DroidDreamer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I like it when they do it. Shows an inexperienced pilot. He starts shooting. I start shooting. He pops distortion. I expect that, and immediately boost past him. I turn around. His distortion is expired by now, and he is still only halfway turned towards me(a stopped ship turns like a pregnant whale). I blast him out of the sky. Mission accomplished. Add two more people doing that in the same fight. That's what I saw tonight. And yeah I killed a few. That's beside the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Add two more people doing that in the same fight. That's what I saw tonight. And yeah I killed a few. That's beside the point. Two more people doing that in the same fight = two more enemy pilots being useless. Suits me just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeyedSeer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 same more and more people just hidding under the points and popping distortion the second you make a dive at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeyedSeer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 In other words, you chose option B: A twitch game CAN have a random element and still be a twitch game. Good. Now we can do away with the silly claim that RNG has no place in GSF just because it is a twitch game. Note that it is absolutely within your right to consider twitch games with RNG not as good as twitch games without RNG - its all personal preference. I for one like it the way it is now. ( so far most of the posters on here have agreed with with the op. as i side note i get it you like the game the way it . the op was that evasion should not be in this type of game because it is being abused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) same more and more people just hidding under the points and popping distortion the second you make a dive at them. Yes. When they are tucked into a corner under a satellite it is very annoying to deal with, i agree. Best is to make a fake run at them until they pop distorton, pull up, and make another run a few seconds later. But this is not always viable when there are many ships dogfighting around the sat. (Note however that this is a problem with the 'hiding under sat' tactic, not evasion. A strike fighter with directional shields set full front is just as annoying, if not more, since he can sit there and hit targets ~7000m away') This is one of the reasons i am looking forward to see bombers in the game. They should be very good at dealing with this kind of tactic. Edited January 13, 2014 by Sharee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeyedSeer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Yes. When they are tucked into a corner under a satellite it is very annoying to deal with, i agree. Best is to make a fake run at them until they pop distorton, pull up, and make another run a few seconds later. But this is not always viable when there are many ships dogfighting around the sat. This is one of the reasons i am looking forward to see bombers in the game. They should be very good at dealing with this kind of tactic. Stop we get it you dont agree with the op your responses are starting to get the to point of trolling. the whole point of the thread was that evasion should not be in GSF because its is broken in the way it works. i dont care about your tactics. To the point you view on it was that it should not be taken out because if they took it they would have to buff scouts speed and who wants to see a faster scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luneward Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) This is one of the reasons i am looking forward to see bombers in the game. They should be very good at dealing with this kind of tactic. Unfortunately, bombers are going to be very good at abusing the tactic, too. Especially since they don't even need to stick their noses out of their perch to attack people. My main concern with bombers is they appear to be a very low skill unit. Edited January 13, 2014 by Luneward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeyedSeer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 The ship design is: Sure, they could do away with evasion and instead buff the difference in speed between strikes and scouts so that scouts are just as hard to hit as they currently are with evasion, however do you really want scouts to be so fast they can cross the distance between A and C satellite in 2.5 seconds? I don't. ^^^ i would like faster scouts that can do there job. which is to be the first to enter the fight and then run down the fleeing ships ~voice of randy savage~( your going nowhere) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Stop we get it you dont agree with the op your responses are starting to get the to point of trolling. I was replying to your post on a public forum. And i was actually agreeing with you. I don't know what your problem is. Unfortunately, bombers are going to be very good at abusing the tactic, too. Especially since they don't even need to stick their noses out of their perch to attack people. My main concern with bombers is they appear to be a very low skill unit. I thought so too originally. But then i was made aware that bombers do not have any way to break missile locks. Also, they do not have access to distortion shield. A missile strike fighter will be able to tear them apart from distance if they try to camp under a sat. Edited January 13, 2014 by Sharee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armonddd Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Sharee's back to quote mining while ignoring everything that disagrees with him/her, so I'm out. Add two more people doing that in the same fight. That's what I saw tonight. And yeah I killed a few. That's beside the point. Unless you're arguing that they're not fun to play against instead of that they're overpowered (and I'd disagree with you anyway, because easy kills), it's definitely not beside the point. Edited January 13, 2014 by Armonddd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Sharee's back to quote mining while ignoring everything that disagrees with him/her, so I'm out. I did not ignore anything. I addressed every point you made, including those borderline off-topic(like a certain wikipedia link). Last one being you agreeing that a twitch game *can* have a rng element. Which, as far as i am concerned, resolves the debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armonddd Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I did not ignore anything. I addressed every point you made, including those borderline off-topic(like a certain wikipedia link). Last one being you agreeing that a twitch game *can* have a rng element. Which, as far as i am concerned, resolves the debate. Except you didn't, and I didn't actually say that. Learn to debate if you want people to take you seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Except you didn't, and I didn't actually say