 1 I was attempting to explicitly describe a different form of what appeared to be the same case, but I did not intend to exclude situation 2 from the sequence of events experienced by those alts - my bad. There were some fights where my mid-level alts would tag all the adds and yet still lose the kill credit to a 55 that had not yet engaged by the time of my tagging. To put it another way, when on my alts I first assumed it was because of lack of tagging, but tagging the adds first to address the issue made no discernible difference. Edited January 25, 2014 by I-ku-u Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowermanx Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Yeah, this is odd, and I dont understand why, especially when the ghoul mobs on alderaan proper, lock the second they spawn in most cases. To help get around it, just try and get some damage on as many as you can asap before starting your kills, you only need the tiniest amount to lock them to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cawyden Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I agree that this sounds like a bug because if the mob was spawned for you and you are fighting it, the reward should only be yours. Concerning the other player that fought your mob I have to add that I have sometimes the problem that I get into fight mode because I am near a mob that is fighting someone else. If this is the case, I normally "help" clearing the mobs so that I can proceed without being in fighting stance. The other reason is that the mobs normally spawn not directly near you but more in the distance and sometimes even run off to a different player. I try to kill them with AOE as fast as I can because those player is faced not only by his mobs but mine as well. But then of course it is possible that I kill not only my own mobs, but if they have the same level there is no way to distinguish between them. So it doesn't have to be on purpose that someone stole your reward, maybe it was due to other reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-ku-u Posted January 26, 2014 Author Share Posted January 26, 2014 Here are more specifics regarding situation 2: The Fungal Breeder spawned next to me while I was looking at a pub player that had just walked up. I had death field prekeyed, so I *immediately* clicked near the Breeder, which aggro'd it to me, causing it to turn to me, then Khem as he grabbed aggro from me. Death field opens with instant damage, so at this point I undeniably tagged the mob, given the way tagging is supposed to work anyway. As I the placed my dots on the breeder I noticed the pub player (unflagged btw, in case it matters for the devs) close in and open up with his DPS. This caused the breeder to die quite quickly compared to what I was used to when taking them down solo - which is why I explained my gearing in the initial post. Since my suspicions were already primed by the events with my alts, I explicitly noted that the Breeder *stayed* red to me the entire fight while also doing my normal attack sequence. Yet when the mob died, the pub player looted the breeder and I didn't get credit (I know because I was tracking the relevant achievement). It is simply not possible for the conventional understanding of tagging to explain this sequence of events. It also seems impossible for lag to explain this, as the sequence of events was otherwise fully consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prototypemind Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 This can happen even with 55 vs 55. I've opened with aggro-pulling attacks and still lost credit for the kill on Breeders. I've had 55s try and taunt the Breeders off me to steal the kill, but thus far that has not worked. I've gone to only pulling them with my Sin now as they are not instantly able to be targeted and getting standard attacks on them can be wonky with my Jugg or Mara. It's also easier to work from stealth with my Sin and position where I can hit them from anywhere as they spawn much more effectively than some others. It is quite a pain that the kills can be stolen considering the possible drops that come from these champions. I've had flagged pubs try and get themselves positioned to flag so they can gank me and steal the kill as well, but that I've also managed to avoid. There do seem to be some issues with locking the loot to whoever initiates at times though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLynkes Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) I was fighting one of those Frenzied plague people (the one that drops the Pale Rakling) and mid-fight it suddenly rubber-banded to a player about 50m away (flew through the air at high speed). It immediately turned grey and I was locked out, and it ceased being "mine." I had already caused it quite a bit of damage, so by the normal rules it should have been my kill, but it wasn't. It seems the NPC patroling droids can steal your kills. They aren't bound by the usual rules. Even if you got the first hit in, if one of those big beggars starts shooting at a baddie, you get locked out. I have also had characters in their 20s somehow attracting the zombies from a level 55 player, and I didn't use any AoE or anything. In fact I have had them come at me when I haven't used any attacks at all. Also I've had level 20something tank companions stealing aggro from nearby lvl 55 players somehow. What the? Time to run when that happens, I think. As for genuine kill-stealing, well it is annoying when you spawn a bunch of bad guys for your level 30 to fight, and some sneaky level 55 you hadn't noticed quickly kills them all before you have had a chance to do anything. That's not really a bug, just a feature of the mechanics of the event, but it is pretty pathetic. I show them the contempt they deserve and laugh at them. "Mobs your own level too tough for you, eh? Poor thing. There, there." Edited January 26, 2014 by PLynkes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowermanx Posted January 27, 2014 Share Posted January 27, 2014 I was fighting one of those Frenzied plague people (the one that drops the Pale Rakling) and mid-fight it suddenly rubber-banded to a player about 50m away (flew through the air at high speed). It immediately turned grey and I was locked out, and it ceased being "mine." I had already caused it quite a bit of damage, so by the normal rules it should have been my kill, but it wasn't. It seems the NPC patroling droids can steal your kills. They aren't bound by the usual rules. Even if you got the first hit in, if one of those big beggars starts shooting at a baddie, you get locked out. I have also had characters in their 20s somehow attracting the zombies from a level 55 player, and I didn't use any AoE or anything. In fact I have had them come at me when I haven't used any attacks at all. Also I've had level 20something tank companions stealing aggro from nearby lvl 55 players somehow. What the? Time to run when that happens, I think. As for genuine kill-stealing, well it is annoying when you spawn a bunch of bad guys for your level 30 to fight, and some sneaky level 55 you hadn't noticed quickly kills them all before you have had a chance to do anything. That's not really a bug, just a feature of the mechanics of the event, but it is pretty pathetic. I show them the contempt they deserve and laugh at them. "Mobs your own level too tough for you, eh? Poor thing. There, there." Indeed, Ive seen some really strange behavior with some of these mobs, truly bizarre Also, I took more notice of the pulls in the tunnels, and the first shot doesnt lock it to you, it tells the server what level you are and then spawns the appropriate mob, then the next shot locks it, so what I found was its best to use a channeled aoe attack so the damage keeps up while the server makes that transition. I had far less problem after doing this with thieves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-ku-u Posted January 28, 2014 Author Share Posted January 28, 2014 Indeed, Ive seen some really strange behavior with some of these mobs, truly bizarre Also, I took more notice of the pulls in the tunnels, and the first shot doesnt lock it to you, it tells the server what level you are and then spawns the appropriate mob, then the next shot locks it, so what I found was its best to use a channeled aoe attack so the damage keeps up while the server makes that transition. I had far less problem after doing this with thieves. Yes, well, while it's easy to come up with work arounds, it doesn't change the fact that it's a bad and likely buggy mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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