Opinion requested: Do you think the Marauder set bonus have room for modification ?

[znihilist]

Note: I am talking about PvE here.

 

One of the big advantages of the current set bonus is that there is literally no penalty for switching specs while maintaining the same gear (and I am not saying there should be one). Granted the current set bonus (specially the 4 pieces) fits perfectly the spec.

However, I have been wondering if we look strictly on the set bonus from a more isolated perspective do you think it needs some change ?

I think if there is any room to change the set bonus then it should be 2 pieces set and to be spec specific (while maintaining the same 4 set).

The first thing to get off the top of my head is the following:

Annihilation: Increase crit chance of all dots (or any dot based modification)

Carnage: Slightly increase chance of slaughter and/or Force Scream damage (although the current set bonus also fits)

Rage: Increase armor penetration by 5% (Couldn't really think of anything else)

Edited October 31, 2013 by znihilist

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

The 4 piece setbonus is quite useless to Carnage because (atleast personally) Carnage never uses Berzerk. But for Rage and Anni, the 4 piece Berzerk gives 4% damage for some amount of time is pretty awesome! (the Setbonuses im putting out will be PvE only)

 

2 Piece for Rage: Increase damage of Force Scream and Force Crush by 5%

4 Piece for Rage: Increase the max stack amount of Shockwave by 1 (extra damage for PvE smash is always nice!)

 

2 Piece for Carnage: Increase the duration of Gore by 2 seconds

4 Piece for Carnage: When Ravage is complete your damage is increased by 5% for 10 seconds

 

2 Piece for Anni: Increase the Duration of Rupture's Bleed Effect by 2 Seconds

4 Piece for Anni: Increase the max stack amount of Deadly Saber by 1

 

All of these would increase DPS and are reasonably balanced. And they are decently in line with other Set Bonuses. The 4 piece for Carnage could be the most OP though.

[oofalong]

The 4 piece setbonus is quite useless to Carnage because (atleast personally) Carnage never uses Berzerk...

 

Um, Berserk is incredibly useful for Carnage; it allows you to fit more attacks in your Gore window. It makes a big difference!

 

I am pretty content with the set bonuses right now. They were changed in 2.0 and I think they are probably one of, if not the, best in the game. Could they be better? Sure, but I do not think this is where we should ask the Devs to focus for our AC.

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Um, Berserk is incredibly useful for Carnage; it allows you to fit more attacks in your Gore window. It makes a big difference!

 

I am pretty content with the set bonuses right now. They were changed in 2.0 and I think they are probably one of, if not the, best in the game. Could they be better? Sure, but I do not think this is where we should ask the Devs to focus for our AC.

 

Ive never really had enough attention span to try to wrap my head around Carnage, ill sit at a few 100 lower DPS for a less complicated gameplay style with Anni. If Carnage was more like it was in Pre-2.0 with Slaughter i would be fine with carnage.

 

The 2 piece setbonus i cant remeber off the top of my head, i think it's like 5% damage on something or is it lower CD on Useless Defence (Enraged Defence, the skill that marauders shouldnt have seriously devs. remove it from Marauders and give it to Juggs, it's much more needed for Jugg DPS.)

[oofalong]

The 2 piece setbonus i cant remeber off the top of my head, i think it's like 5% damage on something or is it lower CD on Useless Defence (Enraged Defence, the skill that marauders shouldnt have seriously devs. remove it from Marauders and give it to Juggs, it's much more needed for Jugg DPS.)

 

I think you are confused. The OP referred to the PvE set bonuses. The two piece is 8% more damage to Ravage. The four piece is a reduced CD on Frenzy and 4% more damage 15s after activating Berserk.

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

I think you are confused. The OP referred to the PvE set bonuses. The two piece is 8% more damage to Ravage. The four piece is a reduced CD on Frenzy and 4% more damage 15s after activating Berserk.

 

I knew it was something that i could not quite remember. I wasent confused, i just cant remember the 2 piece bonus for PvE.

 

Why more damage on Ravage? We dont have any spec that directly benefits from it. other than maybe Carnage with it's root. but all it is is 3 sec of really nice filler damage.

 

Edit: I was reading your Watchman/Anni Compendium, your builds make my brain hurt... http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100bIbRrRrfsMzZhzZf00z.3 That's my preferred build because

 

A. 3 points in Malice is more crit than 2 points

 

B. Sweeping Slash is nice filler when you have extra Rage to dump and you need to burn down multiple targets (also it applies Deadly Saber to the first target it hits!)

