How Pathetiq

[curtkram]

it's not about winning millions and not going to work again and how you buy your tickets.

It's about having the colour robe i want like i should.

which should've been in the game before any of this Cartel crap.

 

you should not be able to get the color of robe like you want. your expectations are misplaced. there is a little bit of character customization open to subscribers, but that content is generally gated through the cartel market.

 

in this game, there are tiers. f2p has the most restrictions, preferred a few less, subscribers get most content. if you want access to everything, you have to keep throwing money at the cartel market. it's just how it is. you've already seen that just paying money isn't going to get you the color you want. you have to keep paying money.

[DarthTHC]

Bioware. DYE MODULES.

Seriously? enough is Enough regarding them, I've spent loads on CC coins and to gamble to not get the colour robe i want.

OH wait let's get a few things clear first, i SUB yeah so should i be able to pick the colour of my robe without paying real money? YES!!!!!!

should F2P? HELL NO get my drift sort it out bioware.

 

 

I'm sure i'm Speaking for alot of CUSTOMERSright now.:mad::mad:

 

Can't tell if trolling or srs.

 

If srs, then here's a better approach:

 

1) Use Cartel Coins (the same amount you used to "gamble") to buy gambling packs. DO NOT OPEN THEM!

 

2) Put them on GTN for the going rate.

 

3) Wait....

 

4) Collect credits from your mailbox

 

5) Use the GTN to buy exactly the dye color(s) you want.

 

Alternatively, if you have a modicum of ability to manage your ingame finances, you can skip steps 1-4.

[Eeleek]

It's making me laugh...

The fact everyones trying to tell me how to make credits i have enough credits, even enough to buy. but i'm not paying it cause it's a joke, i don't want to spend any more on them what so ever weather it be in game credits or CC.

 

alll these techniques above it's SOP's of the game looool :S

[Mowermanx]

I have no problems paying for dyes, whatever BW likes to charge, but the system in place has got to be the most contrived garbage Ive ever seen. I dont think it would be even remotely possible to come up with a worse system.

Seriously, have friggen hard would it of been to have a vendor, much the the current customization vendor, with 2 palettes, one for primary and one for secondary, and a preview window, then just select and preview which 2 you like, and click purchase.

[Malastare]

Yano i'd even go with the fact you could pay, for what dye you wanted.

Even that would just be better.

800CC Black on black.

600CC Black on white.

 

They do sell Black/Black and other rare dyes on occasion. You just missed the latest sales (Nov 28?). However, your prices are laughably low. Black/Black sells for 2-6M credits. By default transfer rates (set by cartel boxes) the equivalent CC price would be 2000-6000CC. I think they were actually selling for ... 1200CC? (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

 

You can change your own appearance this way?

so why not robes?

 

You can. It's actually really cheap to change the color of your robes. However, its not cheap to get the rarest and most in-demand dye.

 

And I'm happy that Black/Black is rare, because I'd be a little annoyed at all the "individualists" who would wear only black/black armor.

 

also why aren't they even craftable for that fact, why is everything that is coming into the game via a market.

 

There are a lot of craftable dyes: Red/Black, Black/Red, Red/Gray, Blue/Black, Purple/Black, just to name a few of the more popular ones.

 

before you play this game is there anything in the EULA saying the micro transactions would be gambling?

 

No, because legally speaking they aren't gambling. We've already beaten this horse to death several times. While it is considered gambling colloquially and in-game, it is not gambling by the legal definition. It is simply purchasing a game item with game currency and getting random contents. Legally (which is all the EULA cares about) it is no different than Artifact Boxes.

[Eeleek]

what a fantastic idea.

[Eeleek]

So, to the people defending it, you think that the way this is implemented is 100% fine working, couldn't be better couldn't be improved and you wouldn't change it if you could? hm Edited December 18, 2013 by Eeleek

[Mowermanx]

what a fantastic idea.

 

Its neither fantastic or an idea, its just how any human with a few brain cells would of implemented a dye system into a game.

[dazednconfuzed]

And I'm happy that Black/Black is rare, because I'd be a little annoyed at all the "individualists" who would wear only black/black armor.

 

Don't you mean 'non-conformists'?

 

South Park FTW!

[Andryah]

Yano i'd even go with the fact you could pay, for what dye you wanted.

Even that would just be better.

800CC Black on black.

600CC Black on white.

 

You can. But the price in CC is 2000 for B/B and 1000 for B/W. They are limited duration sales on the CM, Eric gives us notice in advance that they are coming up for sale (per our earlier request in the forum). We just had them on sale over the Thanksgiving weekend.

