Revan vs Darth Maul

[Beniboybling]

I find it pretty funny that you think Meetra is weaker than Revan...

 

I personally think someone so engrossed in the Light Side of the force was stronger than Revan, especially since she was an equal to the Reborn Revan, and the Reborn Revan shouldn't be the Revan we consider for that list.

You might have missed the extensive debate that we underwent in the formation of the REAL Most Powerful Jedi list, but we did reach the conclusion that Revan is more powerful.

[LadyKulvax]

Well, even you can't change canon, Beni

 

And I was comparing her to Revan, specifically. She's obviously not weak in general. If Revan goes all out though, the gap in power between him and Meetra is immense. The power gap between Darth Krayt and Darth Traya (I assume you changed Traya to #8 like you wanted to) wouldn't seem so incredible.

 

At any rate, Maul, TPM Maul especially (although that one at least gets to use his favorite weapon), doesn't defeat Revan Reborn.

 

Actually the Revan novel ignored sources that conclude that she is definitely his equal, not only did she have Sever Force and a complete mastery of the Light Side of the Force which was achieved through Force Enlightenment, something that is confirmed by the KotOR CG, something that Revan has not achieved, but even Kreia Revan's own teacher called Surik her greatest ever student, a list which includes Revan.

 

I still believe Darth Nyriss was clearly caught off guard, she was already unleashing her Force Lightning when Revan stood up and Tutaminis'd her lightning back at her so fast she couldnt put up a force barrier, this does not mean that Revan is outright more powerful than her in all aspects, as they didnt even have a real fight, he just took advantage of her situation.

[LadyKulvax]

You might have missed the extensive debate that we underwent in the formation of the REAL Most Powerful Jedi list, but we did reach the conclusion that Revan is more powerful.

 

Well actually I stood back from the debate and brought up the single serious advantage Revan has over Meetra, he is unafraid to use either side of the Force whenever it suits him, that is his advantage over her, so we gave him a higher position.

[Beniboybling]

Well actually I stood back from the debate and brought up the single serious advantage Revan has over Meetra, he is unafraid to use either side of the Force whenever it suits him, that is his advantage over her, so we gave him a higher position.

Perhaps. Yet I always try to look for reasons why Traya regarded Meetra to be her greatest student - and I feel her detachment from the Force, and ability to use it without fear and without restriction as a mere tool, might be one of them. But we can only guess, because Drew never bothered to explore questions like that. Fool.

[Selenial]

Perhaps. Yet I always try to look for reasons why Traya regarded Meetra to be her greatest student - and I feel her detachment from the Force, and ability to use it without fear and without restriction as a mere tool, might be one of them. But we can only guess, because Drew never bothered to explore questions like that. Fool.

 

That and the fact that Revan at the height of his power could be considered a Dark Jedi, so not on the list. And of course the fact he himself, even when on Dromund Kaas never considered himself a Jedi (especially because the order standing never made him one )

[Selenial]

Well actually I stood back from the debate and brought up the single serious advantage Revan has over Meetra, he is unafraid to use either side of the Force whenever it suits him, that is his advantage over her, so we gave him a higher position.

 

I still don't understand that though, her devotion to the light has brought her things revans Knowledge of the Darkside never could, and his Darkness doesn't bring any significant advantage in terms of power.

[Beniboybling]

That and the fact that Revan at the height of his power could be considered a Dark Jedi, so not on the list. And of course the fact he himself, even when on Dromund Kaas never considered himself a Jedi (especially because the order standing never made him one )

The first half of KOTOR is all about you becoming a Jedi... and after that he was made a Master.

 

So yeah.

[Selenial]

The first half of KOTOR is all about you becoming a Jedi... and after that he was made a Master.

 

So yeah.

 

And that Jedi order was dissolved, re-formed by the Exile's order, so technically, not a Jedi

 

On and personally, I believe Foundry Revan his strongest, and he had quite clearly fell over the edge at that point.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Selenial

[Beniboybling]

And that Jedi order was dissolved, re-formed by the Exile's order, so technically, not a Jedi

 

On and personally, I believe Foundry Revan his strongest, and he had quite clearly fell over the edge at that point.

Yeah whatever, Yoda and Kenobi died Jedi in my books.

[LadyKulvax]

I still don't understand that though, her devotion to the light has brought her things revans Knowledge of the Darkside never could, and his Darkness doesn't bring any significant advantage in terms of power.

 

Possibly, I still think she is more powerful through her dedication to the light, others disagree, but I do believe that there is an advantage to having the ability to use either side of the Force, it means you arent effected negatively by Dark Side nexus sites, etc...

