Star Wars, and the clean energy issues of City Planets

[Beniboybling]

Actually Corsair was created during the Great Hyperspace War that you were so determined proved that technology had progressed by leaps and bounds. Ironically since Corsair rips the cores out of Stars, that also means that Corsair has a Hyperspace Drive, a Navicomputer, and a Deflector Shield strong enough to withstand the Tidal Forces of a Star becoming a black hole and engines strong enough to get it into Hyperspace despite said star collapsing in on itself...

 

You mean "The Celestials predate all other civilzations other than the Columi." Which is debatable because the Columi by your own argument (timeline stating that life first evolved in 5,000,000,000 BBY according to Wookiepedia) evolved 1,000,000 years before the first mention of the Celestials on that same timeline. Granted if we want to get strict, the ancestors of the Chevin predate even the Columi. In fact the first mention of the Celestials on the Galactic Timeline, is when they go into a self-imposed exile and create the Corellian System in 1,000,000 BBY. The Columi had already mastered Interstellar Spaceflight by then. But it is at least possible that both civilizations had roughly the same level of technology for roughly the same length of time.

I actually meant to put the Corsair in there but whatever. With only point-defense turrets and no deflector shields (just really thick armor it would seem) I doubt it would last very long against a Star Destroyer. It seems to have a navicomputer which is strange as according to the Essential Atlas they were only introduced around the Mandalorian Wars.

 

As for the Columi, I'm not sure that's correct. They certainly coexisted with the Celestials but I'm fairly sure that the Celestials were the very first. Given what it says on Wookieepedia:

 

The Celestials, also known as the Architects, were an ancient civilization who were present long before the dawn of the galactic community and even the Rakatan Infinite Empire...

 

...They were considered one of the earliest and most potent cultures of their time that were identified by the colossal objects they had left behind.

 

Not that this has much relevance to the debate.

Do you even know what a navigational computer is? That thing you use in your car to navigate (GPS) is a navigational computer. Or rather the satellite it connects to is. Fact is, we all have access to Navicomputers here on Earth and we haven't even broken Earth's Orbit with manned spacecraft yet. To assume that the people in Star Wars were able to travel to other stars without a computer capable of telling them where a given planet is is ludicrous. And hell, even if they are using Hyperspace Beacons, the computers used to track those Hyperspace Beacons and plot a course based on them, are Navigational Computers!!!!! Not to mention, they had to get to the locations that they planted the Hyperspace Beacons at in the first place, which implies some sort of navigational computer to begin with.

In our galaxy, yes that's what it is. But GPS systems used to navigate roads are not the same as navigation systems used to navigate space. Its a entirely different ball park, most notably requiring vastly larger amounts of information. Now I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on the history of navcomputers but according to the Essential Atlas they were introduced during the Mandalorian Wars, replacing the hyperspace beacons. Not that this is crux of my argument or anything, its just an example of tech that was invented post-Hyperspace War. Whether that's accurate or not I can't say, but TBH I don't much care *shrug*

I will concede that within the humanoid civilizations there has been a bit of innovation since the Great Hyperspace War, assuming you concede that over the span of 5,000 years that innovation has not amounted to very much. In fact in the time it took the Empire to build the Death Star much of the rest of the Galaxy appears to have gone bankrupt (probably for very good reasons seeing as how it would cost us in the real world more capital than exists in the entire world to even build the infrastructure of the Death Star, and that is ignoring the weapons, computers, and all the other technological goodies that the Death Star is chock full of).

Credits are largely irrelevant concerning technological advancements, no the Death Star is not mass producible, but it is a superweapon. And yes, compared to our own advancements they are slow, but they do happen, and the technological level of the Galactic Empire is vastly superior to that of the Galactic Republic of the Great Hyperspace War. And given that the Draggluch Period set the galaxy back to Hyperspace War levels I'd say 2,000 years is more accurate.

[XantosCledwin]

I actually meant to put the Corsair in there but whatever. With only point-defense turrets and no deflector shields (just really thick armor it would seem) I doubt it would last very long against a Star Destroyer. It seems to have a navicomputer which is strange as according to the Essential Atlas they were only introduced around the Mandalorian Wars.

