Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Beni still waiting for your response does the KV have the GCW Pilots and captains like the rules say they should and like the rules have said they should since the start of the Kaggath or are they going to be allowed the Fel Empire pilots like YOU said they could have on post #88 and was confirmed by Rayla on Post #91 which is clear alteration and violation of the original rules set forth at the start of all of the Kaggath's or do I still not know the rules or how they have been changed in this Kaggath? Sorry if I am still coming off as a bit standoff-ish but posts like this are a pretty good reason as to why. Pretty sure she has them. The rule is meant to stop defections, so yeh, I think she's meant to have them... Seems a little odd though that we don't get to chose which ones we use... I'm fine with mine because it gives me force sensitive Naval Officers (Extra defence) but it'd be cool to have the choice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Pretty sure she has them. The rule is meant to stop defections, so yeh, I think she's meant to have them... Seems a little odd though that we don't get to chose which ones we use... I'm fine with mine because it gives me force sensitive Naval Officers (Extra defence) but it'd be cool to have the choice... yes its meant to stop defections but there, to my knowledge, was no rule about keeping the Naval forces as you see fit, just like the Rule to change a faction leader BEFORE a kaggath was so that the losers could close holes in their defenses and I doubt was ever meant for some one to be allowed to change it mid Kaggath though I am mostly ok with that one since Rayla didn't know she was allowed to start with. Its just the first rule change that's frankly upsetting because the rules were very clear about which forces she was supposed to have and the spirit of the rule is still kept with keeping the rule itself in tact with out any change. The imperial pilots of the GCW era will still not defect so there is no reason not to go with the rules as written. Edit: I don't even know why I am focusing on this honestly as my scenario doesn't need this to work and it will change little in all honesty. Edited October 13, 2013 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Hm, hm...ok seems I was summoned. O.o To defend the Imperial Commando Special Unit...not sure why, but give me a bit to do some digging/research as I don't have the sources for them in regards to what feats they have and so forth. Edited October 13, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Hm, hm...ok seems I was summoned. O.o To defend the Imperial Commando Special Unit...not sure why, but give me a bit to do some digging/research as I don't have the sources for them in regards to what feats they have and so forth. You are kinda the resident Trooper expert here, there were the Delta, Omega, Galaar squads along with the ARC Troopers, but there were a total of 1,000 other Commandos from all sorts of units and backgrounds too, including the infamous Dark Troopers, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) I will be surprised if wolf finds those 1000 Imperial commando's can take more then 5k Rebel special forces the Spec forces were not slouches and had all kinds of areas of expertise each one just as specialized around different forms of combat as any commando unit out there, and still skilled enough and trained enough to still be miles ahead of the average troop in areas that weren't their areas of expertise. Edited October 13, 2013 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 I am not saying the Rebel Special Forces are lacking, I am saying these Clone Commandos are the top notch of the top and if one squad can take down 700 droids by themselves, no matter how unrefined those droids might be, they are clearly excellently well trained. Anyway I wanted Wolf's opinion on not just the Squads and the ARC Troopers but all of the other elite Commandos that Vader hand-picked to be the best part of his legion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 I am not saying the Rebel Special Forces are lacking, I am saying these Clone Commandos are the top notch of the top and if one squad can take down 700 droids by themselves, no matter how unrefined those droids might be, they are clearly excellently well trained. Anyway I wanted Wolf's opinion on not just the Squads and the ARC Troopers but all of the other elite Commandos that Vader hand-picked to be the best part of his legion. I understand that but 1 squad is still around 10 guys and when I have listed a Spec force member able to take out 40 Storm troopers (much better then droids) single handedly you add in 10 of them that's around 400 stromtroopers in a squad I would think that the feats even themselves out nicely when comparing crème of the crop 501st vs Crème of the crop Special forces, but I will wait for wolfs assement on just how many special forces units I would need to handle those 1000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Actually Delta squad consisted of four Commandos, yes that is right, 4 commandos just like the other squads. And again, being able to compete