 

C. 7.5% crit on Vicious Slash and Throw means that i have a 7.5% higher chance to get refunded 2 Rage per Vicious Slash/Throw!

 

D. Crit to 30%/30% and stacking Surge for Anni is best so that you can maximise your self heals and Rage refunds on direct damage attacks.

Edited October 31, 2013 by Kaos_KidSWTOR

[oofalong]

I am not going to respond beyond this post as I do not want to take the time/effort. And, it is off topic from the OP's question. I really don't care if you accept my recommendations or not, but I think if you ask around you'll find that most in the Marauder/Sentinel community accept my recommendations and acknowledge I am an authority on Annihilation/Watchman.

 

A. 3 points in Malice is more crit than 2 points

 

Yes it is, but it is less DPS. My recommended build optimizes DPS.

 

B. Sweeping Slash is nice filler when you have extra Rage to dump and you need to burn down multiple targets (also it applies Deadly Saber to the first target it hits!)

 

My guide is meant for elder game PvE, which really means Operations bosses. For the most part, these are single target fights. Occasionally there are adds, but this spec really is king of single target DPS so that is what you should focus on and prioritize.

 

The extra Fury built from Defensive Forms is incredibly valuable. And, the three points in Dual Wield Mastery (DWM) are significant (see the math below).

 

Sweeping Slash is not a nice filler.

 

C. 7.5% crit on Vicious Slash and Throw means that i have a 7.5% higher chance to get refunded 2 Rage per Vicious Slash/Throw!

 

It is a question of what you are trading off. Each point in DWM is worth roughly 1% more damage. The higher crit rate increases the expected damage of Vicious Slash by ~5%, and the ability represents ~5% of our damage. Increasing 5% by 5% yields 0.25% total increase. Thus, this is inferior than 3% from DWM.

 

 

D. Crit to 30%/30% and stacking Surge for Anni is best so that you can maximise your self heals and Rage refunds on direct damage attacks.

 

Rely on healers to heal. And, I have extensive math backing my recommendations, what do you have? (This is rhetorical.)

[znihilist]

I am pretty content with the set bonuses right now. They were changed in 2.0 and I think they are probably one of, if not the, best in the game. Could they be better? Sure, but I do not think this is where we should ask the Devs to focus for our AC.

 

I certainly do agree that in our communications with the DEVs we shouldn't even remotely mention this as it is not important (right now).

But I really do feel that the two set bonus with the 8% damage on ravage feels rather imposed (not for Carnage at least)

[KeyboardNinja]

I certainly do agree that in our communications with the DEVs we shouldn't even remotely mention this as it is not important (right now).

But I really do feel that the two set bonus with the 8% damage on ravage feels rather imposed (not for Carnage at least)

 

All three specs use Ravage almost exactly on cooldown (though all of them have conditions under which they can and do delay it). None of the specs get a Ravage CD decrease or a damage increase, and thus the 8% damage increase from the set bonus is a straight damage increase at the same order of magnitude for all specs. Thus, a well designed set bonus.

 

The four piece is very similar. All of the specs use Berserk as soon as you have 30 stacks (with the exception of Annihilation, which will occasionally delay by a GCD). Carnage and Annihilation build Fury at nearly the same rate (Annihilation slightly faster due to the greater abundance of rage); Rage builds it the fastest due to the immense amount of available rage in the spec and the lack of basic attack usage (well, twice in a 300 second parse). Thus, the 4pc benefits Rage the most, but only by a small margin. Carnage and Annihilation also benefit immensely from it (particularly Annihilation). The reduced CD on Frenzy increases the number of Berserks in a fight, as well as slightly improving the class utility.

 

Overall, I think the marauder set bonuses are among the best in the game (with the assassin tank and merc healer set bonuses being the only serious rivals). I think bioware would be hard-pressed to improve them, given the magnitude of DPS increase they already provide.

[iprice]

Oofalong and KBN are right. Ive never heard anyone say Berserk wasnt usefull for anyspec or Ravage for that matter. Berserk may have been better for carnage before 2.0 but i think the main reason for the change to it was that with the new set bonus if you had the extra rage to burn carnage dps would be more unbalanced so it was a way to keep it together with other specs.

 

Berserk especially with the 4 set buff is amazing why would you not like a 4% buff to all damage 4 15secs a lot of the time during any fight. And it is a main part of any rotation for any marauder if you say oh not for me im sorry but you just arent doing the class right and could use a lookin at Oofalongs guide.

 

As for Ravage it is used in every spec especially carnage and an 8% flat boost to that is just amazing. Sure other things could be better but its a good balanced addition to the game.