 

Personally, I see CC as a bad investment in dyes, and IF the rare dyes were not trade/sellable to other players, I would agree with your complaints. Just buy them off the GTN.. and like all things on the GTN... if credits is a concern for you.. bargain shop and/or find better ways to support your in game economic needs. The fact is.. you can pick up a B/B for under 2M after the sales cycle on the CM... and probably for a week or two after that. Then prices return to limited supply pricing levels for your server. (I recently bought 2 for 1.6M ea, and may use them or may sell them later... have not yet decided)

 

And as for credits..... they are really only in limited supply to newer players in the game, or end game players who have yet to figure out an economic model for them to support their needs in game. It's simple really....if you have expensive tastes you need to generate more income in game. Rare and highly coveted items are a fact of life in MMOs, and that includes cosmetic items (not just functional items). Players decide what is coveted and worthy of high prices inside an MMO. All the game developer does is decide rarity (which in turn, coupled with desirability, creates demand and establishes pricing between players). I remember early in the game when it was virtually impossible to find pants for an the Inquisitor classes in this game. There was one world drop, rare, and they commonly sold for a million credits or more (because they were in high demand and were a random drop). And that was back when a million credits was a lot in game currency.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Andryah

[cycao]

So, to the people defending it, you think that the way this is implemented is 100% fine working, couldn't be better couldn't be improved and you wouldn't change it if you could? hm

 

It's RNG. Keyword there is random and the rarer the item the smaller the chance to acquire said item. How hard of a concept is this.

 

Would you like a participation medal for trying to get it? Would that help you?

[Tsillah]

I don't mind that some things are rarer than others. Same with dyes, but I would prefer that dyes actually dropped as loot, even if the chance on getting black is very low. The fact that black/black is only available via the CM is not right.

 

I wouldn't personally describe this issue as pathetic but at least I know how to spell the word

[cycao]

I don't mind that some things are rarer than others. Same with dyes, but I would prefer that dyes actually dropped as loot, even if the chance on getting black is very low. The fact that black/black is only available via the CM is not right.

 

I wouldn't personally describe this issue as pathetic but at least I know how to spell the word

 

As long as they have people willing to buy X amount of anything from the cartel market nothing is going to change.

[Andryah]

I don't mind that some things are rarer than others. Same with dyes, but I would prefer that dyes actually dropped as loot, even if the chance on getting black is very low.

 

I'm sure at some point.. some really slick looking dyes are going to be rare drops from bosses. Just a matter of time. This probably will not include dyes released on the CM simply because it makes no real sense to cross couple the access (rare drops VS rare buys)....but time will tell.

 

It won't solve the OPs complaint though...just shift it from the CM to random loot table complaints, because rare and desirable will always be expensive inside an MMO. Players set prices inside the economy of a server. Demand vs rarity determines how much leverage players setting prices actually have.

 

Their approach to dyes so far has been to release them through all channels of access EXCEPT NPC drops. Crafters have some that are exclusive to them, as do the Security Vendor and CE vendor, as does the CM. It's just that the angst expressed periodically in the forum is generally always over what people want but have one or more challenges to actually get (which by the way is in no way limited to dyes either). It's not rational really, but it is a well understood human trait.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Andryah

[SuperGrunt]

´the dye system is completelly ridiculous. Either you gamble to get the color you want , pay millions for 1 single dye module , or settle for a cheaper version, even if you are a sub. All my toons are black and red cause you know thats pretty much the only option left for me. Black and black is out of the quesiton as it costs so much on the gtn, for a single use dye. Imagine if I wanted to use black and black, black white or white black on different pieces . Dye is pretty much a non feature for me atm

 

Well then you sir are an idiot, b/c Bioware made the Black/Black, Black/White, White/Black, and White/White direct buys on the Cartel Market for about 24 hours each just a couple of weeks ago. It was during that extended Double Exp weekend, there was even a Dev Post telling us when each would be up prior to the event.

[Vandicus]

The gist of what we were told when the game went f2p was that they would sell cosmetics, but avoid p2win. I've never been bothered by this arrangement.

[JediRelentless]

I'm pretty sure he is after black/black, which is one of the rarest dye packs, and only available from the CM inshort bursts.

 

And you believe that over a reasonable amount of time that rare dye has never been available to this person at a price lower than 5 million?

Edited December 18, 2013 by JediRelentless

[Malastare]

So, to the people defending it,

 

...I'm not sure if you're including me in that. I'm not particularly defending it. I have no emotional attachment to it. I'm telling you the truth about it and pointing out what I see as hypocritical analysis of the situation.

 

you think that the way this is implemented is 100% fine working, couldn't be better couldn't be improved and you wouldn't change it if you could? hm

 

Sorry, that's loaded with all sorts of logical fallacies, including my particular pet-peeve: False Dichotomy. It's a particular favorite of people who don't want to actually think or analyze situations. You are giving me only two options: Either I agree with you, or I say that the current implementation is the absolute best solution. Sorry, but if I have to pick in a situation like that, I'll always appose the person who created the fallacy, if only because it shows that they are unwilling to even consider any point of view but theirs.

 

Is it how I would design the system: No. However, I'm not the designer. Neither are you. You're just a player and you're demanding a change to an implementation which gives you everything you want, with zero consideration of global impacts. That's usually a recipe for future (or present) failure. I, on the other hand, recognize that part of the point of games is to be restricted, to have to work or hope for some of the things you want. I don't want every 13 year old to be able to pick super-black-everything as their customization, partly because its annoying, and partly because common sense would tell you that all the people who picked that would then be dissatisfied with the fact that it was too common. I recognize that will still be very desirable, and from a game designers perspective, that creates a situation where the item in question can be made rare and people will be willing to play the game and work to get it.