[Spartanik]

Its amazing how Revan is downplayed in this forums. Probably due to buthurtness of screwing the lore of the exile and Revan. I dont know....

I had the oportunity to read the revan novel again recently, and Revan completly destroys Nirssys to complete suprise of surik and scourge, who were about to be destroyed thenselfs. There is no much room for conjectures, and what ifs, thats what happened. And we cant take game mechanics into account on Kotor 2 at all. Its actualy unclear what the exile achieved lorewise at this point safe that she quels a rebelion and a conflict created by Traya.

Also Nirssys was not capable to raising a force barrier at all, she was even more suprised then scourge and surik. when revan reflected her lighting. I recall scourge actualy beliving if someone could take on the emperor it was Revan not Nirssys or the exile. wich didnt even cause a special impression on him in the cave on dromund kass. If not for Revan Either surik and scourge would have end up mind controled. There is no doubt neither scourge or surik are on par with Revan ( reborn) thats how bioware and drew made it to be.

 

To simply put the exile has the potencial to be revans equal if her lore is to be expanded and take into account,, and even so i sadly doubt it. Its ironic that Kotor 2 been the most responsible to overate revan as a character, it has been used to downplayed him, via the exile.

 

On and personally, I believe Foundry Revan his strongest, and he had quite clearly fell over the edge at that point

I belive it to be in the novel. But who knows. Edited November 26, 2013 by Spartanik

[LadyKulvax]

Oh I am sorry, we aren't calling Revan god, let us all fall on our lightsabers in shame. *rolls eyes*

 

But honestly I couldn't even read most of your post., simply put.... please this stuff got old in 2011.

Edited November 26, 2013 by LadyKulvax

[Spartanik]

Revan a god? what? that wasnt what i meant or said. You can drop the sarcasm now.

 

But he was cleary meant to be a character well above normal, well above his companions or folowers, wich the exile and scourge in fact realy are.

 

And dont worry some of your posts are also unreadable due to surik fanatism.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Spartanik

[Wolfninjajedi]

Is he? Do we have any evidence to support this? Force Speed and Force power are strongly interrelated, if anything Revan is likely to be faster.

 

And Revan did use Force lightning, when pressed. And his lightning makes Mighella's look like a parlor trick. I seriously doubt Maul could tank the lightning of any accomplished Sith Lord. Its just unlikely.

 

Revan was capable of lifting giant rocks and launching them simultaneously, as well as collapsing large structures. He is also Revan, the 7th most powerful Jedi eveeerrrr. Hint: Maul doesn't make the Sith list.

 

And finally, Revan is a highly accomplished duelist, given that Maul could not even best Padawan Kenobi 'quickly' - which isn't necessarily a point against him but just some proof he isn't a saber demon - I doubt he could Revan.

 

I mean come on is this the same crowd that thought Ventress could beat Maul? I should start taking names...

 

Yes here...

 

Two of the droids—Rapier and Chain, he silently named them—were within his field of vision. The other two—Cudgel and Hachete—were not, being behind him. It did not matter; through his awareness of the Force he could sense their movements as plainly as if he had eyes in the back of his head.

Maul raised his own weapon, the double-bladed lightsaber, and triggered the power control. Twin lances of pure energy boiled forth, hissing and crackling in crimson loops that began and ended at the two flux apertures on either end of the device. Any Jedi Knight could wield a single-bladed lightsaber; only a master fighter could use the weapon first designed by the legendary Dark Lord Exar Kun millennia ago. Unless one was in perfect attunement with it, the weapon could be as deadly to the user as to the opponent.

Rapier lunged at full extension, its metal knee joint bent almost to the floor. The needle point flickered toward Maul's heart, almost too fast to see.

The dark side blossomed in Darth Maul, the power of it resonating in him like black lightning, augmenting his years of training, guiding his reactions. Time seemed to slow, to stretch.

 

Seeing movements that are almost too fast to see in slow motion.

 

The primal scream had barely sounded before he was on top of Qui-Gon, wheeling the speeder aside deftly at the last moment, closing off its thruster, and leaping from the seat, all in one swift movement. He carried a lightsaber of another make, and the weapon was cutting at the Jedi Master even before the attacker's feet had touched the ground. Qui-Gon, surprised by the other's quickness and ferocity, barely blocked the blow with his own weapon, the blades sliding apart with a harsh rasp. The attacker spun away in a whirl of dark clothing, then attacked anew, lightsaber slashing at his intended prey, face alight with a killing frenzy that promised no quarter.

