Solo Queue Should Be Truly Solo...

[TridusSWTOR]

How many servers actually suffer a low population now? And if they did you can transfer off to a higher population and if you like PvP there are two high pop servers to which you can go.

 

I have never been against splitting the queues up, I think taking groups of 2/3/4 into account would take longer to assemble a team of 8 but I cant imagine they would be like queues before the first forced transfers.

 

Matchmaking is a more logical situation. Even with a split queue you will still be facing off against more experienced/geared players and I imagine a pure solo vs solo would be like 10-54 all over again which is everyman for themselves with little to no objective play and I find that more frustrating than facing a premade.

 

In reality in regards to what they do there is still going to be a clique of players who are not happy.

 

I agree with the bold, on the internet nobody can be wrong...ever. It's fun like that.

 

It's a shame that only two servers now stand as a true home for PVP.

 

On low population servers both of the solutions wouldn't work since with matchmaking you'll still get lopsided matches(something jade seems to be support) and with split queue's you won't get any matches(mostly on the premade side of things, I predict it'll be way faster to gather up solo pugs to form a match).

 

On high population, both solutions work but you can still get lopsided matches with matchmaking because nobody knows how large the skill pool a server will be able to pull from. With split queue's, you'll fix a lot of problems, if not all of them. Solo pugs won't face premades and the premades/hard-core PVP guys don't have to deal with those "dirty bad pugs" ruining their WZ experience. You can even see in this thread that some of these guys don't want to deal with them as well.

 

I would be for matchmaking, if I knew it would work but I feel the skill pool of current PVP just doesn't vary enough to warrant it as a long term solution. Matchmaking is a band-aid.

 

Cross server queue's on the other hand...well I could see PVP becoming a booming success if they put that in the game.

[Jadescythe]

How am I against PVP when I want more balanced matches than you? You only offered a broken system that will provide lopsided matches. You offer nothing else.

 

Matchmaking would work on high population servers(which is what, two right now?) but split queue's would work then as well.

 

You can look on this thread alone, people are tired of being paired with the "bad" solo pugs. A separate queue would fix this, but oh, you still need the ability to have lopsided matches when things aren't going your way.

 

Little news flash on matchmaking, if you don't think people can cheat the system, you haven't been playing multiplayer that long.

 

So where was the debunk again? Oh right, there wasn't.

 

You have been debunked. How many times was this now?

 

*Glad you support lopsided matches still*

 

The highlighted part is you talking about solo queue. Since it can easily be gamed by any group to get paired together on a low pop server. You will see ZERO difference in a solo queue other than potentially queues not popping if groups aren't gaming the system. In fact, because there are no queue pops, they will indirectly be gaming the system since queuing solo may be the only way to get a queue to pop (can't force the pugs to group up, easier to dissolve into solos).

 

You've proven nothing about matchmaking working. If you have 16 people, 8 on two factions, then it really doesn't matter what the skill is, that's your game. If some are groups and some are solo, you just don't get a game at all in solo queue.

 

Not to mention, I'm not complaining about bad solo queuers being in my warzones. I'm complaining about ALL BADS being in my warzones. As in, I don't want to carry a 4 man from the worst guild ever in a warzone either. Give me 7 other people close to the same skill level as me and put 8 people of equal skill on the other side. How they queued is unimportant to me.

 

DEBUNKED

[UncelSam]

Jadescythe:

 

Then you'll find it appealing with a queue system where you can be with your (top/best) players in your own Group fighting against others of same skill?

 

Its called Premade vs. Premade

 

And

 

the we have...

 

PUG vs PUG.

 

 

End of story

[cycao]

Jadescythe:

 

Then you'll find it appealing with a queue system where you can be with your (top/best) players in your own Group fighting against others of same skill?

 

Its called Premade vs. Premade

 

And

 

the we have...

 

PUG vs PUG.

 

 

End of story

 

You're assuming that all premades are of the same skill which is not true, the same goes for pugs. Both showcase a wide range of skill level which is why matchmaking would be the best fit instead of splitting queues.

[Jadescythe]

Jadescythe:

 

Then you'll find it appealing with a queue system where you can be with your (top/best) players in your own Group fighting against others of same skill?

 

Its called Premade vs. Premade

 

And

 

the we have...

 

PUG vs PUG.