 

In defense of the Navicomputers being on ships prior to the Mandalorian Wars, I would point to Captain Yaru Korsin's ship the Sith Dreadnaught Omen. This vessel had among its crew compliment a Ships Navigator who I would assume was doing more than simply looking for Hyperspace Beacons. Especially since the Omen was tasked with transporting important cargo to the Sith Region of Space, which is treacherous enough to do under normal circumstances, not to mention while under fire from enemies. Which is how the ship got into a hyperspace accident that ended up with the ship lost, and fatally damaged on an uncharted planet in the middle of Wild Space.

 

As for the Columi, I'm not sure that's correct. They certainly coexisted with the Celestials but I'm fairly sure that the Celestials were the very first. Given what it says on Wookieepedia:

 

"The Celestials, also known as the Architects, were an ancient civilization who were present long before the dawn of the galactic community and even the Rakatan Infinite Empire...

 

...They were considered one of the earliest and most potent cultures of their time that were identified by the colossal objects they had left behind."

 

If you actually read what you are quoting it says:

 

A. The Celestials were ancient (I agree)

B. The Celestials were present long before the Galactic Community (I agree)

C. They were considered ONE of the earliest civilizations (I agree)

 

What this does not say is that they were not the only civilization present long before the rise of the Galactic Community. What it is referring to as a Galactic Community basically refers to either a formalized Republic of Systems or an Empire controlling systems. The first of which was the Rakata Infinite Empire.

 

 

In our galaxy, yes that's what it is. But GPS systems used to navigate roads are not the same as navigation systems used to navigate space. Its a entirely different ball park, most notably requiring vastly larger amounts of information. Now I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on the history of navcomputers but according to the Essential Atlas they were introduced during the Mandalorian Wars, replacing the hyperspace beacons. Not that this is crux of my argument or anything, its just an example of tech that was invented post-Hyperspace War. Whether that's accurate or not I can't say, but TBH I don't much care *shrug*

 

It's not a different ballpark if what you say about Hyperspace Beacons is true, because essentially all a hyperspace beacon would end up being is a spacebound GPS Satellite. Also, did you know that at the current time we have a high enough computer processing power in an everyday household laptop to chart the movements of all the stars in the Milky Way Galaxy. What we do not have is the capability to chart these changes in real time from earth due to the fact that all light that we see from the stars here on earth is actually thousands upon millions of years old. The same problem would be true of any Navigational Computer in the Star Wars universe. Any attempt to navigate a Galaxy using real time data would not work. Hyperspace as postulated in Star Wars cannot work.

 

Credits are largely irrelevant concerning technological advancements, no the Death Star is not mass producible, but it is a superweapon. And yes, compared to our own advancements they are slow, but they do happen, and the technological level of the Galactic Empire is vastly superior to that of the Galactic Republic of the Great Hyperspace War. And given that the Draggluch Period set the galaxy back to Hyperspace War levels I'd say 2,000 years is more accurate.

 

I think you misunderstood. The reason the Deathstar is not mass producible is not because the technology is hard to make. It is because of the price tag attached to the technology. As of 2012, it was estimated that if humans were to replicate the infrastructure (the hull, catwalks, and other physical parts of the Death Star) without replicating the technological doodads (computers, tractor beams, super lasers, etc...) it would cost us $852,000,000,000,000,000.00 US Dollars to do so. That is more than 13,000 times the total worldwide GDP as of 2012. We simply cannot afford to make the Death Star.

 

The fact that the Galactic Empire was somehow able to afford a building project to create not one, but THREE of these monstrosities of technology, two of which were created in roughly the span of 3 years (oh yeah forgot to mention that the same article that determined how much it would cost also determined that it would take us 833,315 years to produce enough steel to finish the project) implies that they were taxing the hell out of their citizens.

 

And you wonder why people rebelled...

Edited June 4, 2013 by XantosCledwin