 

Shorter Version: Arguments using False Dichotomy should be ignored. Rare dyes should be rare. Instant gratification produces a game population which is simultaneously impatient and easily bored.

[ikinai]

Hmmm, so that black/black dye I got the other day is worth over 5 million? Heck, that's way over 9000. One of these days I should probably sell it, after all I'll probably never use it.

[tekhiun]

Well then you sir are an idiot, b/c Bioware made the Black/Black, Black/White, White/Black, and White/White direct buys on the Cartel Market for about 24 hours each just a couple of weeks ago. It was during that extended Double Exp weekend, there was even a Dev Post telling us when each would be up prior to the event.

 

2k CC for 1 dye ? And I am the idiot lol !

[ItachiZaku]

I got a couple of cartel packs to try to get the item I wanted instead of spending the 1.2 mil for it. first one gave me 3 oranges (1 worth 70K, the other 2 worth 7K per) and the second gave... 2 xp boosts. That's it. Nothing else. So I went to buy the item on the GTN for 1.2 and someone posted 2 for 500K. Score.

 

Now, the white lightsaber crystals... damn. I have no where near the 8 mill credits for that.

[SuperGrunt]

I don't mind that some things are rarer than others. Same with dyes, but I would prefer that dyes actually dropped as loot, even if the chance on getting black is very low. The fact that black/black is only available via the CM is not right.

 

I wouldn't personally describe this issue as pathetic but at least I know how to spell the word

 

I think it was actually quite well done. There are a number of ways that we have to acquire dye modules, Cartel Market, vendors, and Crafters. They also saw that there was a big demand for certain dye combinations, and as a result have a few times added them as direct buys on the Cartel Market. Black/Black should only be available from one source, granted as an Artifice crafter, I would prefer that it was from my crafting, but I can make peace with it being a rare thing from the Cartel Market.

 

No, it makes perfect sense spelling it that way, only thing I would change would be to add another q at the end. Unless the OP is trying to say it's not that big a deal so he only sheds tears out of one eye.

[IncoherentVoice]

I don't want every 13 year old to be able to pick super-black-everything as their customization, partly because its annoying, and partly because common sense would tell you that all the people who picked that would then be dissatisfied with the fact that it was too common. I recognize that will still be very desirable, and from a game designers perspective, that creates a situation where the item in question can be made rare and people will be willing to play the game and work to get it.

 

Shorter Version: Arguments using False Dichotomy should be ignored. Rare dyes should be rare. Instant gratification produces a game population which is simultaneously impatient and easily bored.

 

Amen, brother/sister. The point of having rare items in a game like this is that they're rare, and earning them is cool. With a gambling system like the Cartel Market, you don't earn things, you win things, but the point remains that winning them is cool. Granted, it has the ulterior motive of tempting you to spend a lot more money than you probably should, but it never lied to you and told you that it'd give you the dye pack you really wanted if you spent more money. You knew exactly what you were getting into. You played. You lost. If you had won, you wouldn't have started this thread, and as far as I'm concerned, once you've taken part in a system that you understand to be skewed against giving you what you want in its randomness, you forfeit the ability to criticize it for being random.

 

That's why everyone here is making the comparison to the lottery. If you participate, you don't retain the right to be taken seriously when you call it an unfair sham. Also, if you believe that five million credits for something you obviously REALLY want is more valuable than the "loads of money" you've already spent on the Cartel Market, I have an all-black bridge I think you'd be interested in purchasing.

[dazednconfuzed]

And you believe that over a reasonable amount of time that rare dye has never been available to this person at a price lower than 5 million?

 

*Shrug* Probably. That doesn't mean he spotted it at the time though. Or maybe early on, when it was first out, when he didn't have access to that kind of credits.

 

This isn't the first time I've heard about people not being able to get black/black for less than 5 million.

[tekhiun]

I think it was actually quite well done. There are a number of ways that we have to acquire dye modules, Cartel Market, vendors, and Crafters. They also saw that there was a big demand for certain dye combinations, and as a result have a few times added them as direct buys on the Cartel Market. Black/Black should only be available from one source, granted as an Artifice crafter, I would prefer that it was from my crafting, but I can make peace with it being a rare thing from the Cartel Market.

 

No, it makes perfect sense spelling it that way, only thing I would change would be to add another q at the end. Unless the OP is trying to say it's not that big a deal so he only sheds tears out of one eye.

 

It was actually terribly done. 1st of all there shouldn't be any need to gamble for them. Imo the best way should be to charge credit per coloring , ie you pay a fee of in-game credits to color each piece a certain color. Then allow us to select any primary/ secondary color combination and also make some colors unlockable via achievements and some only via crafting. Then they could charge CC for dye slots, where we could store different color setups for our gear.

 

The system we have now is just a money grab

Edited December 18, 2013 by tekhiun