that. Learn to debate if you want people to take you seriously. You DIDNT actually say that, huh? There are games that involve both of these elements; we call them twitch games that rely on luck as well as skill. So you DID say that after all. Twitch games CAN involve luck. Like, say, GSF right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NalRethak Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Two more people doing that in the same fight = two more enemy pilots being useless. Suits me just fine. Useless? Not really. That tactic just sux. especially when you figure that you're dogfighting alone around someone standing still. It forces you to move out of range, then come back. Just to get shot by a missile or two. Or have drawn interest from his nearby friends. I love to nail those kind of people, but playing only against that kind of people is really boring. That's pretty boring to go after a GS that is standing still above a satelitte hidden between 3 turrets, OS everyone coming. or 10kms above the map, in outer space where they know they have: - Enough time to move into position for any upcoming foe - Range superiority for anyone. You find it fun to pawn their asses, and I spen my time doing it also. But you don't seem to realize that there's a problem if a space combat game is mainly played by people with stationary fighters and succeed at it? That's not how it is supposed to be played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcurri Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Evasion shouldn't be in the game. this... if you want evasion, um... FLY EVASIVELY ... DUHHHHHHHHH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin_Kelvar Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) ^^^ i would like faster scouts that can do there job. which is to be the first to enter the fight and then run down the fleeing ships ~voice of randy savage~( your going nowhere) They're already pretty dang fast and well suited to hit and run tactics, especially if using barrel roll for added mobility. If they decide to get into an attrition dogfight it's their own bloody fault if it goes south on them. While speed will get you out of range of weapons it isn't the primary means of taking evasive action (assuming at this point your taking evasive action because you're already under fire). That's the maneuverability part of your ship, and scouts are already pretty maneuverable without upgrades. That being said I could see buffing the agility of both scouts and strikers a little bit. Don't fly straight and minimize the amount of predictable evasive pattern and it'll buy you a few extra seconds to get out of range. I've successfully taken manual evasive action in a strike fighter and it sure as heck bought me a few more seconds than I would've had just flying in a straight line. My impression is that evasion acts as a crutch that rewards sloppy flying by not forcing players to learn how to manually take evasive action/not fly in straight lines so much. I will grant taking manual evasive action is slightly harder in this game than in others because you're flying with your crosshair not actually flying the ship. So having a "lock crosshair to center" toggle on/off button (ideally usable while flying) would be a great help (whether using a mouse or, if ever implemented, stick) but it's not like the controls are so horrible that taking manual evasive action isn't possible. If ships are so sluggish that they "need" an evasion mechanic because even speed/agility upgrades aren't enough it seems to me that what this logically means is that what is actually needed is a buff to the relevant base stats as evasion is simply acting in that scenario as a band aide for the real problem. Edited January 13, 2014 by Gavin_Kelvar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeyedSeer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) They're already pretty dang fast and well suited to hit and run tactics, especially if using barrel roll for added mobility. If they decide to get into an attrition dogfight it's their own bloody fault if it goes south on them. While speed will get you out of range of weapons it isn't the primary means of taking evasive action (assuming at this point your taking evasive action because you're already under fire). That's the maneuverability part of your ship, and scouts are already pretty maneuverable without upgrades. That being said I could see buffing the agility of both scouts and strikers a little bit. Don't fly straight and minimize the amount of predictable evasive pattern and it'll buy you a few extra seconds to get out of range. I've successfully taken manual evasive action in a strike fighter and it sure as heck bought me a few more seconds than I would've had just flying in a straight line. My impression is that evasion acts as a crutch that rewards sloppy flying by not forcing players to learn how to manually take evasive action/not fly in straight lines so much. I will grant taking manual evasive action is slightly harder in this game than in others because you're flying with your crosshair not actually flying the ship. So having a "lock crosshair to center" toggle on/off button (ideally usable while flying) would be a great help (whether using a mouse or, if ever implemented, stick) but it's not like the controls are so horrible that taking manual evasive action isn't possible. If ships are so sluggish that they "need" an evasion mechanic because even speed/agility upgrades aren't enough it seems to me that what this logically means is that what is actually needed is a buff to the relevant base stats as evasion is simply acting in that scenario as a band aide for the real problem. yea i agree that the scouts are alittle bit faster but its not much sadly most of the time i have to pop my thruster regen to run down a fleeing ship which doesnt feel right when its a strike or gunship. the clunky flying controls dont help as well as you pointed out but no i think they need to take the evasive abilty out and just give the scouts just a slight buff to there base stats nothing truly big. personaly the flashfire aka a wing is one of my fav ships. on the plantside mission i tend to fly i high as i can and dive down on unaware baddies. and the space i tend to hide in the fields and dart out to snag a sniping gunship. its really lovely to see people panic when they get power dived out of nowere. Edited January 13, 2014 by DarkeyedSeer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) [nevermind] Edited January 14, 2014 by Sharee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DroidDreamer Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 You find it fun to pawn their asses, and I spen my time doing it also. But you don't seem to realize that there's a problem if a space combat game is mainly played by people with stationary fighters and succeed at it? That's not how it is supposed to be played. ^ What he said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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