 

Able to fight faster than Qui-Gon, who was able to fend off blaster fire and make a shield using his blade motions.

 

Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Tiin, and Ki-Adi-Mundi surged from the pyramid entrance, engaging the terrorists that had driven them back. A quarter of the way across the immense plaza, the Jedi spread out in a wedge formation, their constantly moving blades fending off blaster bolts loosed from ahead and to either side. Behind the energy barrier fashioned by the lightsabers, Yaddle, Depa, Vergere, and two of the judicials raced out to divert fire from the rear.

===========

 

But on this day, he had met his match. The Sith Lord he battled with Obi - Wan was more than his equal in weapons training, and he had the advantage of being younger and stronger. Qui-Gon was nearing sixty; his youth was behind him and his strength was beginning to diminish. His edge now, to the extent that he had one, came from his long experience and intuitive grasp of how an adversary might employ a lightsaber against him.

Obi-Wan brought youth and stamina to the combat, but he had fought in only a few contests and was not battle hardened. Together, they were able to hold their own against the Sith Lord, but their efforts at attack, at assuming the offensive against this dangerous adversary, were woefully inadequate.

 

Here it is noted that together both Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were just able to hold their own together.

 

=====

 

Emerging from the hangar, he allowed himself to be detected and confronted by a patrol of droids. In a metallic voice, their officer unit ordered him to halt and raised its E-5 rifle. Reared by Darth Sidious’s custodial droids on Mustafar, Maul—for many years—had had a complex relationship with droids of any sort. Certainly his fascination with technology owed in part to the circumstances of his abnormal upbringing, but he had no compunction about destroying droids when the need arose, whether in training sessions or on missions. Still, he derived no enduring satisfaction from the contests, even when combating the most sophisticated among them.

Calling his long lightsaber to his hand, he made short work of the squad, decapitating them with his blade or exploding them by deflecting blaster bolts back at them. The brief altercation drew several more patrols, the members of which he similarly dismembered.

 

Can deflect blaster shots from a squads of 8 B1 battle droids.

=======

 

Then he sprang to a series of other sites that ultimately carried him to the wall of the principal building, moving with such speed the entire time that whatever holorecordings were being made wouldn't show him unless they were played in slow motion.

 

Here Maul moves so fast that holorecordings would have to be slown down to even see him.

======

 

Here you see Maul twist his body to avoid several blaster shots, this also shows dextarity.

========

 

Cursing through his gritted teeth, he put his right arm through the bow and hooked it over his shoulder, then ran through a hail of blaster bolts to reach Talzin. Heaving her over his shoulder, he raced for the safety of the adjacent bay, the two Nightsisters steps behind.

 

Here Maul runs through a hail of blaster fire without getting it.

==========

 

Krakko drew his blaster and fired at him. Maul jerked his body to the left, dodged the blaster bolt, and kept walking toward Krakko. Krakko fired two more shots. Maul dodged those too before he grabbed Krakko's gun arm with one hand, and his neck with the other.

 

Here Maul dodges blaster shots just by jerking his body.

===========

 

Before the weapon had bounced off the wall and landed on the floor, Maul had the lightsaber in his grasp. He thumbed on both blades as the next blaster bolt and half a dozen more came his way in rapid succession. The Sith apprentice's hands were a blur as he let the dark side take him over completely, giving in to its power and allowing it to control and manipulate him. Blaster bolts struck the lightsaber's spinning blades and were deflected into the walls, the ceiling, the floor.

 

Here Maul grabs and turns on his lightsaber before a blaster hits the floor, he then deflected half a dozen blaster shots, his hands moving in blurs.

===========

 

They aimed their weapons at Maul and fired. Four poison-tipped, armor-piercing arrows sped toward the Sith Lord. Maul's hands moved like lightning as he plucked each arrow from the air and flung them back at the assassins.

 

Here Maul catches four arrows and sends them right back.

===========

 

When I complete my basic exercises, I power up my double-bladed lightsaber and practice maneuvers. My body is as strong as durasteel and as fluid as water. I shift from one position of attack to another. I fall on one knee and slash my lightsaber as I imagine cleaving my victim cleanly. I roll away and grip my lightsaber with both hands for a vertical sweep. I leap and twist and come down, leading with my left shoulder. I deliver a death blow and leap away, somersaulting in the air. I perform ten thousand slashes, lunges, attacks.

 

My lightsaber is no longer a separate weapon, but part of my arm. I move in the time it would take my opponent to blink. I move in the time he would take to raise his weapon. He would only see the space where I had been. He would feel the sudden shock of the blow that would knock him to the floor. I do these maneuvers a hundred times a day. I do them even though my body knows them intimately, even though I have not made a mistake or a misstep in years. I do them until the memory of the movement is part of the muscle itself. The goal of the Sith is to fight without thought.

 

Here Maul shows that he practices daily, performing 10,000 manuvers and does this 100 times a day.

==========

 

The Sith and the Jedi leapt from the speeder bike onto the platform to continue their battle. The docking ledge was only about ten meters by fifteen, barely enough room to maneuver in. Maul knew he had to dispatch the Jedi quickly, before Pavan once again vanished into the labyrinth of Coruscant's downlevels. He pressed the attack viciously, blocking and thrusting, the twin radiant blades spinning a web of light about him.

 

Showing enough speed to make a 'web' of light around him.

==========

 

His eyes were hypnotic, their golden hue an eerie counterpart to the bloodred and black tattoos covering his face. But they did not prevent her from deflecting his strikes as he again moved within range, his twin blades spinning so fast they seemed to merge into a crimson shield.

 

Here Maul moves fast enough to form a 'shield' out of his blade movements.

==========

 

So unless Revan has been depiected as that fast, the edge is gonna go to Maul for reaction/speed combat.

 

Oh and one more thing folks,

 

YES TCW Maul is stronger...take note!

 

Savage was right. Maul's power was growing, because he had a purpose again, and a vision.

 

Maul had grown more powerful since the last time he'd been in Sidious's presence, before the Neimoidian invasion of Naboo had turned disastrous and Obi-Wan had bested him inside the Theed power core. His hermitage on Lotho Minor, his lessons on Umbara, his restoration by Mother Talzin, and his training of Savage had all strengthened him, made him a more worthy vessel for the dark side to fill with its power.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Conspiracy

Edited November 26, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[fdbgjfdhjgkjdhsg]

which would be complete bs if it happened and was canon.

 

The Clone Wars series is cannon. Anyone who doesn't realise this shouldn't watch star wars in the first place!

[XSUPREMESKILLZX]

Not deleted scenes dude

[LadyKulvax]

Revan a god? what? that wasnt what i meant or said. You can drop the sarcasm now.

 

But he was cleary meant to be a character well above normal, well above his companions or folowers, wich the exile and scourge in fact realy are.

 

And dont worry some of your posts are also unreadable due to surik fanatism.

 

You are saying we are downplaying him, care to elaborate on that? so because we arent pulling out 'Revan was like staring into the heart of the force' metaphorical quotes we are downplaying him?

 

The Exile was never his follower, she was recruited by Alek and quickly became a Jedi General herself, leading over half of the Republic fleet, whilst Revan led the other half, then she led the charge against the Sith Triumvirate, one of the most dangerous Sith organizations in galactic history and then went and rescued Revan and also saved his life twice in a row.

 

Oh and if I filled my posts with such fanaticism, it is hilarious that I agreed that Revan should be placed above her on the Jedi list, but yeh I am such a fangirl.

Edited November 26, 2013 by LadyKulvax

[Beniboybling]

Its been a long time since we've had an argument concerning Revan.

 

Lets keep it that way.

 

If that means ignoring this guy (no offense) then so be it.

[Spartanik]

Oh and if I filled my posts with such fanaticism, it is hilarious that I agreed that Revan should be placed above her on the Jedi list, but yeh I am such a fangirl.

You always end up saying how nirssys was more powerfull then Revan... i dont see it that way at all by Reading the novel, excuse me to disagree on that point. And the exile was cleary a folower of Revan by all accounts she folow Revan in joining the mandalorian wars, we heard it so manny times in KotoR 2, that exact phrase. Alec might have recruited her like he recruited manny others, but without Revan there werent be jedi fighting in the mandalorian wars.

I shouldnt be apolagetic for my opinions, i didnt mean to cause an argument over this, but to point out what i read the most in this forums, and that i dont think its fair at all in some points.

 

To be more on tópic, we have very litle information of Revan lightsaber skills, we can only assume they were good, but there isnt no way of knowing that they could macth or surprass Maul.

At anycase i figure something similar with Maul vs dooku, Maul having the physical advantage, but in the end being overwhelmed by the force, lightsaber combos. Again its only a conjecture. Its another Era, diferent times in star wars universe. diferent sith and diferent jedi too.

[Aurbere]

And dont worry some of your posts are also unreadable due to surik fanatism.

 

How does one judge fanaticism?

[Spartanik]

How does one judge fanaticism?