with Imperial Commandos is one thing but the most elite commandos in the empire under one force from many many different squads and battalions is a whole other thing. Anyway we can argue this all we want i am awaiting Wolf's opinion on these guys. Edited October 13, 2013 by LadyKulvax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Actually Delta squad consisted of four Commandos, yes that is right, 4 commandos just like the other squads. And again, being able to compete with Imperial Commandos is one thing but the most elite commandos in the empire under one force from many many different squads and battalions is a whole other thing. I have understood that..... did you not see me give you the advantage in about 2-5:1 odds I am being more then generous in my assessment of the combat abilities of the 2 groups. The Special forces are an even match with the Commando's of the empire thus the Crème of the crop ones that you are bringing before me should have an advantage but not so much to come out against 100:1 odds not even close. Just being clear here its not they cant beat 100:1 odds against anything cus I think they could defeat certain droids at a rate of 1000:1 but these aren't droids or poorly trained soldiers we are talking about they are an elite combat unit going up against another elite combat unit 2-5:1 odds is more then fair. Edited October 13, 2013 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 I have understood that..... did you not see me give you the advantage in about 2-5:1 odds I am being more then generous in my assessment of the combat abilities of the 2 groups. The Special forces are an even match with the Commando's of the empire thus the Crème of the crop ones that you are bringing before me should have an advantage but not so much to come out against 100:1 odds. Unfortunately you yet assume that the Commandos have to deal with 100:1 odds, they are not fighting an outright battle but they are engaging in infiltration and sabotage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Actually Delta squad consisted of four Commandos, yes that is right, 4 commandos just like the other squads. And again, being able to compete with Imperial Commandos is one thing but the most elite commandos in the empire under one force from many many different squads and battalions is a whole other thing. Didn't one of them die in the clone wars (Or get caught in a huge explosion) after being surrounded by a few droids? Because great, they take on 700 droids, but if charged en masse by about 50, they'd have difficulty. I'm pretty sure Gregor, had one hell of a last stand against an army of droids, but what that showed was that when the droids show any kind of tactical ability (even if by accident) it's just not feasible for the clones to manage to survive... And rebels are even better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Unfortunately you yet assume that the Commandos have to deal with 100:1 odds, they are not fighting an outright battle but they are engaging in infiltration and sabotage. how are you infiltrating me exactly..... and how are they not running into gorilla warfare tactics of the 10k or more Special forces units I will have around these generators? Edited October 13, 2013 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Unfortunately you yet assume that the Commandos have to deal with 100:1 odds, they are not fighting an outright battle but they are engaging in infiltration and sabotage. And as we've seen on multiple occasions, that doesn't always work to plan. Communications stop, dead bodies are found, alarms are sounded and troops rush to defend the facilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Didn't one of them die in the clone wars (Or get caught in a huge explosion) after being surrounded by a few droids? Because great, they take on 700 droids, but if charged en masse by about 50, they'd have difficulty. I'm pretty sure Gregor, had one hell of a last stand against an army of droids, but what that showed was that when the droids show any kind of tactical ability (even if by accident) it's just not feasible for the clones to manage to survive... And rebels are even better. Yet Gregor had been out of active service for a long time and had his memory impaired, there is no real comparison to a fully active member of Delta Squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 And as we've seen on multiple occasions, that doesn't always work to plan. Communications stop, dead bodies are found, alarms are sounded and troops rush to defend the facilities. not to mention these same troops are supposedly protecting his from my own infiltration units I don't know that they can be in this many places at once.... mine can I have 100k of them but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Can we just stop? i didnt post to Wolf so you two could respark the argument i posted so i could get his opinion, that is it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Yet Gregor had been out of active service for a long time and had his memory impaired, there is no real comparison to a fully active member of Delta Squad. And the droids were vastly inferior, and there's no real