 

 

End of story

 

You're missing the point. There are plenty of bad premades that I wouldn't want to see. Not to mention, I almost always queue alone, so I still have to see terrible PUGs in your system.

 

I'm not against a solo queue for no reason. I'm against it because it's bad for the game in many ways, including unnecessarily segmenting the population and making it more difficult for matchmaking to gather players of equal skill since they are divided.

 

Solo queue would help with issues, but it would only mitigate how often the issues happen as you will still have PUG v PUG with healers on only one team and you will still have significantly better players on one side than the other sometimes. Teams are still going to get farmed, just not as often and it won't always be the same people doing the farming.

[Arkerus]

You people who fail to comprehend the simplest of arguments need to keep your terrible opinions to yourself.

 

"Pug farming" wouldn't be a thing if some PUGs weren't so bad. If you put the best sports team in whatever sport you like the most up against 8 random people you just found, they will destroy them. The argument being made is that if you take the best sports team and put them up against the worst sports team, the same result will follow. Ergo, the group isn't the problem, the level of skill is.

 

This is what PUG farmers actually believe.

[Jadescythe]

This is what PUG farmers actually believe.

 

I farm PUGs all the time. I've got a few of the POT5 premades on farm as well. The problem with your viewpoint is that I don't premade.

[TridusSWTOR]

The highlighted part is you talking about solo queue. Since it can easily be gamed by any group to get paired together on a low pop server. You will see ZERO difference in a solo queue other than potentially queues not popping if groups aren't gaming the system. In fact, because there are no queue pops, they will indirectly be gaming the system since queuing solo may be the only way to get a queue to pop (can't force the pugs to group up, easier to dissolve into solos).

 

You've proven nothing about matchmaking working. If you have 16 people, 8 on two factions, then it really doesn't matter what the skill is, that's your game. If some are groups and some are solo, you just don't get a game at all in solo queue.

 

Not to mention, I'm not complaining about bad solo queuers being in my warzones. I'm complaining about ALL BADS being in my warzones. As in, I don't want to carry a 4 man from the worst guild ever in a warzone either. Give me 7 other people close to the same skill level as me and put 8 people of equal skill on the other side. How they queued is unimportant to me.

 

DEBUNKED

 

So you are saying it's easy to game the system with 8 different people timing there queue's and hopefully getting in the same match. As compared to our current situation of only two people needed to hit the queue button at the same time?

 

Yea...you really thought this out didn't you?

 

Glad to see you are still living in a fairy tale land that matchmaking won't be gamed by the players. It shows how inexperienced you are in multiplayer gaming. Here is a tip, do your homework and then come back to me, since this discussion has just gone above your league.

 

Little hint: Lopsided matches can happen in a matchmaking system. Too bad you still can't debunk that.

 

So, at least in this thread, this is the second time I debunked you?

 

It's becoming easier for me with each post. Even when I have to hold you're hand to continue the discussion.

 

Debunked.

[UncelSam]

You're assuming that all premades are of the same skill which is not true, the same goes for pugs. Both showcase a wide range of skill level which is why matchmaking would be the best fit instead of splitting queues.

 

Do you honestly belive that BW could create something that really could estimate your skills as a PVPer?

 

They cant even get things right as they are now!

[DerTaran]

Premades will always find a way to play together so technical solution like 'not allowing groups to list' will fail. I still think Bioware should investigate in matchmaking algorithms (and a handicap concept might be interesting to think about as well).

The problem aren't premades, the problem are guilds preferring to farm less skilled people rather than to list for ranked war zones.

Edited July 16, 2013 by DerTaran

[cycao]

Do you honestly belive that BW could create something that really could estimate your skills as a PVPer?

 

They cant even get things right as they are now!

 

Yes, yes I do. They said about 5 months back or so they are working on a matchmaking system. They already track your personal win/loss, ranked waiting, kills and mvp votes all so most of the stats are there, then they can take into account some simple gear check and bam.

[Kombatikon]

When I queue up as solo, I expect to verse other people who also queued up as solo...is that too much to ask? Why is it the system doesn't prioritize matching solo players with other players, and then purely solo teams with other solo teams? It just seems silly to me for an entirely solo team to be paired against a full premade.

 

Got to outlaws den there problem fixed isnt it ? Or u want to que solo so you dont have to go all that way ? Lazy much hmmm whats ya frakn PROBLEM!!! Or go tag someone and duel ***! Oh no thats right you want a lazy button to do all those I get ya

[vermura]

The whole problem isn't that hard to fix if both teams are the same faction. A little bit of extra logic after selecting 16 players, and you could simply do this:

 

If there is 2 groups of 4, put one on one side, and one on the other. That one fix alone would save a lot of grief.

[Jadescythe]

So you are saying it's easy to game the system with 8 different people timing there queue's and hopefully getting in the same match. As compared to our current situation of only two people needed to hit the queue button at the same time?

 

Yea...you really thought this out didn't you?

 

Glad to see you are still living in a fairy tale land that matchmaking won't be gamed by the players. It shows how inexperienced you are in multiplayer gaming. Here is a tip, do your homework and then come back to me, since this discussion has just gone above your league.

 

Little hint: Lopsided matches can happen in a matchmaking system. Too bad you still can't debunk that.

 

So, at least in this thread, this is the second time I debunked you?

 

It's becoming easier for me with each post. Even when I have to hold you're hand to continue the discussion.

 

Debunked.

 

You don't even make sense at this point. I, and most others, have already told you that we are against queuing with more than 4 at a time. I never said that queue syncing would/wouldn't be an issue on populated servers, you specifically mentioned matchmaking not working on low pop servers. Now you change the game after the last post. Make up your mind.

 

You said that matchmaking won't work on low pop servers. I showed you how a solo queue won't work on low pop servers because the premades can easily queue sync into solo. Good, we agree that low population makes for bad matches. There are 2 solutions to low pop servers, neither of which is particularly appealing atm. Cross server is ideal, but also a pipe dream. The interim is transferring to a populated server, but that is extremely cost prohibitive. Either way, your solo queue or my match making isn't going to solve their problem, but Bioware will not implement a solution on some servers and not others. Meaning my solution actually lets games happen and will function where it can and yours prevents games from happening altogether on low pop servers, especially at off hours.

 

There are 3 ways to game matchmaking. Either you can intentionally lose to drop your rating, which means you are getting next to no rewards, you can group with people far above/below your level to game your rating (especially by using new or alt toons) or you can have someone else play for you (LoL style) to inflate your rating and then continuously lose until you're back where you're supposed to be. All these can be mitigated by having a good system for adjusting ratings and proper monitoring in place (account sharing is already against ToS).

 

Back to my original post that you skimmed, it is far easier for 4 players to game a solo queue than it is to go through the work of adjusting your rating up or down based on your feelings that day. Feel like queuing up together to fight PUGs today? Queue sync it up. Feel like fighting bad players today? Spend a few weeks dropping your rating. Which one sounds easier?

 

Maybe don't take everything I say and apply it to different situations than I have said it in and I'll start caring what you say. Maybe stop being a total loser to everyone who posts in any thread and I'll stop treating you like you're twelve. There is a reason my posts in reply to yours are the only ones that have a negative attitude, you're a negative person and bring nothing of value to any discussion that we try to have and you follow that up by telling everyone else how all they do is insult people and have no argument. I'm not sure why I even bothered responding to your post in this thread after I was doing so well ignoring you in the other. I'll just go back to that.

 

Good day, sir.

[Avicii]

Its sorta a catch 22. If you solo queue enough you run into good 4 mans with Tank/Healer/2 DPS that just **** **** up which can be frustrating but you just need to get out of their queue sync, wait 5 mins requeue.

 

The real issue is the idiots on your own team, at some point it becomes frustrating that they cant handle simple tasks to even attempt to win once your patience wears thin you group up eventually forming a good 4 man. At this point you start to just steam roll pugs, which isnt fun either because we PvP for the competition and that isnt competition. The other option is get into RWZs which is great for some but for others they get their **** pushed in so they go back to stomping pugs in 4 mans cause that's funner then getting their own **** pushed in repeatedly.

 

Whats the point idk just felt like rambling on the topic.

 

There has been no response from BW on the issue which seems clear they have no desire to make a change to this, what they should do is follow through with the original implementation of RWZs which was to include a solo queue that would solve part of the problem allowing people to queue for solo RWZs if you enter under geared or no gear I would expect verbal assault though lol.

[SajPl]

The real issue is the idiots on your own team

 

Yes this is the real issue and problem of most people who want to blame their losses on other things when in trouth they are just the horrorshows dragging every-single-team that they are on down to a wipe.