The distortion of facts, to give suport to ones agenda or perspective gives it a away, on all things( the use of sarcasm in response to an opinion doesnt help matters either).

In this case I will rather analise, the book and its story for what it is.

Naturaly, im not talking about the strict sense of the word fanatic, at least not with the negative conotaction its knowned for , this is only star wars lore, not politics, or a religious debate, or a social-economic one, so lets not take this so serious.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Spartanik

[Aurbere]

The distortion of facts, to give suport to ones agenda or perspective gives it a away, on all things( the use of sarcasm in response to an opinion doesnt help matters either).

 

In this case Il rather analise, the book and its story for what it is.

Naturaly, im not talking about the strict sense of the word fanatic, at least not with the negative conotaction its knowned for , this is only star wars lore, not politics, or a religious debate, or a social-economic one, so lets not take this so serious.

 

Well then Rayla has not distorted facts about The Exile. Not at all.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Aurbere

[Spartanik]

Well then Rayla has not distorted facts about The Exile. Not at all.

About Revan and nyrssis it did, in my opinion.

The assumption that the exile is more powerfull then Revan on most aspects. A thing that seems to difer totaly from the novel. Imo

she also cant say that surik didnt folow Revan to the mandalorian wars, and admit at the same time that she did by control half the fleet and forces as a general. Im pretty sure Revan looked at her as a friend and as equal, but thats a diferent matter, as i dont think revan felt superior to any of his companions ( not counting his sith days). But they were without a doubt folowing him.

Thats perhaps what the revan character and story is all about he ends up being the decision maker on the grand scheme of things, (allthough its a usual formula encountered in most bioware games. You play the hero, the charismatic leader that ends up leading conflicts and having a tons of folowers etc.)

dont get me wrong i like the exile as much as anyone, more before the novel though. But there is no doubt that surik folowed revan in some aspects, much more evidently so in the novel "Revan" and in swtor. Personaly didnt like it much, but thats how it is.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Spartanik

[LadyKulvax]

About Revan and nyrssis it did, in my opinion.

The assumption that the exile is more powerfull then Revan on most aspects. A thing that seems to difer totaly from the novel. Imo

she also cant say that surik didnt folow Revan to the mandalorian wars, and admit at the same time that she did by control half the fleet and forces as a general. Im pretty sure Revan looked at her as a friend and as equal, but thats a diferent matter, as i dont think revan felt superior to any of his companions ( not counting his sith days). But they were without a doubt folowing him.

Thats perhaps what the revan character and story is all about he ends up being the decision maker on the grand scheme of things, (allthough its a usual formula encountered in most bioware games. You play the hero, the charismatic leader that ends up leading conflicts and having a tons of folowers etc.)

dont get me wrong i like the exile as much as anyone, more before the novel though. But there is no doubt that surik folowed revan in some aspects, much more evidently so in the novel "Revan" and in swtor. Personaly didnt like it much, but thats how it is.

 

The novel never outright states that Revan is more powerful than Surik, the Revan fans just act like Revan and Nyriss actually had a fight, he caught her in mid move and acted as a conduit, redirecting her power back at her, she didnt even have time to raise her own Force Barriers, that is my interpretation on the battle, dont claim I am twisting events and then claim that your version is the obvious truth. Then we have other sources pointing to her being a heroine in her own right, not just some Revan's lackey as you seem to be suggesting.

 

Everyone followed Revan because he started the movement to disobey the Jedi Council, but you are heavily suggesting she just bowed to his every wish and was merely a companion, if you think that you clearly havent read much about her, the KotOR CG outright depicts a moment on the Leviathan when she confronts him and severs all ties with him because of his turn to the Dark Side, she completely acts on her own in the second half of the war, she was her own general, she commanded her own part of the Republic fleet, even the Revan novel supports the fact that she was her own general, not just one of Revan's second hand commanders like Alek was.

 

She won the battle of Dxun, she won the wars over Serroco, she won the battle of Malachor V, Revan wasn't even there for two of them and in the last he didnt even show up until the battle was already won and Revan went on to battle Mandalore himself.

 

I am sick of hearing about how the Exile was just Revan's follower and nothing more, did all of you completely and utterly miss the entire point of KotOR 2? the Exile becoming her own hero and coming to terms with her role in the war, she led the war against the Sith in the Dark Wars, she didnt follow Revan, she chose to go and rescue her friend, just because she looked up to him doesnt mean she is just another companion.

Edited November 27, 2013 by LadyKulvax

[JaydedHunter]

Revan would win.

 

Sidious would wipe the floor with Revan though.