comparisons to Rebel soldiers. But scaled up, you get a similar scenario to what we'll get. Also, Arc Troopers have been surrounded and nearly destroyed on multiple occasions. Just watch the rise and fall of Domino Squad, Echo died when surrounded by droids... Edited October 13, 2013 by Selenial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Can we just stop? i didnt post to Wolf so you two could respark the argument i posted so i could get his opinion, that is it. It's a valid argument, we have sources too, so no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Can we just stop? i didnt post to Wolf so you two could respark the argument i posted so i could get his opinion, that is it. this is true there is little point to this we are just going to running in circles... though I do still wish to know how the infiltration is meant to happen I had to figure that out for your forces I believe its fair game to ask the same yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 It's a valid argument, we have sources too, so no. Fine argue amongst yourselves, I will wait till I can have a proper knowledgeable opinion on their actual capabilities rather than argue over Commandos we havent even reached a conclusion over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Fine argue amongst yourselves, I will wait till I can have a proper knowledgeable opinion on their actual capabilities rather than argue over Commandos we havent even reached a conclusion over. Wolf already said he doesn't have any sourcebooks on them that are really relevant, all he can do is use Wookieepedia... So we either stop this argument entirely, or wait for Wolfs opinions whilst carrying it on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Wolf already said he doesn't have any sourcebooks on them that are really relevant, all he can do is use Wookieepedia... So we either stop this argument entirely, or wait for Wolfs opinions whilst carrying it on... he also said rebel special forces solo do to being Bad ***.... lol but I am sure he was joking and I am just going to give him time. I do feel Wolf is the armed forces expert among us so I will give him a chance and maybe post my own arguments if need be later but honestly no point debating this really at the moment if you have scenarios Selenial you can go ahead and post them I have of course already posted one and I have 2 more for later but to tired to refine them just now I need more time and to make sure the current scenarios get argued all the way through before introducing 2 more possible scenarios on the death of Krayt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Wolf already said he doesn't have any sourcebooks on them that are really relevant, all he can do is use Wookieepedia... So we either stop this argument entirely, or wait for Wolfs opinions whilst carrying it on... Never said though I don't have sources that would know however. I got ways of getting information needed. he also said rebel special forces solo do to being Bad ***.... lol but I am sure he was joking Lol, yes I was. Though I am curious as to why I am being toted as the Star Wars Trooper Expert? Edited October 13, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 Oh instead I am going to post ways to stop the virus. OK first as posted in my scenario any of the special Ops members acting as shadows to be chased can uncover this plot and thus allow me to be prepared for the Virus. Also the Cargo ships can have armed rebel troops in them (25 million is a lot of troops to spread around more then 1 mil per generator is completely pointless and ineffectual) so if even one of those probe droids get discovered then we I will have found out about the virus and can once again stop it. Also you wont have access to tapes of me destroying things because by the scenario I posted the match will be over within hours of that happening. Also with any of these means uncovering this plot I could have civilians decide to change sides. Hitting more then Brentaal and Rendili and cutting me off from my other worlds is near impossible because to get to my other worlds you have to go through Brentaal and Rendili I have interdiction ships as well with the Hapan Battle dragons and in my scenario I steal some of your ships in the initial attack using Spec Force marines who specialized in doing this while the 501st are busy with other troops. So just a few dents in your plan it doesn't require all of these things to go wrong just 1 will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Never said though I don't have sources that would know however. I got ways of getting information needed. Lol, yes I was. Though I am curious as to why I am being toted as the Star Wars Trooper Expert? because as far as I can tell most of the in-depth analysis threads and such by you have been about smaller units of warfare and we know you were the expert for Imperial Guard I guess we just figured you would know some of the rest. Edit: all joking aside though 100k rebel spec forces vs 10k 501st and 100 Krath droids+ some Arkryd industry droids..... they might just be able to solo just saying. Edited October 13, 2013 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts